Sony F35 which recorder?

Hi Krzystof

I believe you need the Samurai to work with the F35, as from memory the blade only has HDMI inputs - the F35 has HD-SDI.

But you do not need a recorder which does 12-bit 4:4:4, very few do. You can record 8-bit 4:2:2 up to 10-bit 4:4:4 depending on what your recorder takes.
 
I use the older Samurai and it works with zero problems. I record to 10-bit 422 DNxHD at 220mbs. I could also get ProRes, but I stick with DNxHD instead. The Blade will do just fine with the F35.
 
https://www.cinema5d.com/news/?p=24849

So I am having a hard time finding others referencing this "12-bit Raw" that the new 4k Shogun is capable of, but it might be interesting if this is true. Although you'd be filling up the SSD fast, maybe having the option to do 12 bit uncompressed video for super high end work, but I imagine this recorder can also handle the plain 10 bit 422 that seems to work so well out of the F35 and is great for 90% of the work we are doing with the F35. I mean honestly, worry about upgrading from the Nikon lens mount before 12-bit could make any possible difference, but in this 4k world, saying the F35 can record 12 bit 444 gives it the buzz words to impress the 4k monkeys.
 
I use the Gemini 444 without any hiccups and the uncompressed 10bit 444 DPX I think is the best quality footage you can get out of the F35 besides 12 bit 444. The original HDCAM SR deck can only record 10bit 444 only to 880mbps maximum. The Gemini footage has bitrates in the 1300mbps range.

Funny thing is that with the latest firmware the Gemini DOES detect the 12-bit input from the F35, but doesn't support recording it. I believe the Gemini can record 12bit 444 dpx out of the C500 and more than 1 time in the manual 12-bit recording capability was mentioned.

Mitch Gross and Dan Keaton, can you please enlighten me upon this matter. It's not that I need 12 bit but it would be a nice thing to have just in case :)
 
I also use the Gemini too, it's a reliable, solid, lightweight recorder, 10bit DPXs look awesome. One of the best recorders for the F35 that doesn't consume much power.
I've never been able to record any of the 12 bit flavors either, the signal does come through on-screen, but it doesn't record. :(
Was hoping Convergent would update the firmware to allow for it, but it seems like the Gemini has been end of lifed in terms of software development, their primary focus seems to have shifted towards the Odyssey
 
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I use and have been totally happy with the Pix 240i. Rarely do I need to go 12 bit 444 but it's nice to have the only recorder with the option for when I do. Plus, it takes care of my monitoring and audio recording needs. Why isn't it more popular?
 
Hunter,

Do you record prores with the pix? What do you do about the 107% white? What is the process to make sure this doesn't get clipped. What multiplexer have you used? I know Macgregor uses DPX to avoid Pro Res clipping problems, just curious if you have a good workflow for shooting 12 bit , 107% SLOG and delivering a video with proper color and full latitude.

I agree that the 7Q has taken over the conversation as the recorder of choice for the F35, when in fact the Pix is more desirable. I think the retail price is just too high when the F35 is going for around 5k, people want to spend 1k on their recorder, not over 2k. That being said, the non -i version shows up on ebay for $1500~1800
 
Yachacha, frankly I've not had a problem with the 107% whites. No clipping. I know others had, but I get the full meal deal. I think it could have been fixed in a firmware update.

Here's my workflow:
Pix in any ProRes flavor
cut in FCPX or Premiere without transcoding (we're auditioning Premiere and thinking of switching)
Take the cut sequence into Resolve for LUT and adjustments.

While its it's true that the Pix is an extra $4k, plus the Aja multiplexer (which can easily be found on eBay at a discount), but it's a pro solution. I also like that I don't have to pay extra for different codecs. The 7Q screen is drool worthy, no doubt, and I wish the Pix had waveforms. Otherwise, it's pretty perfect.
 
I have been working with a Pix 240i on a project for some time and unfortunately the one we have is a total POS. It randomly glitches recordings, without telling you, meaning we have had to play back nearly every take we have done.

Not helped by the fact that Shure have told us the unit is "fine", when it clearly isn't. The screen on the thing is not great, it is quite light, but sadly the above issue have kinda ruled it out for us. When it works, it works fine, but it doesn't even tell us when there has been a problem and we have lost a lot of takes to this bugger.

I am sure my experience is an exception not the rule, but still it is a PITA.
 
It randomly glitches recordings, without telling you, meaning we have had to play back nearly every take we have done.
--- update to latest firmware & use SSD with pix caddy-(not cf)
I use a 240 - all good here.
Sony F3 - 3G - Pro-Res 444
 
ChristianMoriarty said:
It randomly glitches recordings, without telling you, meaning we have had to play back nearly every take we have done.
--- update to latest firmware & use SSD with pix caddy-(not cf)
I use a 240 - all good here.
Sony F3 - 3G - Pro-Res 444
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We have, and we are.

The one we have is just a duff one, sadly a combination of production being a bit odd and the supplier being a bit awkward mean we haven't had it replaced.
 
yachacha said:
I agree that the 7Q has taken over the conversation as the recorder of choice for the F35, when in fact the Pix is more desirable. I think the retail price is just too high when the F35 is going for around 5k,
Click to expand...

Where can you buy a F35 for $5k? Tell me and I will buy it. Can't find any prices near that.
 
SJX said:
Where can you buy a F35 for $5k? Tell me and I will buy it. Can't find any prices near that.
Click to expand...
That's what I was thinking!

Mind you, if you look at "Sold Listings" on ebay, there is one F35 body that went for under 4k, but it had no viewfinder, no IF box, no assistant panel, no top plate... nada. Most of us wouldn't consider that to a be a turn-key setup, so I don't think it should really count as "the F35 going for around 5k".

Now, there is a listing with viewfinder and IF box for around $8,100 on Ebay. But that's not 5k either.

In the past, I did see a couple go for close to 5k at auction direct from the rental houses (not ebay). And I actually bought mine for around $5.5k... but only after intense haggling - and I also have put money into it since then - spare parts, a hard case, custom machined plates...

Also, there may be as few as 213 of these cameras in the world - certainly there are far fewer of them than the RED systems - and just because you saw one go for a certain price in the past isn't a guarantee that it'll be available for that price presently. Supply/demand economics get wonky when the supply is low.

Also, I don't really think it's a fair linkage between the camera cost and the recorder cost. To the exent the F35 is now cheap, it does mean that more of the new owner operators will be satisfied with the basic output modes, particularly when using them represents a cost savings both in the recorder package and in the storage media. Afterall, not everyone needs 12bit RGB 444.

But if you do want the specialty outputs from the F35 (RGB 444, 50p), the cost of a recorder capable of capturing these inputs has come down drastically from the past. And sure, it might sting a bit to pay an extra $3,000+ on top of the camera cost to get those features, but as long as the clients pay for it over time in your rates, it's justifiable. And it's all cheaper than it ever was before now.
 
I'm one of those who doesn't feel the strongest pull to get 444 12-bit, especially not at the prices currently available. Those extra bits just aren't worth $2-3k more to me. 10-bit 422 is plenty for what I do. But I'd like the 50p capability. So I'm keeping a curious eye on the pending Atomos Shogun monitor/recorder. It's main selling point is that it's 4k (whatever). What interests me is that it can allegedly take a 50p 1080 signal at 10-bit 422 DNxHD/ProRes. With the 7" monitor, wavform and exposure tools, ability to use off the shelf SSDs and a projected street price of under $2k.. it has me curious. Supposed to ship later this year. I really like my Samurai and I've had good luck with Atomos products before. We'll see. Until then the Samurai does the trick for my line of work.
 
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