Slow Flesh Burn

T

traviscool

Well-known member
I am working on a project, and I need a guys arm to burn for 10 to 15 seconds. What is the easiest way to go about doing this (without the actor taking one for the team). I know he'll probably end up wearing a long fireproof glove; is there any way I can disguise this? Where can I get some good prop fire proof gloves? Or is there an entirely different way to do this?
 
I used to light my hands and arms on fire in art class back in high school, they'd be lit for probably about that time. I'd just coat the area (palm of the hand usually) with rubber cement, which is thick so it blocks the heat for a decent amount of time (though it does eventually get quite warm) and it's got a high alcohol content, so it burns like crazy.

But, I don't think I'd really recommend that alone as a good solution...

I do however think I have a solution for you.

Coat you actors arm with a nonflammable gel, cover that with a piece of panty hose cut to size. You might also consider using a flame retardant treatment on the panty hose (http://www.natfire.com). Then cover the panty hose with the rubber cement. That should provide enough protection for the length of the burn. Just be sure to spray it out with a fire extinguisher afterward.

Perhaps a better idea would be to composite the effect in post.

Film his arm without the fire, then film a prosthetic arm against a keyable background, match move and composite the prosthetic over the real arm.. more work for sure, but no chance of your actor being burned.
 
tcindie said:
I used to light my hands and arms on fire in art class back in high school, they'd be lit for probably about that time. I'd just coat the area (palm of the hand usually) with rubber cement, which is thick so it blocks the heat for a decent amount of time (though it does eventually get quite warm) and it's got a high alcohol content, so it burns like crazy.

But, I don't think I'd really recommend that alone as a good solution...

I do however think I have a solution for you.

Coat you actors arm with a nonflammable gel, cover that with a piece of panty hose cut to size. You might also consider using a flame retardant treatment on the panty hose (http://www.natfire.com). Then cover the panty hose with the rubber cement. That should provide enough protection for the length of the burn. Just be sure to spray it out with a fire extinguisher afterward.

Perhaps a better idea would be to composite the effect in post.

Film his arm without the fire, then film a prosthetic arm against a keyable background, match move and composite the prosthetic over the real arm.. more work for sure, but no chance of your actor being burned.
Click to expand...

Unbelievable!
I can see it now, "You know I read about this on the internet and I want to try it out on you". "You should be fine, I'll be standing right next to you with a wet towel".
The pantyhose will probably melt onto the skin. i certainly wouldn't put rubber cement on my skin unprotected and light it on fire. Call me crazy....
http://imdb.com/name/nm0366532/

There are some new fire gels out there that allow you to do burns on skin.
There are also some different types of cloth or clothing to use for protection. Wool is the best, cotton second. Don't use anything that is polyester or plastic based.
There is a fire RETARDANT glove made out of Kynol that is pretty close to flesh colored that you can use from a distance.
Here are some people on fire with the new stuff from Canada.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4Xa80bHkr0&mode=related&search=
My advice...use professionals that know what they are doing. Burns are pretty much forever.....
 
Well like I said, I wouldn't recommend it as a good solution. Sheesh.

And notice, how I ended that post.

" Perhaps a better idea would be to composite the effect in post.

Film his arm without the fire, then film a prosthetic arm against a keyable background, match move and composite the prosthetic over the real arm.. more work for sure, but no chance of your actor being burned."
 
It really doesn't matter how you ended the post. You said that you did it in art class on your skin. You don't really know who you are telling that to. I have been burned and seen some horrific burns on stunts gone wrong. Plastic surgery definitely and scars that are still there. Just be careful, who you tell what you did, you don't know where it will lead or how they will attempt what you have told them that you did.
One Halloween I had a small coffin lid filled with Milky Way and 3 Musketeer candy bars. When the doorbell would ring, I would dip my hand in protective fire gel, add a bit of accelerant and light it up. When the door opened I would do the "Butler" deal and ask them if they would like to select a chocolate. The kids went absolutely nuts and we ran out of candy after about an hour. I had nomex and long sleeves on my arm and used protective fire gel on my hand, had a wet towel and a fire extinguisher standing by as well as a safety person. I used an accelerant that burned at a lower temperature than rubber cement and didn't have the dangerous fumes or smoke of rubber cement. And of course, I tested it and have a background in stunts. I also would tell the kids to "not do this at home" or by themselves.
I am simply amazed all of the time at what people will try with no training or supervision. That's why there are the "Darwin Awards".
 
How about I paint my arm green, soak it in gas, light it on fire.... You can key out my arm and overlay the footage!
 
Kdawg said:
How about I paint my arm green, soak it in gas, light it on fire.... You can key out my arm and overlay the footage!
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LOL, I was just going to say that:beer: Seriously traviscool, unless you have a trained professional don't even try the fire gel. Possibly compositing the effect will be your best choice. Keep it safe!
 
Ok, let me say something totally sensible then..

Don't attempt any kind of practical fire effects without a professional trained pyrotechician handling them.

I honestly don't know why people think they need to incorporate big elaborate stunts and effects into these low/no budget films.. realistically speaking, there is a reason that professionals charge for what they do, and if you can't afford one, you shouldn't be doing the effect or stunt. Unless you do it with CG in post. ;)
 
well, if you want, since I'm doing CG fire tests of my own, for the sake of testing purpose, if its JUST the actors ARM that you want on fire.

If you give me the footage (hopefully locked down shot) if its a moving shot then I'll have to do a 3d camera match (makes everything more complicated)

I'll hand match the ARM movemensts (so long as its not some WILD hand movements), I should be able to hand keyframe the movements onto a proxy arm mesh and then use fire simulation, then its just a simple matter of composting.

also a photo of the guys arm (extented out) would be helpful for me to model a CG arm so its all in correct scale.

If you like it just slap down my name in your credits, and I'll be happy :)
 
tcindie said:
Ok, let me say something totally sensible then..

Don't attempt any kind of practical fire effects without a professional trained pyrotechician handling them.

I honestly don't know why people think they need to incorporate big elaborate stunts and effects into these low/no budget films.. realistically speaking, there is a reason that professionals charge for what they do, and if you can't afford one, you shouldn't be doing the effect or stunt. Unless you do it with CG in post. ;)
Click to expand...

Good on you for the sensible statement.

And what a nice offer from Anhar. I still haven't seen a cgi burn that looks real though. Hopefully Anhar can do one.
 
Calm down guys I'm not one to go doing stupid things, thanks everybody for the advice.

Anhar Miah said:
well, if you want, since I'm doing CG fire tests of my own, for the sake of testing purpose, if its JUST the actors ARM that you want on fire.

If you give me the footage (hopefully locked down shot) if its a moving shot then I'll have to do a 3d camera match (makes everything more complicated)

I'll hand match the ARM movemensts (so long as its not some WILD hand movements), I should be able to hand keyframe the movements onto a proxy arm mesh and then use fire simulation, then its just a simple matter of composting.

also a photo of the guys arm (extented out) would be helpful for me to model a CG arm so its all in correct scale.

If you like it just slap down my name in your credits, and I'll be happy :)
Click to expand...
Anhar, thanks for the offer, I may take you up on it I have not actually shot anything yet it was more of a is it possible... but I hope to assemble some actors so maybe in a few weeks I'll have something.
 
No problemo, you take your time. I can't promise anything for 100% certainty because I'm juggling a lot of stuff, but yes when you have some footage just PM me or post here.
 
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