Rode video mic Vs Rode Stereo video mic

[ROCKMORE]

I know this subject is not new and I have read many threads, but to get directly to the point, What is the difference between the sound quality on these 2 mics. Rode Video Mic and the Stereo version? The price is close. I know camera mounted mics are trouble, but I do a lot of stock shooting in the field and work alone in the streets. In some cases I can take the mic off the camera and mount it remotely. I just need something easy to have along all the time. The AT-875r is another choice.

 

[Alex H.]

The difference is that one is stereo - completely inappropriate for dialog recording, for many reasons - and the other isn't.

 

[ROCKMORE]

Would the Rode video mic work for dialogue? I know I'm trying to get one mic that generally covers many kinds of run and gun situations, but can only carry one extra mic in addition to my Sony wired Lav. I need something to complement the Sony Lav in situations where the lav won't work. Would the Rode be more flexible than the AT 875R? I also read the 875 requires power which means it won't work directly into the camera? I just need something to start with now, but plan to add an external recorder and more audio gear as I need it when a client is paying for it.

 

[Alex H.]

I'd take the 875 over the VideoMic. While it's a great improvement over a camera's built-in mic, the RODE is still not the best mic out there for dialog... far from it, in fact.

But if lack of phantom power is your issue, consider the RODE NTG-2. It can run off a AA battery. Plus, it gives you forward compatibility for any other audio gear you may acquire in the future (mixers, recorders, anything with XLR connectivity and phantom power). As for flexibility, is will far outperform the VideoMic in that respect.

Just remember that a shotgun mic is not going to be your go-to solution for everything, especially indoors. That said, the NTG-2 behaves better indoors than many other shotguns. By the way, am I correct in assuming that you're recording straight to camera at this point? Which camera?

 

[ROCKMORE]

I'd take the 875 over the VideoMic.

Just remember that a shotgun mic is not going to be your go-to solution for everything, especially indoors. That said, the NTG-2 behaves better indoors than many other shotguns. By the way, am I correct in assuming that you're recording straight to camera at this point? Which camera?

Yes the mic will be directly into a 550D, 60D, 5d for now. But I will upgrade my camera in about 6 months when the next 5D comes out hopefully with better audio control. This mic is something I need to record some dialogue next week, but want to add a new piece of gear that I can get at least a few years out of.
So the NTG-2 is a safe choice for a shotgun. Are there any other choices in the price range that are self powered?

 

[recordingwhiz]

No offense, but if youre trying to capture decent audio please forget about going directly into the camera, any of the current DSLRs have horrible preamps regardless of AGC feature, period !!

do yourself a favor and at least go into a little recorder such as H1, or DR-07 or something of the sort, they are small lightweight and dont add much bulk, but will pay you back one thousand fold in audio quality.

at this point the built in camera preamps are worst than using the cheap crap mics.

A small recorder lets you start a path to a pretty decent audio rig, once you have the recorder, then next step is a decent mixer (eng44, 302) or something of the sort then you can prety much use any mic at that point and have a very clean recording path, and you can allways mix and match gear after.

 

[Steve House]

Yes the mic will be directly into a 550D, 60D, 5d for now. But I will upgrade my camera in about 6 months when the next 5D comes out hopefully with better audio control. This mic is something I need to record some dialogue next week, but want to add a new piece of gear that I can get at least a few years out of.
So the NTG-2 is a safe choice for a shotgun. Are there any other choices in the price range that are self powered?

Don't forget that with ANY XLR output mic such as either the Rode NTG-2 or the AT875R you will have to have an adapter, either a properly wired custom cable adapter or a device such as a Juicedlink, to convert the XLR to a 1/8 miniplug for the camera. The 875 also requires an external source of phantom power which none of the DSLRs provide so your adapter will also need to supply power for the mic as well. (The NTG-2 has an internal battery so power is not an issue but the need to adapt the mono balanced XLR mic output to a stereo unbalanced miniplug input still exists.)

 

[Chadfish]

If you like hiss you'll LOVE the audio when recording into a DSLR! 60D is particularly hissy in all the examples I have heard so far. Your best bet, if you must use the camera's audio ,is a mixer like a JuicedLink, which will give you some gain to get that signal a bit above the hisssssssssssssssss. And never do dialogue with a stereo mic please.

 

[ROCKMORE]

If you like hiss you'll LOVE the audio when recording into a DSLR! 60D is particularly hissy in all the examples I have heard so far. Your best bet, if you must use the camera's audio ,is a mixer like a JuicedLink, which will give you some gain to get that signal a bit above the hisssssssssssssssss. And never do dialogue with a stereo mic please.

I know the camera audio is not the way to go, but I do have other problems to consider. My next shoot is up a 3,000 meter volcano in East Java end of this month. Every extra piece of gear, cable and battery I have to carry myself. Another problem is finding any of this gear in this region. I did find the NTG-2 but this next shoot it may be too difficult to deal with. For now I'm going with my Sony Lav for basic audio gathering this trip, and continue my search for the best audio solution after the I get back. I hope the next 5D will be a little better regarding audio.
Thanks for all the advice, very much appreciated.

 

[ROCKMORE]

A small recorder lets you start a path to a pretty decent audio rig, once you have the recorder, then next step is a decent mixer (eng44, 302) or something of the sort then you can prety much use any mic at that point and have a very clean recording path, and you can allways mix and match gear after.

Most likely something like the 4Hn will work because I think I can record and feed into the cameras audio for a scratch sync track and monitor with headphones. Then there will be the decision of what shotgun will work best with which recorder. I've read a few posts that found mismatch problems between some of them. My gut feeling is the AT 875r and the H4N are a safe starting point on a limited budget.

 

[Chadfish]

Rockmore, I think if you look at the Zoom H1 or the Sony M10 recorders, you will see that they are very small, and will get you much better sound, though still only having a 3.5mm jack, than the DSLR. Just announce your takes and clap your hands. You can put the lav on you and the recorder in your pocket. or of you are holding the camera yourself, get a single to dual cable and go to both camera and recorder so you have a good guide track on the camera to line up to later. If the audio is important, which is should be, it's worth it. If you are taking the time to film this climb it's worth it to get the audio too. But if you can't get this gear anyway I guess you do what you can. I do know that the H1 has like a 16 hr battery life. But also with an added furry (a must have for any field recorder, or mic for that matter) for the H1 you can use the stereo mic built in for ambient sound.

 

[recordingwhiz]

Yes , an 875r and an H4n will do you wonders.

 

[ROCKMORE]

Rockmore, I think if you look at the Zoom H1 or the Sony M10 recorders

I agree completely but unfortunately the only recorder I located so far is the Zoom Q3, I've seen the H4n on a few local sites but none available. I did check out the M10 and H1 on the B&H site and they both look good but it's a 12,000 mile walk across town from here. If I can't find an H4N I'll probably have to tough it out till March or April when I get back to NYC. I did find the AT 875r, but the short version I saw at B&H may be more compact if the quality is the same. True?
I had to do an HD record today and mounted my Sony Lav in the end of a 4 ft length of PVC about the same ID and the mic. I was able to position it in front of my speaker 8 inches from her mouth. It's not perfect but not horrible either. It was in a large lobby of a hotel and the ambient noise from A/C vents was a bigger problem than any noise from the mic or camera preamp. Any port in a storm over here.
Just direct me to the best audio mic and recorder combo and I will pick them up at B&H asap. H4N & AT 875r? Thanks again Chad.

 

[Chadfish]

Couldn't you just put that Sony lav on the person rather than on the end of a pole?

I suppose the H4N and AT875 would be good. Get what you can get. Both the H4N and Tascam DR100 are pretty nice, and have XLR/Phantom. I can't remember your budget, and I thought you just said you don't have access to a store that carries these things. I thought size too was a factor which is why I suggested the small recorders. I think the Rode NTG-2 is better than the 875, and the NTG-3 is much much better than either. Also you'll need a blimp for wind if you're on a mountain top. Or maybe something smaller, yet still good in wind like the Rycote InVision Universal Camera kit: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/668031-REG/Rycote_116002_InVision_Universal_Camera_Kit.html It won't be as good as a blimp, but it is smaller and cheaper. Maybe with some tape around where the cable connects to the mic you'll be OK, but I know that mountain tops are harsh. Only you know what you can afford/carry exactly. As you noticed, the environment many times presents more noise interference than self noise from the mic or pres.

The Rycote InVision Universal Camera kits come in different sizes depending on the length of your mic, so do your research.

 

[ROCKMORE]

Couldn't you just put that Sony lav on the person rather than on the end of a pole?

I suppose the H4N and AT875 would be good. Get what you can get. Both the H4N and Tascam DR100 are pretty nice, and have XLR/Phantom. I can't remember your budget, and I thought you just said you don't have access to a store that carries these things. I thought size too was a factor which is why I suggested the small recorders. I think the Rode NTG-2 is better than the 875, and the NTG-3 is much much better than either. Also you'll need a blimp for wind if you're on a mountain top. Or maybe something smaller, yet still good in wind like the Rycote InVision Universal Camera kit: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/668031-REG/Rycote_116002_InVision_Universal_Camera_Kit.html It won't be as good as a blimp, but it is smaller and cheaper. Maybe with some tape around where the cable connects to the mic you'll be OK, but I know that mountain tops are harsh. Only you know what you can afford/carry exactly. As you noticed, the environment many times presents more noise interference than self noise from the mic or pres.

The Rycote InVision Universal Camera kits come in different sizes depending on the length of your mic, so do your research.

I went back for day 2 at the hotel seminar and audio took a turn for the worse. The Lobby was a walk in the park yesterday with hard tile walls floor and all. Today it was in a big ball room with massive A/C ducts everywhere. Very noisy. To make things worse The audio was coming from PA speakers in the corners. No audio setup could have save this. Unless I could have tied in the the house audio which I couldn't. Lucky there is a thing called studio recorded voice overs.
I put the Sony lav at the end of a tube because I didn't have enough time to put one on 20 plus people, plus trying to hide them is difficult, and when people are done talking there is always a 50% chance they will just walk away while wired, and yank the cable out of the camera.
I stood the talent 5 feet in front of my camera extended the lav right below their mouth and could even see it in the gray bar out of frame. Worked great for an emergency poor mans shotgun.
Ok, what I learned today is I need a good shotgun setup because I will use it everyday, yes again tomorrow at hotel audio hell for the final round. Mountain climbing is once in a few months at best so it's probably not wise to make that the propriety .
So the NGT-3 will most likely be the best option, I do this for a living so it's just another tool in the bag. Before I would just hire an audio guy with his gear, but times are changing. I might be able to find NGT-3 here and add a suitable recorder later.

 

[Rippie]

I went back for day 2 at the hotel seminar and audio took a turn for the worse.....Today it was in a big ball room with massive A/C ducts everywhere. Very noisy. To make things worse The audio was coming from PA speakers in the corners.

Silly me but did you consider moving to a different location? (I assume there was something in the background that HAD to be in the shot)

 

[Chadfish]

Yes the NTG-3 would be a great mic to have for general use. But remember that a hyper like the AT4053b would be the right tool when getting dialogue indoors. There are better mics, but that one is really good for the price. That being said, I have had good luck with the NTG-3 indoors. Just keep in mind that when you have the money for it the basic kit to have is:

Shotgun for Outside / With blimp, or at least a Fuzzy.
Hyper for inside
Wireless for times you can't boom.

The hyper (or even shotgun) would do much better than the lav when working with loud air ducts and piped in music, as it barely picks up anything to the sides or back of the mic, where the lav's omni pattern picks up everything around it equally.

 

[ROCKMORE]

The hyper (or even shotgun) would do much better than the lav when working with loud air ducts and piped in music, as it barely picks up anything to the sides or back of the mic, where the lav's omni pattern picks up everything around it equally.

That was exactly what I was thinking today. I had my mini lav boom inches from my subject which sounds good, but....

Now you have any good tips on filtering out background noise? I have 100GB of H-264 with audio in trouble.

Most likely I will record a 6 to 8 min V/O script in a studio, but there were a number of corporate and government heavyweights speaking so I will probably need to save a few live clips.

I have Adobe CS4 and Sound Forge on my computer, but haven't had the need to do much audio till now, except editing and final mix.

BTW Since I can only afford one mic kit at a time, what mic would cause the least damage in most situations. I think I can usually manage to blanket and carpet the sound around indoor subjects with a shotgun easier than controlling exterior locations or thing like what I had to deal with the last 2 days.

 

[ROCKMORE]

(I assume there was something in the background that HAD to be in the shot)

Corporate CEO's and Government heads of state. I had nothing to say about the location except roll camera.

 

[Chadfish]

BTW Since I can only afford one mic kit at a time, what mic would cause the least damage in most situations. I think I can usually manage to blanket and carpet the sound around indoor subjects with a shotgun easier than controlling exterior locations or thing like what I had to deal with the last 2 days.

Your pushing me in an impossible situation with that. There is no one mic that's best. A Hyper is best for indoors, and a shotgun is best for outdoors. But a shotgun will probably work more times indoors than a hyper will work outdoors. With an NTG-3 you are better off if you must use it indoors.

As far as the bad sound you have recorded, with air conditioning sometimes adding a "hi pass" filter set to 80hs or 100 hz can help to kill low hum. "Hi Pass" means that the low doesn't pass. It cuts the lows. Otherwise I can't tell without hearing. Maybe post a clip to Vimeo.