Re: 60I
- Thread starter JohnT
- Start date
Re: Re: 60I
"Interlaced" is always 60i. Scene files 1-4 are all 60i. If you're not shooting progressive of any sort, you're shooting 60i.
"Interlaced" is always 60i. Scene files 1-4 are all 60i. If you're not shooting progressive of any sort, you're shooting 60i.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: Re: 60I
The only "menu setting" you'll see is when you select "progressive scan" -- the choices are 24P, 24PA, 30P or "off". Interlaced (60i) is selected when progressive is "off".
You can also see 60i if you push the "counter" button a few times -- it'll change from timecode to a counter to user bits, and then to a frame rate display, which will show 30P or 24P or 60i.
The only "menu setting" you'll see is when you select "progressive scan" -- the choices are 24P, 24PA, 30P or "off". Interlaced (60i) is selected when progressive is "off".
You can also see 60i if you push the "counter" button a few times -- it'll change from timecode to a counter to user bits, and then to a frame rate display, which will show 30P or 24P or 60i.
Re: Re: 60I
It's smoother slo-mo if it's 60i. It's higher resolution, but not as smooth, if it's 30p.
It's smoother slo-mo if it's 60i. It's higher resolution, but not as smooth, if it's 30p.
Re: 60I
Re: 60I
Maybe it is a stupid question, but...
If I shoot 24pa, then stop the recording, switch to 60i to shoot a scene that will be slow'mo on editing, then continue to shoot in 24pa....When I'll capture the DV into Vegas5 in a 24p timeline, what will happen ??! (don't say I'm gonna die or anything, this is a real question
) Is it a way to work or if I wan to do a 24p project it has to be all in 24p...?
Thanks!
Re: 60I
Maybe it is a stupid question, but...
If I shoot 24pa, then stop the recording, switch to 60i to shoot a scene that will be slow'mo on editing, then continue to shoot in 24pa....When I'll capture the DV into Vegas5 in a 24p timeline, what will happen ??! (don't say I'm gonna die or anything, this is a real question
) Is it a way to work or if I wan to do a 24p project it has to be all in 24p...?Thanks!
Re: Re: 60I
It's all captured as 60i. Your NLE removes the pulldown on the timeline.
As for using the 60i in the 24p timeline, I believe this is handled differently per your NLE. Which one are you using?
It's all captured as 60i. Your NLE removes the pulldown on the timeline.
As for using the 60i in the 24p timeline, I believe this is handled differently per your NLE. Which one are you using?
Re: Re: 60I
I *believe* (though Barry or Jive might want to follow behind me on this) you simply drop the 60i footage into the timeline, and will run 20% slower, with smooth slo-mo, but at half resolution. You can then render out the project as 24p.
Though there might be some prep work you have to do with the 60i footage first (though I don't think so) -- guys?
I *believe* (though Barry or Jive might want to follow behind me on this) you simply drop the 60i footage into the timeline, and will run 20% slower, with smooth slo-mo, but at half resolution. You can then render out the project as 24p.
Though there might be some prep work you have to do with the 60i footage first (though I don't think so) -- guys?
Re: 60I
Re: 60I
Thanks for the infos...
1) So, since I lose significant resolution when shooting at 60i instead of 24p, for slow'mo should I simply shoot in 30p for those shots and use some plug-ins to smooth it, like Twixtor ? (because I will probably slow it more than just a 24/30 ratio...)
2) If I shoot in 24pa instead of 24p, and mix it with 30p footage, if I do the correct pulldowns for each clip (24pa and 30p) it should be able to cohabitate in the same timeline ? I hope those questions makes sens, I think I get the basics of 24p/24pa/30p/60i but when it comes to the captured version of the clips I'm a little confused :-[
Re: 60I
Thanks for the infos...
1) So, since I lose significant resolution when shooting at 60i instead of 24p, for slow'mo should I simply shoot in 30p for those shots and use some plug-ins to smooth it, like Twixtor ? (because I will probably slow it more than just a 24/30 ratio...)
2) If I shoot in 24pa instead of 24p, and mix it with 30p footage, if I do the correct pulldowns for each clip (24pa and 30p) it should be able to cohabitate in the same timeline ? I hope those questions makes sens, I think I get the basics of 24p/24pa/30p/60i but when it comes to the captured version of the clips I'm a little confused :-[
Re: Re: 60I
It doesn't matter if it's 24pN or 24pA in the timeline -- it's all 24p once the pulldown is removed. There's some debate as to whether 24pA has a theoretical higher image quality, but that's irrelevant as to whether you can use them both on the same timeline. You can. No prob.
30p will definitely be treated as 24p on the 24p timeline and run 20% slower. It's up to you which works better for you -- higher resolution but slightly choppier or smoother motion but less resolution. If you can use twixtor to smooth it out (don't know anything about it), then 30p might be the way to go.
With 60i, you lose half your resolution.
It doesn't matter if it's 24pN or 24pA in the timeline -- it's all 24p once the pulldown is removed. There's some debate as to whether 24pA has a theoretical higher image quality, but that's irrelevant as to whether you can use them both on the same timeline. You can. No prob.
30p will definitely be treated as 24p on the 24p timeline and run 20% slower. It's up to you which works better for you -- higher resolution but slightly choppier or smoother motion but less resolution. If you can use twixtor to smooth it out (don't know anything about it), then 30p might be the way to go.
With 60i, you lose half your resolution.
Re: 60I
Re: 60I
Thanks for clarifying those things to me, I think I'm gonna stay in 24p(n/a) and will try to smooth out the slow motions instead of losing resolution in the middle of a clip.
If you're interested, you can take a look at http://www.revisionfx.com/rstwixtor.htm about twistor. It did not used i yet but it seems not too bad, has been used in feature films like Blade2 and Driven. You can use it in Combustion (mmmm), after effect, premiere...all pc based of course I don't know on which platform you work.
I tried before RealViz ReTimer, with interlaced footage from a consumer camcorder and got some nice results too, but processing time is terrible. It does not only blend the frames it will interpolate the actual motion between frames to insert new frames. Hardcore maths behind this piece of software
Re: 60I
Thanks for clarifying those things to me, I think I'm gonna stay in 24p(n/a) and will try to smooth out the slow motions instead of losing resolution in the middle of a clip.
If you're interested, you can take a look at http://www.revisionfx.com/rstwixtor.htm about twistor. It did not used i yet but it seems not too bad, has been used in feature films like Blade2 and Driven. You can use it in Combustion (mmmm), after effect, premiere...all pc based of course I don't know on which platform you work.
I tried before RealViz ReTimer, with interlaced footage from a consumer camcorder and got some nice results too, but processing time is terrible. It does not only blend the frames it will interpolate the actual motion between frames to insert new frames. Hardcore maths behind this piece of software
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: 60I
Re: 60I
[quote author=David Jimerson link=board=Events;num=1088381542;start=0#12 date=06/29/04 at 19:22:42]
With 60i, you lose half your resolution.
[/quote]
You lose half your VERTICAL resolution, but you gain twice as much TEMPORAL resolution. (well, actually 2.4 times as much).
To use 60i in a 24P timeline, just drop the clip in and tell it to play at 40% playback speed. You may want to adjust the frame blending options to taste.
You can try using Twixtor on 30P footage... I've seen it do amazing things, Stephen Van Vuuren showed some footage on DVINFO.NET that he had shot on a still camera at 2 frames per second, and then rendered it through Twixtor to be 24 or 30 frames per second -- and it was amazing what the program could do. It wasn't perfect, it was in fact unacceptable as a complete simulation of 24P or 30P, but... well, it's kind of like a dog walking on only its hind legs. The amazing part isn't how well a dog does that (because it doesn't do it well at all, as compared to a human) but the amazing part is that the dog can do it *at all*.
Twixtor may work for you. I've downloaded it and played with it a few times, never could get a reliable, consistent slow-mo effect that looked good in all circumstances, so I quit trying. Now I use 60i->24P and get very smooth (if somewhat lower resolution) footage. Your mileage may indeed vary.
Re: 60I
[quote author=David Jimerson link=board=Events;num=1088381542;start=0#12 date=06/29/04 at 19:22:42]
With 60i, you lose half your resolution.
[/quote]
You lose half your VERTICAL resolution, but you gain twice as much TEMPORAL resolution. (well, actually 2.4 times as much).
To use 60i in a 24P timeline, just drop the clip in and tell it to play at 40% playback speed. You may want to adjust the frame blending options to taste.
You can try using Twixtor on 30P footage... I've seen it do amazing things, Stephen Van Vuuren showed some footage on DVINFO.NET that he had shot on a still camera at 2 frames per second, and then rendered it through Twixtor to be 24 or 30 frames per second -- and it was amazing what the program could do. It wasn't perfect, it was in fact unacceptable as a complete simulation of 24P or 30P, but... well, it's kind of like a dog walking on only its hind legs. The amazing part isn't how well a dog does that (because it doesn't do it well at all, as compared to a human) but the amazing part is that the dog can do it *at all*.
Twixtor may work for you. I've downloaded it and played with it a few times, never could get a reliable, consistent slow-mo effect that looked good in all circumstances, so I quit trying. Now I use 60i->24P and get very smooth (if somewhat lower resolution) footage. Your mileage may indeed vary.