FS7: Snowlight: A new test film & blog post

Looks great thank you for taking the time to post.

I pretty much agree with all your thoughts on the camera too.
 
Beautiful! And that final shot is fantastic -- how did you capture that (the wide, high shot)?
 
Nice little film - it is great to see the sun in a frame without a set of green or magenta dough nuts around it :)

A couple of little notes on your setup.

I think you need to try and enjoy the internal EVF more. It is a shame already to be turning the camera into frankensteins monster!

With a the stock EVF LUT on and 'at the finger' focus check focus is surely easy (yes we all need to campaign for the joystick to change the focus check area)

To me using the stock EVF has to work as it keeps the mass of the unit down and also simpifies power supply, rigging et al.

Personally Im binning the loupe and making a little sun hood.

I think as you try Resolve you will gain confidence in shooting Slog and not desire in camera NR - enabling you to exit custom mode - then you might get the best from the onboard EVF.

One thing about the sony rod and clamp is they have slots and little clip stops to keep the EVF on horizon, so again I try them for a bit before loading up the zacuto bits.

Once you are using proper Slog and viewing a LUT the need for WFM kind of drifts away - simply set zebras at 90 and ETTR!

As for the C300 - no HFR and 8bit means IMO it is dead in the water!

S
 
Nice little piece of film!

Most of the shots look really good.

FYI: When shooting SLog3 in custom mode, the color space is not
S-Gamut3.cine anymore. This makes grading with the Sony LUT
a problem in terms of color. The Sony SLog3 LUTs only work good,
when you use the appropriate color space!
If you don't, a simple S-curve might be the better solution.

Anyway, thanks for posting!
 
Nice writing. More I read more I see I'm not only one and was right when FS7 was announced. I knew FS7 wasn't miracle camera all were expecting. Testing it and reading people testing it confirms. Tip, maybe in future you ask rick to write. It's strange to read and look like you speak in third person.
 
Interesting read. Nice poem too:-)

FWIW I've been shooting quite happily in CineEI mode. Focus isn't too hard if you use the magnify tool a lot (would be good if you could move the zoomed-in area). Noise hasn't been an issue either. It's an issue if you use the wrong LUT or colour space in post though, something lots of people seem to be tripping up on.

Lots of people are also misunderstanding CineEI mode as it's counterintuitive to what they are used to with gain/ISO on other cameras, but in practice it's really simple.
 
SJX said:
Nice writing. More I read more I see I'm not only one and was right when FS7 was announced. I knew FS7 wasn't miracle camera all were expecting. Testing it and reading people testing it confirms. Tip, maybe in future you ask rick to write. It's strange to read and look like you speak in third person.
Click to expand...

Tip, don't make conclusions based on a users first outings with a new piece of tech. Certainly, it is more complex to shoot and post with the FS7 than the C300, but I'm getting results with the FS7 that blow the C300 completely out of the water.
 
Liam Hall said:
Tip, don't make conclusions based on a users first outings with a new piece of tech. Certainly, it is more complex to shoot and post with the FS7 than the C300, but I'm getting results with the FS7 that blow the C300 completely out of the water.
Click to expand...
Conclusion also based on my test drive. Problem is not complexity. Problem is image and fact camera is more hype than truth. Blowing c300 8-bit older camera is nothing to brag. Ridiculous is people say FS7 wedding camera is as good as F55. Soon hype will reach as good as F65 and Alexa 65 level. LOL. Then next year FS7 is trash like always happen after honeymoon.
 
We know that the FS7 has the same sensor and same color space as F5 - output will be near identic.
It's no hype, its based on experience with both cameras.

If you think the FS7 is just a cheap hype, just choose another one and be happy but
please stop whinging. You are doing it for days now in most FS7 threads.
It doesn't help nobody...

THX
 
Erik Wittbusch said:
We know that the FS7 has the same sensor and same color space as F5 - output will be near identic.
It's no hype, its based on experience with both cameras.

If you think the FS7 is just a cheap hype, just choose another one and be happy but
please stop whinging. You are doing it for days now in most FS7 threads.
It doesn't help nobody...

THX
Click to expand...

For days? I have not been here for a week.

But what is a few realistic posts in a pool of thousand hype posts? Bring perspective. ;)

The hype is not only image quality. Is also FS7 is perfect body and no rig needed but people now start rigging. People now want to replace crappy evf etc.

But same sensor as F5 is only rumor and has no official press release from sony saying this. Even if sensor is same codec is not. F5 is 16 bit raw. Processing is also different because is much cheaper. If you think you have F5 with FS7 you hyped. Maybe very close but identical is lol. Sorry.
 
You don't need to be sorry for me.

I love the FS7 for what it is. It's a one-man-band camera and it fits my needs perfectly.
I won't use a franken-rig as I like the display, the size and especially what comes out
of it. I like the form and the weight and therefore the built quality is fine for me, too.
If you think the FS7 is just hype - again: Stop whining and work with another camera!

I even don' care which sensor or processor it features. The output when choosing
SLog/SGamut3.cine is very, very nice. I like it and It can be graded quickly with
some basic knowledge.


You're misunderstanding the whole point in cameras: There's no best camera made
for every one's needs. It will never exist!

Choose your camera according to the type of work and budget and everything will
be fine... :happy:
 
Erik Wittbusch said:
FYI: When shooting SLog3 in custom mode, the color space is not
S-Gamut3.cine anymore. This makes grading with the Sony LUT
a problem in terms of color.
Click to expand...

This got me during testing till I realized why I was getting different results with Slog3 in custom vs CineEI. I have to say I like CineEI with 709A lut much more than Custom with same lut as a starting place.

I agree with everyone waveform asidie the one feature I really want added is to move the punch focus box around. That is my #1 desire at the moment.
 
skimmel said:
Beautiful! And that final shot is fantastic -- how did you capture that (the wide, high shot)?
Click to expand...

That was a GoPro Hero 4 at 4K on a Phantom 2 drone. (I love that shot too... we only had 5 min to get it and leave!). There are more details in the blog post. Thanks for the kind comments.
 
morgan_moore said:
Nice little film - it is great to see the sun in a frame without a set of green or magenta dough nuts around it :)

A couple of little notes on your setup.

I think you need to try and enjoy the internal EVF more. It is a shame already to be turning the camera into frankensteins monster!
Click to expand...

Thanks Sam. Not really turning anything into a monster, all we did was add a longer rod and a better, more comfortable shoulder pad, and extend the arm a bit.

morgan_moore said:
With a the stock EVF LUT on and 'at the finger' focus check focus is surely easy (yes we all need to campaign for the joystick to change the focus check area)

To me using the stock EVF has to work as it keeps the mass of the unit down and also simpifies power supply, rigging et al.
Click to expand...

Well yeah, with a better EVF we are looking at far more cost. I don't think it's a bad EVF, personally; the screen is ok. I do think the loupe is too chunky, and I really wish the magnification could be moved around - that's a huge missing piece. I suppose the focusing issue is more the focusing without a LUT...

morgan_moore said:
I think as you try Resolve you will gain confidence in shooting Slog and not desire in camera NR - enabling you to exit custom mode - then you might get the best from the onboard EVF.
Click to expand...

Doesn't Resolve NR take forever? I have a beefy "trashcan" 8 core/D700 Mac Pro so maybe not. You're right - shooting in CineEI would solve the LUT issue (and solve the gamut problem) but then you are tied to that exposure index, three WB settings, and the current loss of WF which I can't stand. The zebras are not easy to see, though I suppose one could just put the LUT on and use your eye and the zebras as it all is just a guide to expose; the magic happens in the grade. It's basically a new way of shooting and I have to try it out and learn it - and learn Resolve too.

morgan_moore said:
One thing about the sony rod and clamp is they have slots and little clip stops to keep the EVF on horizon, so again I try them for a bit before loading up the zacuto bits.
Click to expand...

Mine did not have anything clamping into the slots. Nothing. The main issue though is the rod is too short. The zacuto clamp is not strictly necessary, but is much better built and easier to work with as there are two knobs vs the one with Sony. It's speed of adjustment kind of thing.

morgan_moore said:
Once you are using proper Slog and viewing a LUT the need for WFM kind of drifts away - simply set zebras at 90 and ETTR!
Click to expand...

So I have read. You basically expose to the LUT and the internally recorded SLOG is properly exposed to Sony's specs. Interesting way of doing things, I am just afraid of all the noise and the different style of locking down your ISO. It's just a new concept is all, and I am sure if I read this in a couple of months I will laugh at myself. :)


morgan_moore said:
As for the C300 - no HFR and 8bit means IMO it is dead in the water!

S
Click to expand...

The C300 still looks great and I have done some of my best work on it. But yes, yes.. I missed HFR greatly (60p at least!) and the FS7 footage can be pushed around much more. It's kind of a revelation, really.

Thanks for your comments and suggestions, Sam - they are appreciated.
 
Erik Wittbusch said:
Nice little piece of film!

Most of the shots look really good.

FYI: When shooting SLog3 in custom mode, the color space is not
S-Gamut3.cine anymore. This makes grading with the Sony LUT
a problem in terms of color. The Sony SLog3 LUTs only work good,
when you use the appropriate color space!
If you don't, a simple S-curve might be the better solution.

Anyway, thanks for posting!
Click to expand...

Erik, thank you for your kind words and for the tip about the gamut. I knew this, but I didn't know it, you know what I mean? I always looked at the menus thinking "what is messing with my colors? Is it the fact that I don't see sgamut3 in custom?" Now I know.

See my comments to Sam about my uncomfortableness working with CineEI...
 
SJX said:
Tip, maybe in future you ask rick to write. It's strange to read and look like you speak in third person.
Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean here... the poem or the blog? The main post is proper English I assure you. ;)

As for the FS7 being a "miracle camera" - I don't know who said that. It is rare that a tool matches up to the hype, and that is the case here. But is it a great tool that puts out great images? And that is cheaper than what I paid before, yet gives me many more image options? Yes. That's all I care about.
 
RatLabProductions said:
This got me during testing till I realized why I was getting different results with Slog3 in custom vs CineEI. I have to say I like CineEI with 709A lut much more than Custom with same lut as a starting place.

I agree with everyone waveform asidie the one feature I really want added is to move the punch focus box around. That is my #1 desire at the moment.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this. I'm going to have to learn some Resolve basics so I can grade there. Sam's suggestion of running Cine EI (gaining LUTs and the proper gamut) and ETTR like normal using the zebras a guide likely will work best. I understand in general terms how the EI works and what the ISO "changes" mean in the VF.

I am just nervous about Resolve; how long the NR takes, how good it looks, if I edit a piece in, say FCPX will it round trip properly, etc.

Agreed about push in focus box. Didn't have that for years on C300 and when it was added relatively recently it was a godsend. Then it's gone on this camera!
 
NeedCreative said:
Thanks for this. I'm going to have to learn some Resolve basics so I can grade there.
Click to expand...

I'm in the same boat. So far I've only done CC 1st pass in Catalyst and then some polish in AE but I need to get some more advanced stuff to make this camera sing. The good news on big jobs I'd just hire a colourist but those little ones where getting every dollar yourself that is where I need to improve on colour grading.

Can anyone recommend a good resolve tutorial? Does the free version of resolve do NR? might have to spring for the full thing or tackle another 3rd party solution.
 
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