some 29.97 some 23.98...??

Timzilla

Timzilla

Member
So I shot in 24Pa - everything is fine. Captured (pull down removed). Everything fine.

Looking at my clips, I see some are 29.97 fps and others are 23.98??? They are sequential - No changes were made during shooting. I did have quite a few cadence breaks while capturing.

I don't get it. Am I missing something obvious here?

Thanks -Tim
 
If you are using FCP here is what I would do - Go into Cinema Tools and open up the clip you captured. Then use the conform button to conform it to 23.98. Nothing will actually happen to the footage, as it is already 23.98. (And Cinema tools will tell you that it is already 23.98) Now quit out of Cinema Tools and open your project in FCP, it will say that you media is off line and ask you to reconnect it. Reconnect the media and it will show up as the correct frame rate. Why this works, I have no clue. But I have had this problem from time to time, and this has worked for me.
 
I captured everything with a Sony TRV-900.

Thanks for the Cinema Tools tip.. yes that seems to have corrected things.. not sure if this is related or not (as things have been falling apart on me all day)... but when I playback through my RCA NTSC monitor I get a stop or dropout in audio every half a second or so. Audio plays fine otherwise, its just when I playback through the TV. Exported clips appear fine too..

Bad day

Thanks for the help.
 
Same problem, a little more trouble

Same problem, a little more trouble

I'm having the exact same issue as Tim... some 23.98, some 29.97. Conformed with Cinema tools. That was easy enough, but when I scan the clip frame by frame in FCP, it seems that there is a duplicate frame every 4 or so. Isn't that supposed to be what the 24P capture is avoiding? I don't have a monitor to check out what it actually looks like, but it seems to play fine in the timeline. Will this be a problem in the long run or is this the way it is supposed to act?

Thanks for your help.
 
Ugh. Ok. Conforming with Cinema Tools has messed (sped up) my audio.

Any ideas other than reading the f***** manual?

Thanks in advance - Tim
 
I'm glad that this cinema tools tip worked for you. I'm not sure why that happens, or why opening it in cinema tools fixes it, but it works - so I use it. As for the audio question, if I understand you correctly you are saying that the audio play's fine without any problems normally. But when you connect your monitor to the computer you get a drop out in your audio. My only guess is that possibly the computer is not fast enough to play back everything in real time. Maybe you have a lot of FX on your video clip and audio clip and it is slowing it down? Is it just on unrendered clips? Can you play rendered clips OK? When you print to tape and then play it from the camera do the same drop outs happen? Hmmm ... I'm gonna have to give this some more thought ... any additional info you can give me would be great.
 
Timzilla said:
Ugh. Ok. Conforming with Cinema Tools has messed (sped up) my audio.
Click to expand...

BASTARD! I hate it when that happens. Do you remember what cinema tools said the clip rate was at when you opened it? (When I opened my clips it said that the frame rate was already 23.98) When I conformed the frame rate nothing actually changed, but FCP recognized that the clip was 23.98 instead of thinking that it was 29.98.

Can you slow the audio back down? possibly with the time remap tool? I'm thinking that your clip was some how captured at 29.98 - I've played with converting some of that footage to 23.98 with cinema tools and had the same problem with the audio. But I did not experience that problem with the 23.98 original footage. The audio stayed insync.

My only thoughts for right now are to either read the f******* manual, or try recapturing the footage. (Both of which are not fun.) I've go one clip on my computer that I have had this problem with - I'll try playing with it some more to see if I can come up with any other solutions.
 
Cinema Tools shouldn't be changing the audio on you. Earlier you (Timzilla) said it was fine just dropping and now it's sped up? How are you outputing your video? How are you outputting audio? if it's adding 2:3 as it does to go out firewire then your machien may not be fasst enough.
You and meweiss talk about 29.97 and some 23.98.
Were you both shooting and switching between F5 and F6?
meweiss says that it looks like duplicate frames. I assume this is the clips that you created using Cinema Toools and Remove Pulldown (Reverse Telecine) Is this the case?
Are they listed as 23.98 in the bin?
 
I am not entirely sure if this is the only reason, but, whenever I have timecode breaks at all, FCP captures 23.98 footage -labeling it- 29.97. I find that if I go back to recapture the same footage butmake sure to stop capture before the break in time code, then everything is fine. I haven't tried that thing w/ Cinema Tools, however.

Phil
 
In the future use the Rec Check button on top of camera if you did a rewind/review (or anything else such as powering off) that could have changed the tape location. This will keep the timecode from breaking.
I find it's better and easier to shoot a little extra head and tail, log each shot staring a couple seconds into shot and then batch capture. That way you're not forcing it to stumble over every start stop, especially if you shot in such a way you have time code breaks
 
Recapture

Recapture

Well, the solution to my problem, unfortunately, seems to be that I needed to recapture the footage... i'm not sure where the problems began, as I didn't shoot the footage, but recapturing seemed to work, although was quite time consuming. I have a feeling the some timecode breaks were the reason behind the problem, but I'm not sure.
 
I am having similar problems-
second project-
shot in 24pA and have everything set correctly for capture-

FCP 5.0 has some clips at 23.98- and then some at 29.97 I feel due to time code breaks- even though I changed NOTHING in my recording set-up when the footage was shot.

This is becoming a real technical issue-

Apple ?? Any comments??
 
FCP looks for the timecode info to determine what fps and what the cadence is since it needs to know what frames to drop. If it can't get reliable information then it defaults to not dropping frames and capturing as 29.97.

If you stop and start a lot, especially if you review or power off, you may get a time code breaks. It's best if you treat shooting like film by shooting at least a couple of seconds before and after the desired footage. When capturing if you bring in each take (starting and stopping within the camera start/stop points) then you're much more likely to avoid this problem. When you do a capture now or long batch capture of multiple takes there's a chance for a hiccup at each timecode break.
 
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