Should I get the MKH 50 or the AT 4053b?

M

mustangranch99

Active member
I'm deciding on a great mic for recording dialogue during films and these two keep coming up in my research.

Which would be better for capturing the best dialogue and why? Would the 4053b be a good investment for it's price?

I know the MKH costs twice as much, but does it sound like it has TWICE as much quality over the 4053b?

Thank you for reading.
 
I know the MKH costs twice as much, but does it sound like it has TWICE as much quality over the 4053b?
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It's almost impossible to quantice a subjective thing such as good sound. In general, there is a law of diminishing return when buying mics, so the more you spend, the less significant the improvement gets. I would argue that the 50 sounds better, but the difference isn't necessarily that big (only your own ears can decide though). Is it still worth the cost? I would say yes. The 50 is less susceptible to environmental issues, has less self-noise, higher output, and probably more durable overall.

Only you can decide if those things are important or not.
 
One way to look for a good mic is to see what the pros are using, and they use a lot of different mics for different situations. For indoor booming, most use a hyper like Schoeps mk41, Sennheiser MKH50/8050 (some prefer the 40), and some like the Neumann km185. A few prefer to use shotguns indoors as well, but it's mostly Sanken CS3-e or Schoeps CMIT5u, (sometimes MKH60), which are pretty good with reflections.
 
You wanna know something? On two different shoots fairly recently with pro sound guys, they were both using the CARDIOID capsule on the oktava mk012. One shoot was in a museum, and sound guy mentioned how he liked the lack of the rear lobe the hyper pickup pattern has, other shoot was in a guest house (that is sadly much larger than my entire apartment), and sound guy said it made the room sound more natural than a hyper. So apparently at least in houston cardioid very popular for indoors. Something to think about.
 
You wanna know something? On two different shoots fairly recently with pro sound guys, they were both using the CARDIOID capsule on the oktava mk012. One shoot was in a museum, and sound guy mentioned how he liked the lack of the rear lobe the hyper pickup pattern has, other shoot was in a guest house (that is sadly much larger than my entire apartment), and sound guy said it made the room sound more natural than a hyper. So apparently at least in houston cardioid very popular for indoors. Something to think about.
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It's not all that uncommon to use a cardioid (hence my mentioning the mkh40 before, which is a cardioid). As the sound guy said, it's primarily for the lack of a rear lobe, which is beneficial in certain situations, such as when there's a low reflective ceiling. Some also prefer a cardioid in small reflective spaces, like bathrooms.

The larger pick-up pattern is also useful when you're booming a group of people interacting, as it's easy to miss something with a narrow pattern.
 
Also, one thing that concerns me is the handling noise. I could barely find any reviews on the MKH 50 but the ones I found mentioned handling noise a number of times.

Is it really that bad? Is that MKH 50 very difficult to boom?
 
Oh, and I'm currently using an ATR-6550 for my current mic.

Which of those would make the most pronounced upgrade in quality?
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If you search around, you will find that most people think the 50 is a better mic overall, so it will naturally be a bigger upgrade than the 4053b. Wether it's worth the extra cost or not, only you can decide, and you really should rent them and try them out yourself.

Also, one thing that concerns me is the handling noise. I could barely find any reviews on the MKH 50 but the ones I found mentioned handling noise a number of times.

Is it really that bad? Is that MKH 50 very difficult to boom?
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Were they talking about the MKH50, or the MKH8050 (the modular, newer version)? The latter may be a bit sensitive to handling noise, but the MKH50 isn't particularly difficult (I don't know how it compares to the 4053b in this area though). Then again, only your skills can decide.
 
With a good shock mount.. and in experienced hands, handling noise should not be an issue with either mic.
The Rycote Lyre shockmount is highly regarded by most pros. The new K-tek Nautilus is worth consideration as well. An 80Hz HPF would help as well.
 
" Which Rycote Lyre mount should I get? "
> Depends on which mic and accessories you use. For instance, I have an InVision-7 for my 4053 which works with my other mics around that 19mm size and weight. I also have an InVision Softie Lyre mount & handle for my 416 as well as a older Zeppelin system which I have not yet upgraded to the 'Lyre' suspension parts.
Go the Rycote website http://www.rycote.com/resources/microphone_search/microphones_and_camcorders/ , enter your mic which should bring up mount, windscreen and other options.
 
mustangranch99 said:
Would the 4053b be a good investment for it's price?
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I just made this choice a few months ago. For me, money was / is a real issue, and I found a excellent deal on a used AT4053b. IMHO it's a heck of a value. It sounds great running through my (also used) MixPre-D and recorded by the camera.

Given my (admittedly low end) workflow and equipment, I think the AT4053b is an excellent choice, and I haven't regretted it.

mustangranch99 said:
I know the MKH costs twice as much, but does it sound like it has TWICE as much quality over the 4053b?
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It could. The thing is, you've got to use it with equipement that match its abilities, and a workflow that does too. If you want to get the best out of MHK 50, I think you're going to have to use an excellent field mixer, and an excellent recorder, and perhaps most importantly, and excellent boom op.

So the question is, is the mic your bottleneck, or is your bottleneck something else? If it's the mic, then the MHK 50 would probably be the better choice. If it's not the mic, then the AT4053b might be a better choice, and use the money saved to work on the actual bottleneck.
 
Well, just got back from the demo and here are my results.



1. The AT4053B sounded okay to mediocre. Dialogue was muddy and overly bassy, and made me sound like I was in a closed off room with no sense of presence.

2. The MKH 50 was better but not by much. It was a little too high on the top end and it's range was limited as well. Not bad, but nothing to write home about.

It's important to note both of those mics sounded as good as my $60 ATR-6550. Amazing what a great boom op can accomplish!

3. Finally, the Oktava MK-012s.

INCREDIBLE.

ABSOLUTELY AMAZING.

Dialogue was crisp and natural with plenty of presence and didn't sound overly bassy. Wonderful mic and did EXACTLY what I needed. Ended up buying a stereo set and calling it a day.

Anyhow, that's it. Thank you for all the help.
 
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Obviously you're aware of the handling noise and other issues associated with the Oktavas. A good shock mount is a must, even with an experienced boom op. The 012 can sound very good. Be sure to pray to the microphone gods for blessing you with a good pair of 012s.
 
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