NorBro
Major Contributor
Yeah, you could...as he and everyone else also mentions stopping down as it's the only answer, but I might not want to do that.
Even 3200 looked questionable.
16000 is beautiful.
Native ISO is 640 in Log.
Sony A7SIII = $3500, 10-bit 4K120p internal, 16-bit 4K60p RAW out
- Thread starter ahalpert
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Yeah, you could...as he and everyone else also mentions stopping down as it's the only answer, but I might not want to do that.
Even 3200 looked questionable.
16000 is beautiful.
Native ISO is 640 in Log.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
I think it's a good trade off. Usually you're either in daylight and 640 is if anything too bright. Or you're underlit and 16000 is a godsend.
So maybe the answer is to keep your variable ND on for moderately lit interiors when you're forced to jump to 16000 but would prefer 6400?
I'll admit, having a donut hole in the ISO range is weird. But it seems like a small price to pay to have such usable 16000
NorBro
Major Contributor
Yeah, I do think the advantage of 16000 is more of an overall positive although it could be a lot even being underlit, IMO - but not being able to gently boost to 6400+ for that extra bit when you need it without it presumably introducing noise is very limiting as well.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
Oh yeah well for doc forget it, the A7S3 is a tremendous win. Grug seemed to be talking about crewed scripted content.
I shoot a lot of weddings and the A7S3 is going to shine. I'd say 75% of my colleagues in that field have already gone to sony for low-light and AF but I've stuck to Panasonic for the codecs and video features, especially since I shoot a lot of other doc/corporate/commercial/narrative/MV stuff. I think the A7S3 is going to deliver for me on basically everything. 8K and internal RAW be damned.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
It depends on your environment and what stop you'd like to live at. Keeping on a variable ND may help you swing between 16000 and 3200 or wherever you'd like to live down low.
Also, if you're not shooting s-log, I believe the native ISO is 3 stops lower? So your higher native ISO if you want to deliver SOOC would be 2000
NorBro
Major Contributor
Not to extend this too much because it really doesn't need any more analysis and the camera is really great - but no, what you're saying wouldn't work for me. At events, indoors, I'm not using ND and mostly shooting at 1600 with a fast lens but sometimes you move to a different part of the floor with lighting in a disadvantageous position and would like to boost it a bit to 3200 or 6400 on the fly, maybe more.
I could change to 16,000 and put on the ND to keep my 1.4/1.8 DOF, but not ideal. I just want a little extra brightness from a setting on the camera with a quick thumb movement as I move around.
I could change to 16,000 and put on the ND to keep my 1.4/1.8 DOF, but not ideal. I just want a little extra brightness from a setting on the camera with a quick thumb movement as I move around.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
https://www.newsshooter.com/2020/07/29/more-sony-a7s-iii-footage/
"Yoshihiro said that image noise from the α7S III rises rapidly once the ISO is raised, but the moment the noise level reaches the high-sensitivity region, the noise level suddenly drops. When he compared the image quality in post, he found that the amount of noise was comparable to the low sensitivity region, and at the same time, the color information was also comparable.
Another reason why he feels that the α7S III is a very practical camera is that it deals with thermal problems very well. He also said that while it does depends on the environment you are working in he was able to record 4K 120p intermittently for a total of 5 hours without any overheating issues.
He was also very impressed with the touch autofocus performance and he even commented that it was convenient to be able to control the AF remotely on a tablet using the Imaging Edge Mobile app."
Ok take my frigging money already
"Yoshihiro said that image noise from the α7S III rises rapidly once the ISO is raised, but the moment the noise level reaches the high-sensitivity region, the noise level suddenly drops. When he compared the image quality in post, he found that the amount of noise was comparable to the low sensitivity region, and at the same time, the color information was also comparable.
Another reason why he feels that the α7S III is a very practical camera is that it deals with thermal problems very well. He also said that while it does depends on the environment you are working in he was able to record 4K 120p intermittently for a total of 5 hours without any overheating issues.
He was also very impressed with the touch autofocus performance and he even commented that it was convenient to be able to control the AF remotely on a tablet using the Imaging Edge Mobile app."
Ok take my frigging money already
ahalpert
Major Contributor
Understood. But if the 16000 is good enough I would just use a variable nd to bring the exposure back down and then dial it back up with the filter when I move to a darker spot. Ymmv
Peter C.
Veteran
I was watching a comparison video of these two cameras and one thing that reminded me of was a wedding reception ruined by rolling led light banding. You can see it at 7:36 in the video. Its bad for both cameras, worse for the Sony (as bad as what happened to me). https://youtu.be/b_hp7HYDveQ I don't know if it was my bad luck but I never hear people talking about this.
As far as ND filters. Yeah standard approach is variable nd filter for outdoor shooting. You have to remember to take them on and off and gets expensive if you film with multiple cameras and lenses. Matt Johnson uses the magnetic ones which is a good trick to use them quickly.
As far as ND filters. Yeah standard approach is variable nd filter for outdoor shooting. You have to remember to take them on and off and gets expensive if you film with multiple cameras and lenses. Matt Johnson uses the magnetic ones which is a good trick to use them quickly.
NorBro
Major Contributor
Oh, I see what you're saying. That is what people did with the a7S and its native ISO 3200 (and a7SII 1600 too).
I would have to be positive NR is off and/or no detail is lost compared to 640 (but it's possible as an ~5 stop difference isn't difficult to manage with ND although I still wouldn't be using my thumb to quickly do it).
I know that might sound too picky but it's in the top reasons I use these cameras; incredibly blazing fast operation and controlling them with your fingertips.
Trek of Joy
Member
I'm really surprised there's not more chatter about ProRes raw with the a7s3 + Ninja V, raw will be available up to 4k60p. This is basically the smallest, most cost effective option for HD/4k raw video if you want great AF. And its a little more edit friendly than the R5's 8k - as long as you're a FCPx user. Glad I picked up a Ninja V when they were on sale a couple months back. I won't use it much, but it will be nice for those golden hour sunrise/sunset shots when the clouds and sky erupt with color.
https://www.atomos.com/press-releases/atomos-announces-SonyA7S-NinjaV-PRR
Chris
https://www.atomos.com/press-releases/atomos-announces-SonyA7S-NinjaV-PRR
Chris
G
Guest
Guest
that is a good option.
Also, iso16,000 is only about 2 and 1/3 stops bright than iso3200.
So, could make for an easy transition. plus, it opens up low light slomo.
And there is the ability to go below native iso in slog3. one reviewer got slog3 to go to iso150, and that will be an interesting option if implemented well.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
I'm sure there's some loss of DR going below native but probably not too terrible. And you're probably distributing mad stops to your shadows.
But hey, flexibility is nice.
To NorBro's point about ISOs - agreed, limitations are no fun. I was just brainstorming workarounds.
And as far as low-light slow-mo - that was why I bought an S1 when the GH5 was working fine for me. I started getting hired a lot by a new wedding company that likes 60p for almost everything, and trying to get the shutter down to 1/120 on a dark dance floor with the GH5 was basically impossible. The S1 basically gave me all I needed at ISO 25k or 50k but I'd love for it to be even cleaner
ahalpert
Major Contributor
You are very right, it's a point that has generated less excitement than one would expect. I'm not sure I'll ever take advantage of it, but I think ProRes raw is cool.
I think the S1H and the R5 desensitized people to how cool the a7s3 features are. Recent headline for illustration:
ahalpert
Major Contributor
Yeah I dont know if the A7S3 has synchro scan, which is probably what you need to fix this. It probably doesn't. I usually just play with my shutter speed and sometimes find a speed that removes it or at least diminishes it.
It's a problem with more and more of these venues installing LEDs that are absolutely not flicker free. I get the same rolling bands problem on all my cameras.
The A7S3 looks worse than the canon there but it could be in part because it's more detailed/not line skipping or pixel binning. I wouldn't read too much into that.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
Agreed, but compared to 1600 since you said that's where you usually start. I need to look more closely at how bad the noise is in the 3200-6400 range.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
Oh hey - if you "are" a student, you can get $350 off the A7S3 at B&H via educational discount - https://www.sonyalpharumors.com/you-save-349-on-the-new-sony-a7siii-if-you-qualify-for-bhphoto-edu/
joema
Active member
It's not limited to FCPX. ProRes RAW is supported right now in Premiere, Edius and Baselight, and will be supported soon in Avid. I tested DCI 4k 1,000 mbps ProRes RAW HQ from a Sony FS5 via a Shogun Inferno in Premiere 14.3.0 (on Mac), and it seemed to work fine. Performance was excellent - much smoother than most 4k H264 codecs I've edited in Premiere.
Details from Adobe:
https://helpx.adobe.com/x-productkb/multi/prores-raw-support-adobe-video-applications.html
Me thinks it has to be either below C300MKII or above C500 MKII. So, either ~ $7,500 or $25,000. And the oldest current EF mount camera is C100MKII and the second oldest is C200. So, if something new comes out, it could replace both of them in RF.
It's very unlikely to be 8K and, judging from the existing products, a quite useful 5.5K sensor off 1D XMKIII and R6 (it's the same sensor) would be deployed for the third time.
And feature-wise, a high bit rate XAVC at 480 Mbps (something R6 doesn't have), plus a fairly typical feature set at that price range.
Or they could surprise us all.
Or they could disappoint us all.
Or they could tack on a free pressure cooker with both R5 and R6.
Who knows.