FS7: So what IS the OMB ENG solution..

Ben Scott said:
I don't think I have ever shot an interview at over 100mm in my life.
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Since this thread is about OMB solution then my point won't be 100% valid, but in some 2 camera interview setups it is difficult if not impossible to get out of other camera's shot unless you have a longer lens. But even in one camera setups I often use focal lengths longer than 100mm for an interview. Head and shoulders type shot on 100mm is around 9 feet away, often times this is the minimum "comfortable" distance, then there's an even tighter CU. Not to mention situations where you need a longer lens because of restrictions to the background, such as always-too-narrow seamless papers.
 
Each to their own and all that, but again I don't tend to shoot an interview tighter than a head and shoulders and if I have to use 2 cams I tend to be 35 & 85 or 50 & 85.
 
Ben Scott said:
Each to their own and all that, but again I don't tend to shoot an interview tighter than a head and shoulders and if I have to use 2 cams I tend to be 35 & 85 or 50 & 85.
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Good for you, not so great for the client since it tends to be what you prefer and not them. Sorry, but you make it sound like it's up to you.
 
That depends on how you see what you do. Im a DP (clue is in there title) I direct the photography meaning I gain a certain amount of control over the shoot. My Job is not to execute every whim a producer or director has at moments notice. When you hire an attorney to represent you you also have to follow his lead after you agreed on a strategy. There are clients that don't see it that way and I lose clients like that regularly and thats just fine historically their careers have gone nowhere but clients that do understand what it is that I do end up being promoted get bigger Jobs and take me along for the ride.


broughtonfilm said:
Good for you, not so great for the client since it tends to be what you prefer and not them. Sorry, but you make it sound like it's up to you.
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Its exactly how I feel though, a long lens makes a flat, distant feeling image. You could use that as an effect, a bit like the opening shots in The conversation though. Also I dont think he meant only that you should not use bad looking long lenses.
 
stokstad said:
Its exactly how I feel though, a long lens makes a flat, distant feeling image. You could use that as an effect, a bit like the opening shots in The conversation though. Also I dont think he meant only that you should not use bad looking long lenses.
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You took his words so literally. Do you think he is really talking about lens choices and physical distance? That's what you got out of it?
 
I routinely shoot interviews at 85mm and longer and like it . In fact I've probably shot quite a few times at 200mm for the closeup when they want me to change shots between questions. Most often I'm on an 85 and often close to or below f2, or a 70-200 with speed booster at f2 or close to it and over 100mm.

My clients tend to love soft backgrounds on interviews and are always asking if I can soften the background more. Hence I prefer long rooms, long lenses and open apertures. I don't think it makes a more distant feeling at all, just separates the person more and often creates a more pleasing composition. The only time I've ever shot a 35mm for an interview is in a tiny room where I have to and then it would be a 50mm with speed booster at very open f stop. In fact I just got a Milvus 35mm so I can do that and stay sharp at f1.4.

Never had a complaint about being soft though I always have 7" next to me and I watch the eyes like a hawk with peaking.

Now that said it doesn't mean I always shoot that way and it depends on the setting and its importance to the shot. Sometimes I want deep focus and I'll argue with the client about the need for more DOF so we can feel were we are. Once I was in a cave in Iceland and the client kept asking me to soften the background till I felt we couldn't see that it was a cave anymore so I lied and said the f stop was as wide as it could go.

To me long lenses and big sensors are a godsend for making good looking interviews in crappy rooms. It just goes to show though how we all have different methods and styles. There's no right and wrong way.
 
broughtonfilm said:
Good for you, not so great for the client since it tends to be what you prefer and not them. Sorry, but you make it sound like it's up to you.
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Again, not having a dig at anyone but I've simply never been in that situation. I get hired because people trust me to know what is best and how best to capture what they are after. If a Director wants me to be super tight 'Leone shot' on someone's eyes that is one thing, but I have never had a client override my shot selection.

I did once had a client tell me they thought my image in the camera monitor was too flat (was shooting and monitoring log). So I turned the monitor off.
 
LennyLevy said:
I routinely shoot interviews at 85mm and longer and like it . In fact I've probably shot quite a few times at 200mm for the closeup when they want me to change shots between questions. Most often I'm on an 85 and often close to or below f2, or a 70-200 with speed booster at f2 or close to it and over 100mm.

My clients tend to love soft backgrounds on interviews and are always asking if I can soften the background more. Hence I prefer long rooms, long lenses and open apertures. I don't think it makes a more distant feeling at all, just separates the person more and often creates a more pleasing composition. The only time I've ever shot a 35mm for an interview is in a tiny room where I have to and then it would be a 50mm with speed booster at very open f stop. In fact I just got a Milvus 35mm so I can do that and stay sharp at f1.4.

Never had a complaint about being soft though I always have 7" next to me and I watch the eyes like a hawk with peaking.

Now that said it doesn't mean I always shoot that way and it depends on the setting and its importance to the shot. Sometimes I want deep focus and I'll argue with the client about the need for more DOF so we can feel were we are. Once I was in a cave in Iceland and the client kept asking me to soften the background till I felt we couldn't see that it was a cave anymore so I lied and said the f stop was as wide as it could go.

To me long lenses and big sensors are a godsend for making good looking interviews in crappy rooms. It just goes to show though how we all have different methods and styles. There's no right and wrong way.
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Absolutely, and I can see why someone does it. I just just have a preference for the opposite :)

EDIT: I wonder if this is a market based distinction about this preference for certain focal lengths and distance from the camera or an international one?
 
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icarusfilm said:
That depends on how you see what you do. Im a DP (clue is in there title) I direct the photography meaning I gain a certain amount of control over the shoot. My Job is not to execute every whim a producer or director has at moments notice. When you hire an attorney to represent you you also have to follow his lead after you agreed on a strategy. There are clients that don't see it that way and I lose clients like that regularly and thats just fine historically their careers have gone nowhere but clients that do understand what it is that I do end up being promoted get bigger Jobs and take me along for the ride.
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Yah, what he said. ^^^
 
JPNola said:
I don't think there is anything that I haven't at one time done in my career.

While not literally accurate, I hope you get the point, Ben.:smile:
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Well yeah, of course. Same. But after I learned clients don't have a clue I then just did it RIGHT and let them think it was their idea.
 
Ben Scott said:
Absolutely, and I can see why someone does it. I just just hve a preference for the opposite :)
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I thought the thread was not so much about preferences, the fact that I said that longer than 100mm focal length is something I'd like to have in my OMB lens, does not necessarily reflect my preference as far as my favorite way to shoot interviews goes. This was about finding a lens that is universal, something very pragmatic. Just the word ENG suggests that. Or if it is about preferences then about a sum of them, sum of needs and styles. It's almost like "what would you take to a desert island" to survive, not so much about complaints about mosquitos there.
 
I meant I can see why someone would use a longer lens to compress a horrible background. But point taken. 100%

Long story short I'm not an ENG shooter and so my entire approach to shooting is different from a traditional ENG approach even when shooting stuff an ENG shooter might also cover. Which basically means everything I have written in this thread has pretty much been off-topic... Soz :)
 
I happened to be in Orlando when the nightclub shooting happened. A European Network I was shooting for asked me if I can stay on and cover the story they were sending their anchor. I only had a cinevised 18-35 sigma and an 85mm Zeiss prime with me. I shot for 6 Days without missing anything. Everybody was very happy.
 
Back to the OMB zoom, if the criteria is <20mm on the wide end, >100mm on the long end, servo, no center-scan cheat- where does that leave us?

Sony 18-110mm

Canon 17-120mm

That's it. Or am I leaving out any lenses there?



icarusfilm said:
I happened to be in Orlando when the nightclub shooting happened. A European Network I was shooting for asked me if I can stay on and cover the story they were sending their anchor. I only had a cinevised 18-35 sigma and an 85mm Zeiss prime with me. I shot for 6 Days without missing anything. Everybody was very happy.
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That's great but the fact that a particular client didn't want or demand the shots only obtainable by a "do-all" zoom doesn't mean that there isn't a need and doesn't mean that there are not clients who want the shots that only a wide to telephoto zoom can perform. We can debate the extent of the necessity of such a zoom ( and we have been debating it ) but imo it is inarguable that there is a necessity. The extent to which any one of us encounters that necessity is a function of the nature of our careers and of the sort of work we do or don't do.

It is in fact possible to do live-tv standup without an HMI. But that doesn't mean that there are not often times where an HMI is vital for properly shooting a live-tv standup. And it doesn't mean that failing to have an HMI as part of your kit won't hurt you in fulfilling that sort of work. That you got away without an HMI doesn't mean that clients don't expect you to have one. Does that make sense? I did an exterior live shot using only a Litepanel Astra. The client was happy with the shot. But that doesn't mean I don't need to have an HMI to do live shots. It just means that I didn't need an HMI that one time. There are things that certain clients expect you to have and some even issue lists of the kit they expect you to have. No one would have lasted long in 2/3" ENG had they only owned 2/3" prime lenses and attempted to shoot everything on primes with frequent lens swaps. Or had they attempted to use 3 short range zooms in lieu of one do-all zoom.

And yes, B4 mount primes exist.:D
 
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In the end of you need the range and versatility of an ENG camera there is some good news - they still sell ENG cameras!
It's kind of like getting a large format camera and then try to use it for street photography. I'm not saying you can't but you and your client have to adapt or pay a shitload carry a shitload and have stressful time.
 
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