Sony A7SIII = $3500, 10-bit 4K120p internal, 16-bit 4K60p RAW out

NorBro said:
Lights in those cases are okay; no one's going to go insane making sure every light bulb in the room isn't overexposed.

Same with your thoughts on the sun...you will have to let it go some days, lol.
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That might be ok if you can arrange nice roll-off. I've seen so many shots with horribly blown out sconces and surrounding wall, or horribly blown out candles - not just the tips but the whole section at the top. They're literally some of the ugliest things I've ever seen

HLG is a good option if you need SOOC in such cases
 
Highlights are some of the details of polish that finish a presentation. Like the others, if marginalized there is no point of cinematography.
 
Tom Roper said:
Highlights are some of the details of polish that finish a presentation. Like the others, if marginalized there is no point of cinematography.
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The worst is when someone takes a shot of a bride walking down the aisle in a beautiful, white, highlight-clipped dress. They should get jail time for that
 
Bassman2003 said:
I am closer! I love the Canon colors and the still capabilities but I really like having and XLR unit to interface with the camera (as the Panny GH series has). No, it is not as good as a dedicated recorder, but it is very convenient and good enough quality. So the Sony having this is a huge plus for me. If Canon chose to utilize their hot shoe XLR unit I would lean towards the R5. But they probably won't. I want an all around workhorse camera for handheld, gimbal as well as tripod produced stuff to replace my GH5. Wish I could stay in the same brand for lenses which makes me wish for the Canon. Complex decisions unless you just want to buy everything!
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This ^. And even more so when the new K3M + A7siii combo give you 3 audio sources. Very compact Op Doc set up for 2 lavs and one camera shot gun. I planned for an all Canon second unit set up together with a C300m2, but the that Sony-combo is very tempting. Small, practical and great DR.
 
Bassman2003 said:
I am closer! I love the Canon colors and the still capabilities but I really like having and XLR unit to interface with the camera (as the Panny GH series has). No, it is not as good as a dedicated recorder, but it is very convenient and good enough quality. So the Sony having this is a huge plus for me. If Canon chose to utilize their hot shoe XLR unit I would lean towards the R5. But they probably won't. I want an all around workhorse camera for handheld, gimbal as well as tripod produced stuff to replace my GH5. Wish I could stay in the same brand for lenses which makes me wish for the Canon. Complex decisions unless you just want to buy everything!
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But can a DSLR or mirrorless really be an all around workhorse camera? I don't know. Miles vary, but when I think of an all around workhorse type of camera I think of something like a FS5, EVA-1 or even DVX200. With a DSLR or mirrorless you are sacrificing a lot just for size and weight. Then you end up weighing it down and growing it anyway with a rig just to make it into a real video camera. And you are still stuck with external NDs, adapters, external recorders for less compression etc.

With a a FS5, EVA-1 or DVX200 you are still sacrificing something, such as image quality, mojo etc compared to the big boy cameras like F35, Alexa and Venice. But at least they are practical out of the box and still small enough for gimbal and other stuff.
 
Sttratos said:
But can a DSLR or mirrorless really be an all around workhorse camera?
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Yes, a dslr/mirrorless can be an all-around workhorse camera. You will have to rig it up in various ways, but it has more possible configurations than a camera that is more built up to begin with.

Using vari-NDs and running audio to camera through a mixer are not dealbreakers. Many cine cameras dont have internal ND, anyway.

As for codecs - the A7SIII has virtually the same internal codecs as the FX9.

If you primarily shoot ENG, then I think you put a premium on having an A camera that is fast and fuss-free to deploy as a handheld/shoulder-mounted camera with internal ND and XLR inputs.

But if you shoot a mix of formats, then its disadvantages as an ENG camera may be outweighed by its advantages elsewhere.

Personally, I'm buying an A7SIII as a gimbal/B-cam to go with my FS7. But sometimes I will need a small, discreet camera as my A or only camera, and sometimes my gimbal rig will be my A or only camera.
 
Sttratos said:
But can a DSLR or mirrorless really be an all around workhorse camera? I don't know. Miles vary, but when I think of an all around workhorse type of camera I think of something like a FS5, EVA-1 or even DVX200. With a DSLR or mirrorless you are sacrificing a lot just for size and weight. Then you end up weighing it down and growing it anyway with a rig just to make it into a real video camera. And you are still stuck with external NDs, adapters, external recorders for less compression etc.

With a a FS5, EVA-1 or DVX200 you are still sacrificing something, such as image quality, mojo etc compared to the big boy cameras like F35, Alexa and Venice. But at least they are practical out of the box and still small enough for gimbal and other stuff.
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We all do different types of work. I also have Panny "video" cameras for certain types of jobs. I am not a filmmaker per say, as many are on this site. I need a larger sensor camera to fill a role in my lineup, and that role is pretty varied. Something like a C-Series camera would be way overkill on the spend for me. Plus, I see those larger style big chip cameras as quite limiting for a OMB shooter as they do not have IBIS and are a little too heavy for smaller gimbals. So it is a niche. Pretty much the definition of a hybrid camera's usage is what I am looking for. The R5 & R6 nailed it for me outside of Canon messing it up! The A7SIII is great but my second choice out of necessity.
 
SJX said:
This has a very video look. Is it just settings or BM 6K has that look? One thing about BM cameras was always they didn't look like film as F35 or Alexa but also didn't look like video like Panasonic, Canon and Sony do. But this looks like video. Settings then or the 6K is a BM camera that looks like video?
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The intent of posting it was a rebuttal to the notion that highlight detail of practical lighting doesn't matter in cinema. By only seeing the demonstration through the lens of cinematic interpretation, you proved his point.
 
:grin:

Overexposure in Hollywood exists if you really pay attention (bits and pieces in movies, and of course not in all of them).

They let it go...it's too much trying to control every single little detail for something 99% do not care about it, or will ever even notice unless you literally take your finger and touch the screen and show them what you are talking about.

"Here...see this? It's completely white, that's bad."
 
Hah, forget the overexposed/blown highlights. The errors are strewn about in many a production. I mean, there are shots with jeans wearing crew members in a period epic. If you caught that, I'd call that "Levi's peeping".
 
Bassman2003 said:
Another nice review video. He shoots a lot in "Standard" mode and the color/image looks very nice. So maybe the LUT game does not need to be played so much?
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this review is great but man, am I the only person that feels like theres something missing here? these shots just feel like "video" instead of "film" and i can't really put my finger on it..

esp some of the outdoor shots at 2:40
 
NorBro said:
:grin:

Overexposure in Hollywood exists if you really pay attention (bits and pieces in movies, and of course not in all of them).

They let it go...it's too much trying to control every single little detail for something 99% do not care about it, or will ever even notice unless you literally take your finger and touch the screen and show them what you are talking about.

"Here...see this? It's completely white, that's bad."
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It exists even if you don't pay attention.

To take it further re blown highlights, it's not only a matter of "blown highlights are bad but no one will care". It can also be "that looks great" despite being a nuclear blob (it looks great because it's a nuclear blob). Or adding elements to clip on purpose.

My point is sometimes it's about effort ($) on a tight shooting schedule but sometimes it's about putting in more work to add blown highlights which will contribute to the aesthetic.

I get DR/highlights are important but at the prosumer level it gets tiresome hearing the mantra that hot spots are only something to avoid.

Check out Radiohead - Daydreaming, as well as the opening shot, the parking garage sequence from 03:17 - 03:56 - amazing (or ugly clipped mess)!

 
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rob norton said:
To take it further re blown highlights, it's not only a matter of "blown highlights are bad but no one will care". It can also be "that looks great" despite being a nuclear blob (it looks great because it's a nuclear blob). Or adding elements to clip on purpose.
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Ultimately, one wants options. It's better to have a camera that can retain the highlight if desired. You can always clip it in post or with a more contrasty profile. If the camera has insufficient DR, then you only have one option.

Furthermore, it's always going to look ugly to have a sharp outline at the edge of the clipped part of the frame. That visual effect will find very little demand. Your Radiohead example has a much smoother/softer effect to the overexposure transitions
 
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rob norton said:
It exists even if you don't pay attention.

To take it further re blown highlights, it's not only a matter of "blown highlights are bad but no one will care". It can also be "that looks great" despite being a nuclear blob (it looks great because it's a nuclear blob). Or adding elements to clip on purpose.

My point is sometimes it's about effort ($) on a tight shooting schedule but sometimes it's about putting in more work to add blown highlights which will contribute to the aesthetic.

I get DR/highlights are important but at the prosumer level it gets tiresome hearing the mantra that hot spots are only something to avoid.
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Are you supporting my thoughts?...I'm the one saying they are fine. :)

Although I don't know how many times productions actually make an effort to include blown areas on purpose. Like...if you require overexposure, you can create it and fine-tune it in post.

If they add to the production, that's fine - but I don't obsess about light bulbs or candles being blown out under normal circumstances. People are so focused on the talent and a good story and the camera movement and audio and everything else, it's the last thing anyone sees.

There is a difference between perfection...and just a waste of time because the "art" of the craft has affected common sense.
 
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NorBro said:
There is a difference between perfection...and just a waste of time because the "art" of the craft has affected your common sense.
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...different goals for different shoots...

Here's someone you'll listen to:

. Candle flames, for example, tend to lose their color and can clip out very quickly and look unnatural. So, what I came up with as a solution, specifically because there are candles in every shot, was to expose from the top down.

My starting point was not to over expose the candles in the HDR grade and let everything fall in underneath that. Since candles are usually the brightest object in the scene and I wanted to retain detail in them I began by setting the exposure so that the candles weren’t clipping with everything else being lit up to those levels.
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https://nofilmschool.com/the-great-john-brawley

In my experience - when candles are a centerpiece on a table setting, they look really nasty blown out. They're a decorative element, and detail should be retained. HLG is usually enough DR to balance the candle flames with the table they are illuminating.
 
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