Rumor: Sony A7s will have 4K video

Am presuming Den used OSS on Sony lenses for handheld which would help avoid any micro jitters that I have seen in some GH4 4k footage....looks like jello is the one quirk that 4k stills/video hybrids haven't overcome yet.....great images from both of them though
 
ade4all said:
Am presuming Den used OSS on Sony lenses for handheld which would help avoid any micro jitters that I have seen in some GH4 4k footage....looks like jello is the one quirk that 4k stills/video hybrids haven't overcome yet.....great images from both of them though
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Yeah, the GH4 rolling shutter at 4K doesn't look that much better in the tests I've seen.
 
hgf4 said:
What kind of dynamic range are you expecting from this camera and how much DR have we typically been getting from DSLRs up to now?
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Since it depends so much on how you measure it (specially if what you care about is "usable DR"), I don't think there's a point on posting a number without context.

But if you take Den Lennie's koolaid, it should be like the F5, which is somewhat better than the F3 (slog2 vs slog), which is two stops better than the C300 (here), which is somewhat better than the 5D3+RAW (I think), which is three stops better than the 5D3+H264 shooting with Prolost Flat (here).

If the limitations of 8-bit and the internal codec kill one and a half stops, then, in usable terms, I would expect it to reach 10.5 stops in my usable DR table:
dr.jpg



That's a stop better than the blackmagics shooting RAW, 1.5 stops better than the 5D3+RAW, and around three stops better than the next best DSLR shooting with a compressed codec (I think that would be a Nikon). Which is crazy.
 
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For all those that think they must have 4k
Like I've said before, I want the A7s for extended dynamic range, low light ability, and clean 1080p. I tend to shoot actors more than panoramas.

It seems Canon hasn't failed to disappoint @ NAB. Makes my camera choice a lot easier.
 
^ My thoughts exactly.

Regarding Canon, I don't know why you think they disappointed. They just announced this.

And now, since Emanuel is calling Macgregor to my DR test and I know he's a hard critic, I think I need to post some extra information about my measuring procedure...
It's based on this video (which includes only the clips for ISO 200).
I shot the same scene with similar lenses on all the cameras (my Leitz set; couldn't be the same lens on all cameras because I wanted to keep FoV and camera position nearly constant).
I shot at every ISO, changing the aperture from f/2.8 to f/16
I loaded all the clips to the editor, expanding the shadows and highlights as much as I could, then chose, for each camera and ISO setting, the clip with the aperture that equalized shadow noise on all cameras (the narrowest aperture that still lets me see some texture detail in the dark shadow in the shoe box).
And then looked at which of the grey patchs was the brightest one that was not clipping (you can see it in the video, marked with a red dot).
I used my light meter measurements to see how much difference there was between that shadow in the shoe box and the brightest grey patch that didn' clip to white.
 
I'm not clicking on it but I bet it comes in white

The A6000 DR (stills) is lower than the Nex's and the D5300
 
Samuel, S-Log 2 is what is primarily responsible for the increase in useable dynamic range? Do you think we will see Sony start using S-Log in lower end cameras, perhaps even a version of the RX100? Do you know if S-Log has to be tailored to each specific sensor, does it require a lot of work on Sony's part to include it in a specific camera? Just wondering, if it does entail a lot of work to get it to work with a specific sensor maybe that implies we're gonna see this sensor used in a more professional camera soon? Finally, how effective do you think Panasonic Cinelike D is compared to S-Log?
 
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hgf4 said:
Samuel, S-Log 2 is what is primarily responsible for the increase in useable dynamic range? Do you think we will see Sony start using S-Log in lower end cameras, perhaps even a version of the RX100? Do you know if S-Log has to be tailored to each specific sensor, does it require a lot of work on Sony's part to include it in a specific camera? Just wondering, if it does entail a lot of work to get it to work with a specific sensor maybe that implies we're gonna see this sensor used in a more professional camera soon? Finally, how effective do you think Panasonic Cinelike D is compared to S-Log?
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I've read that C-log is specially adapted for use in 8-bit, while the S-log implementation for the 8bit in the FS700 was pretty useless. So it's down to implementation, but I doubt they just slapped it on there haphazardly this time. Slog will be much flatter than CinelikeD though. I don't think they'll include Slog in any camera they don't expect prosumers to use. Slog is all about grading, and it also almost always introduces more noise into the image (this is true of the F3 but we don't know how the noise looks on the A7s yet).
 
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hgf4 said:
Samuel, S-Log 2 is what is primarily responsible for the increase in useable dynamic range? Do you think we will see Sony start using S-Log in lower end cameras, perhaps even a version of the RX100? Do you know if S-Log has to be tailored to each specific sensor, does it require a lot of work on Sony's part to include it in a specific camera? Just wondering, if it does entail a lot of work to get it to work with a specific sensor maybe that implies we're gonna see this sensor used in a more professional camera soon? Finally, how effective do you think Panasonic Cinelike D is compared to S-Log?
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For video, yes: my NEX-5N does 11 stops of usable DR in RAW stills, but only 7 in video mode, because all the image profiles I can select will kill four stops of information. Silly as it is, a software update such as this one is what I've been asking for during the last couple of years (well, that, and a codec that doesn't break with this extended DR, the simplest one being uncompressed RAW). Still waiting to see if the DR is actually there, if the 8-bit thing is really a problem, what's the price, how bad is the RS...

And no, I don't expect Sony to bring slog2 to all their cameras, just the ones they want to market specifically for pro or semi-pro video.

No idea about Panasonic Cinelike D, or about whether Sony will bring a camcorder with this sensor (Kholi suggested a VG a lot of pages back).
 
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squig said:
The A6000 DR (stills) is lower than the Nex's and the D5300
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It seems to have some minor issues at ISO 100, but at higher ISOs it is better than the older NEX, and equal to the D5300:
http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Comp...s-Sony-NEX-7-versus-Sony-NEX-5N___942_736_737
http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Comp...s-Nikon-D5300-versus-Sony-NEX-7___942_919_736
Not bad at all, given how many in-sensor AF things the A6000 has (it seems those usually reduce performance)

Also, since I'm posting random links about stuff other than a7r: wow, that Sigma 50mm thing is some impressive lens!
http://www.the-digital-picture.com/...meraComp=453&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=0&APIComp=3
 
Samuel H said:
It seems to have some minor issues at ISO 100, but at higher ISOs it is better than the older NEX, and equal to the D5300:
http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Comp...s-Sony-NEX-7-versus-Sony-NEX-5N___942_736_737
http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Comp...s-Nikon-D5300-versus-Sony-NEX-7___942_919_736
Not bad at all, given how many in-sensor AF things the A6000 has (it seems those usually reduce performance)
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Nothing exciting
http://www.techradar.com/reviews/ca...y-alpha-a6000-1223772/review/5#articleContent

The only lens I'm interested in at the moment is a 24mm Samyang and maybe a 35mm just for a bit more speed. Happy with my 50mm f/1.2 Pentax k and my Leicas.
 
It's surprising how those techradar numbers are completely different from the dxomark ones: it proves just how difficult it is to get consistent DR measurements. I've always known that with my home-made methods I can't discern differences of about one stop, but I would have expected these sites to be much more in line (techradar puts RAW DR between one and two stops below the NEX-7, whereas dxomark has them basically tied).

In any case, not exciting. It would be if the A6000 had slog2 and XAVCs, but it seems Sony will only put those into cameras specifically marketed for video.
 
Samuel H said:
In any case, not exciting. It would be if the A6000 had slog2 and XAVCs, but it seems Sony will only put those into cameras specifically marketed for video.
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Just imagine if they had done this with the RX10. That camera could have been a beast for video. I'm optimistic they'll include with a RX10 MkII.
 
^ It translates to an "estimated" price. the same price as the A7r, which is probably how they estimated the price. Also Sweden has higher taxes than most of Europe, so their listed prices (which include tax) are always higher.
 
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Samuel H said:
It's surprising how those techradar numbers are completely different from the dxomark ones: it proves just how difficult it is to get consistent DR measurements. I've always known that with my home-made methods I can't discern differences of about one stop, but I would have expected these sites to be much more in line (techradar puts RAW DR between one and two stops below the NEX-7, whereas dxomark has them basically tied).
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That Tech Radar article is a load of crap. 13-stops of dynamic-range at ISO1600 on an NEX-6? Something has definitely gone wrong over there.
 
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