Rode Videomic and HMC150 - good, bad, acceptable?

L

LoneWolf

Member
Hi folks,

Recently got my HMC150, what a sweet camera. Unfortunately the only mic I have for it is my Rode Videomic, initially purchased for the 5D2. The 5D2 didn't really work out as a video camera, but I am now stuck with the mike. Is it worth using if I am expecting merely 'ok' and not fantastic sound? The HMC150 left a big hole in my pocket, moths now fly out of my wallet and the vultures are hovering around me, so I would rather not spend much more money at this time :) (though in future that might change once I get over the credit card shock of the 150). I picked up an XLR adapter to try with it. It works, though it can be a little bit soft at times - need to bump the audio dials up.

Also, while we're on the topic of mikes, would you recommend the inexpensive Shure SM58 as a good handheld interview mike for plugging into the HMC150?
 
LoneWolf said:
Hi folks,

Recently got my HMC150, what a sweet camera. Unfortunately the only mic I have for it is my Rode Videomic, initially purchased for the 5D2. The 5D2 didn't really work out as a video camera, but I am now stuck with the mike. Is it worth using if I am expecting merely 'ok' and not fantastic sound? The HMC150 left a big hole in my pocket, moths now fly out of my wallet and the vultures are hovering around me, so I would rather not spend much more money at this time :) (though in future that might change once I get over the credit card shock of the 150). I picked up an XLR adapter to try with it. It works, though it can be a little bit soft at times - need to bump the audio dials up.

Also, while we're on the topic of mikes, would you recommend the inexpensive Shure SM58 as a good handheld interview mike for plugging into the HMC150?
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The SM58 would work. You should anticipate the level is going to be a bit low as it is a dynamic mic with a very close working distance, vocalists tend to eat their mics. Other options that might be more suitable for interviews and streeters would include the Sennheiser MD42 omni and MD46 cardioid, the Electrovoice 635 and RE50, and the Audio Technica AT8004/8004L, none of which will break the bank at between $100 and $200.

The Videomic should work okay but you shouldn't expect any signifigant improvment over the camera's built-in mic. It's an inexpensive okay mic intended as an accessory for a consumer video cam being used for "home movies" and in that role serves very well. While there are differences in how various mics sound - the differences between a $200 Videomic and a $2500 Schoeps CMIT are certainly very real - in general the choice of mic is going to be less important than its placement and putting the mic at the camera position is almost always going to result in unacceptable sound.

Is it worth using if I am expecting merely 'ok' and not fantastic sound?
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Depends on what you're shooting and why you're shootring it. If you're just doing it for personal pleasure, why not? But if you're shooting professionally, aspiring to shoot professionally, or a filmmaker seriously approaching the art even though you might not depend on it for a living, IMHO good enough, never is. You always need to push to make it as perfect as your budget and skills permit, always pushing to raise your personal bar up another notch.
 
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Steve House said:
The Videomic should work okay but you shouldn't expect any signifigant improvment over the camera's built-in mic.
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That is simply not true. Granted the VideoMic is consumer level as far as it's connectivity - an 1/8" mini vs. a professional XLR connection. However the mic itself is the same capsule as the NTG-1 and NTG-2 shotgun mics. I would not recommend the VideoMic for that very reason. You open yourself up to interference when you don't have a balanced XLR connection, especially if you try to extend the length of the cable. It would be OK for a camera mounted run and gun, but not good for use on a boom. The VideoMic WILL show significant improvement over the camera's built-in mic because it's MONO. Stereo mics are terrible for recording dialogue no matter how good they are. So as long as you are not getting interference in the signal the Videomic will be better than nothing, or the built-in mic.

That being said, don't just assume that a shotgun mic is what you need most. Remember that shotgun's are not designed for use indoors. Their design does not deal well with reflections off of walls, and you can get a hollow sound. So if most of your dialogue is recorded INDOORS, you heed a hypercardioid or cardioid. A good/cheap solution is the Rode NT3 or Oktiva MK12. Even cheaper, and more versatile is the Rode M3. Remember you will need both a hyper and a shotgun eventually.


Rode M3
http://www.rodemic.com/microphone.php?product=M3

At B&H
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/470247-REG/Rode_M3_M3_Multi_Powered_Cardioid_Condenser.html

Granted, this is a "cheap" solution until you make some money with that camera and can afford some awesome mics.

If a shotgun is what you really need, see how the videomic works for you. Plug it in and use it how you want to and see if the unbalanced wiring is getting interference or unwanted RF. If it does not work, maybe try the Rode NTG-2, a pretty nice/cheap mic. But I recommend the Rode NTG-3, which is very comparable to the Sennheiser 416, but at half the price.

Sennheiser MKH 416 vs. RODE NTG-3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbzNgmrCBQs

You've got a nice little camera there. Don't hurt your audio by investing in El Cheapo mics. If you get a good mic, you never have to replace it, no matter what camera you have. I understand getting SOMETHING to get going with, but you should be planning to get your real mics ASAP. Audio is actually MORE important than video. People can take some crummy image quality in a movie as long as they can hear clearly what is going on, but if the audio is crap they will move on even of the image is pristine. Anyway, the videoMic MAY hold you over until you can get together money for a real mic.
 
If you're just using it on-camera, you're looking at a very short cable run, and you're not likely to run into interference issues with the unbalanced cable.

Also, for the same price as the big/heavy M3, you can get an AT875, a short shotgun mic designed for on-camera use.
 
Chadfish said:
That is simply not true. Granted the VideoMic is consumer level as far as it's connectivity - an 1/8" mini vs. a professional XLR connection. However the mic itself is the same capsule as the NTG-1 and NTG-2 shotgun mics. I would not recommend the VideoMic for that very reason. ... Anyway, the videoMic MAY hold you over until you can get together money for a real mic.
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It's also made of plastic, unlike the NTG-1 or -2 ... but the reason I said it's not going to sound signifigantly different from the camera's built-in mics is I was guessing he's going to be using it mounted on the camera. The result of working from at or near the camera position is going to be a more important factor in determining the final sound than will be the quality of the mic itself. And in that same vein, a $250 NTG-1 boomed 20" from the subject will probably sound better than a $2250 Schoeps CMIT mounted on the camera 20 feet away. Heck even the VideoMic properly placed will sound better than a much more expensive mic improperly placed.
 
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Great.. I think I will dump the Videomic ASAP and upgrade to the AT875 shotgun plus either a Shure SM58 or A-T 8004 omni as my interview mike as recommended earlier. Probably the omni because sometimes the folks I need to talk to don't hold the mike directly in front of their face and sound drops off. I make that mistake too sometimes ;)

Fully agreed about raising the bar. I try to be the best I can be to the limit of my meagre skills, even though I don't plan to do this for a living.

The problem I'm experiencing with the Rode VM right now is that the mike volume is low, it seems to sound very muddy - both of which weren't an issue previously when I used it with a HF100, 5DMk2 and for a very short while, HMC40 (since returned). It used to be so hot that I'd flip the -10dB switch inside the batt compartment to bring the levels down.
 
Don't get the SM58. It's a great mic - I own three - but you have to "eat" the thing. If you are beyond about four inches it just doesn't cut it except on really loud sound sources. Not the best choice for ENG/EFP work.
 
Thanks for the tip :)

Is there any significant difference between the AT897 and AT875 in terms of performance? Both seem to be very close. The 897 has slightly better sensitivity on paper.
 
LoneWolf said:
Thanks for the tip :)

Is there any significant difference between the AT897 and AT875 in terms of performance? Both seem to be very close. The 897 has slightly better sensitivity on paper.
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The AT897 is more of a proper shotgun, and is a little better than the 875.

I think you should consider the Rode NTG-2 though. It's an AT897 killer, runs on battery if need be and this kit comes with a 50.00 shock mount and an XLR to Mini jack converter in case you ever record straight into a portible recorder.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/481528-REG/Rode__NTG_2_Condenser_Shotgun_Microphone.html

It's not too much more than the 897 (30.00) and you get more quality, and a great shock mount. What you get for that 30.00 is much more than you will lose wishing you had something better.
 
Steve House said:
The SM58 would work. You should anticipate the level is going to be a bit low as it is a dynamic mic with a very close working distance, vocalists tend to eat their mics. Other options that might be more suitable for interviews and streeters would include the Sennheiser MD42 omni and MD46 cardioid, the Electrovoice 635 and RE50, and the Audio Technica AT8004/8004L, none of which will break the bank at between $100 and $200.
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Quick question (to show how n00b I am :P) - if I pick up a single AT8004, does the interviewer speak into it for the question then point the mike at/pass the mike to the interviewee? ie. the mike passes back and forth depending on the speaker. Or do I buy a pair and each one holds one?
 
LoneWolf said:
Quick question (to show how n00b I am :P) - if I pick up a single AT8004, does the interviewer speak into it for the question then point the mike at/pass the mike to the interviewee? ie. the mike passes back and forth depending on the speaker. Or do I buy a pair and each one holds one?
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That's completely dependent on your preference, and the skills of the interviewer. Yes, the mic is omnidirectional, but proximity to the mic does make a difference and if the interviewer can't keep the mic up with the flow of the conversation, you'll hear it.
 
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