Questions about field monitors, audio and lenses

S

Sultan

New member
Hello everyone,

im currently in the market for a camera upgrade. and i like what the new Sony FS700 offering.

anyway here are my questions:

1- i want to buy an external mic ( i currently own a Zoom H4N ) and i was thinking about the RODE NTG-3 ( if u have any suggestions for a better mic within the same price range please do tell ) and was wondering would it be better to connect it right to the FS700 or the Zoom H4N?

2- also im in for a monitor what would u suggest ( i need a monitor the i can mount with the shoulder rig and crane etc... ) i would prefer a 7" and a price range of $500-$1000

3- as for the lenses i have a $3000 budget for new lenses what do u think about the Tokina 11-16 f2.8 lens also what do u think about the prime Carl Zeiss lenses especially the 50mm and 85mm comparing to the canon? ( im getting the Metabones adapter )


Thanks alot!
 
On 1)The issue with the NTG-3 is that it's phantom only, so if connected to the zoom, it will burn batteries on it quick. However, you'll probably get identical or even better results going straight into the fs700, the zoom's amps are about the same quality as camera amps. Also the Sony batteries will last quite a lot longer than the zoom's double AA's, but I think I saw a test somewhere and somebody got over an hour out of the zoom on phantom, so not that bad. Otherwise ntg-3 is about as high of quality as you can get in that range (new) sometimes you can pick up some pretty nice mic's used though.

2) other people would be better qualified than me to answer on this so I'll skip

3) Tokina 11-16 is very high quality, moreso than it's price suggests. Instead of the Zeiss, look into this new crop of Rokinon/Samyang cine primes, about a quarter the price and many are reviewing at similar performance, although nothing looks quite like a zeiss - for better or worse. Also there is a new 35mm f.95 E mount only that is about $800 - it got a really good reviews, comparing favorably to the 35mm zeiss.
 
The NTG3 is very good +1 on that. We run to a separate audio recorder anyway, so not sure about plugging it straight in, i know a lot of sound recordists would not like that.

The Small HD DP6 is very good, but it lacks a waveform which the more expensive TV Logic one has, you can judge focus pretty well on a 720p panel (the DP6)

I'd consider looking at the Samyung VDSLR range, i'm going to do a proper comparison between the 35 f1.4 and the Contax Zeiss 35 f1.4, superficially it looks pretty close. Also that e mount 35 is the Mitakon 0.95 35mm. It's actually really nice - it's T0.95 so actually more like f0.92 and has a clickless aperture. Mechanically it's okay, it's not a zeiss or leica but image quality is shockingly good, even wide open. I also have the Nokton 50mm f1.1 and i think it's better than that. I can't compare to the Noctilux only through other photos.

I'm using it as a stills lens at the moment and i'm enjoying using it. Not sure you'd want to be pulling focus at T0.95 though... I'm not aware of a faster 35mm out there, anywhere...

cheers
paul
 
Small HD DP 6 is really good as I have one.

As for lenses, I have Canon Ls, Zeiss ZFs and even a Samyang 35mm f1.4. I think overall mechanics, Zeiss is by far the best. Samyang is a manual lens, but it has a pretty short focus throw for manual. The Canon Ls at 180 degree focus throw is longer than the Samyang. Canon Ls have the best image technically, as the Zeiss ZFs (50mm and 85mm) suffer from higher (and very noticeable) chromatic aberrations (aka purple fringing) when compared to my similar Canons Ls.

It's a tough choice between Canon L primes and Zeiss. Zeiss has the better mechanics and you don't need an electronic adapter like the Metabones and they are more future proof. But, the Canon Ls in 24mm and 35mm are 1 stop faster than the comparable Zeiss lens in the same price range and the Canon 50mm and 85mm are cleaner, more CA free image than Zeiss.

Zeiss has really interesting colors though.

I think if I were to only get 1 set (24mm, 35mm, 50mm, 85mm), I would probably get the Zeiss even though the 24mm and the 35mm (the affordable f2 version) are 1 stop slower than the Canons. But the mechanics are so good on the Zeiss and they are just easier and more universal to adapt and more future proof.

If you had the money and had to choose between Zeiss or Samyang, I would get the Zeiss even for a few grand more. I'm probably going to sell my Samyang 35mm f1.4. Just not crazy about the look and the mechanics are just OK especially since the focus throw is shorter than the Canon Ls.

As for Zooms, the Tokina 11-16 is great and Canon makes great zooms (the IS is super useful).
 
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1) - not a clue... i have the mic that came with the camera for scratch track, sound guys do the real deal

2) - my focus puller uses a DP6, i use a Cineroid to operate, but it also does 1:1 and has peaking, so quite usefull on it's own.

3) - 3K only for glass? i think i would look at an Angenieux 28-70 in F mount, Zeiss 80-200 in CA mount, and a Tokina 16-28 in F mount, then hunt for a deal on the Rokinon 24/35/85 in F mount & Nikor 50/105.

If i could only have one lens it would be the Angenieux, i have matching one for each of my camera's... hard to find, and in the 1K range when you do, worth every penny.. the first gen Tokina version is an option, i have one of those as well as a backup, it's prety good opticaly, flares a bit more as the Angenieux version has a hard matte on the front, Tokina is alot cheaper, both price and build quality.

i use the Zeiss 16-35 on my A cam, but have short Tokina on B cam, usualy i prefer to take the Zeiss from A cam over the Tokina, but if i need short lens on both (small room, inside a car etc etc) it's workable, and the short Zeiss blows your budget

The long Zeiss is a bit hard to find, but a great lens and can be found for under $400, i might pay to get the CA on the long Zeiss changed to F so one adpt can live on the camera and you don't need to be so worried about picking up sensor dirt when swapping glass.

That leaves about 1K left for primes... Rokinon 35 & 85 and a Nikkor 50 1.4 should take most of that, but if there's any wiggle room a Nikkor 105, and the Rokinon 24 would be next on my list.

I avoid Canon glass as they are pain to use on anything but a Canon camera, same deal with A mount, the F mount universal and i don't really use autofocus, auto iris, or image stablisation anyway (my exception being pogpcam'n, there E/A/L mount for auto focus comes in usefull, and was a reason to have the A mount short Zeiss) and the auto adptors be it Sony for A mount or Metabones for L also take alot from your budget
 
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My two cents as an old school audio guy. The Zoom H4N is not the best choice for an external microphone as the internal preamps
are also able to deal with line inputs without any kind of internal attenuation. The result is noisy recordings when using microphones. I have personally experienced this with
The Rodes NTG-3 in an actual shoot (using a 5D) I can assure you that the mic pre amps in the FS700 are much quieter and have a nice range of
attenuation/boost in the menu. I have done real world tests and it is much cleaner than the Zoom. Now having said that, you can't record 24 bit audio
with the Sony. But for my money a 24 bit recording of a lot of noise is pretty useless.
I now have an external microphone preamp that I use in conjunction with the Zoom which gives me the best results of all.
 
Dermot said:
1) - not a clue... i have the mic that came with the camera for scratch track, sound guys do the real deal

2) - my focus puller uses a DP6, i use a Cineroid to operate, but it also does 1:1 and has peaking, so quite usefull on it's own.

3) - 3K only for glass? i think i would look at an Angenieux 28-70 in F mount, Zeiss 80-200 in CA mount, and a Tokina 16-28 in F mount, then hunt for a deal on the Rokinon 24/35/85 in F mount & Nikor 50/105.

If i could only have one lens it would be the Angenieux, i have matching one for each of my camera's... hard to find, and in the 1K range when you do, worth every penny.. the first gen Tokina version is an option, i have one of those as well as a backup, it's prety good opticaly, flares a bit more as the Angenieux version has a hard matte on the front, Tokina is alot cheaper, both price and build quality.

i use the Zeiss 16-35 on my A cam, but have short Tokina on B cam, usualy i prefer to take the Zeiss from A cam over the Tokina, but if i need short lens on both (small room, inside a car etc etc) it's workable, and the short Zeiss blows your budget

The long Zeiss is a bit hard to find, but a great lens and can be found for under $400, i might pay to get the CA on the long Zeiss changed to F so one adpt can live on the camera and you don't need to be so worried about picking up sensor dirt when swapping glass.

That leaves about 1K left for primes... Rokinon 35 & 85 and a Nikkor 50 1.4 should take most of that, but if there's any wiggle room a Nikkor 105, and the Rokinon 24 would be next on my list.

I avoid Canon glass as they are pain to use on anything but a Canon camera, same deal with A mount, the F mount universal and i don't really use autofocus, auto iris, or image stablisation anyway (my exception being pogpcam'n, there E/A/L mount for auto focus comes in usefull, and was a reason to have the A mount short Zeiss) and the auto adptors be it Sony for A mount or Metabones for L also take alot from your budget
Click to expand...


So I just bought one of the Angenieux 28-70 2.6's - I can't judge image quality yet, but focus throw is very very short - less than 90 degrees - is that the case on yours?
 
gene_can_sing said:
Zeiss is by far the best. Samyang is a manual lens, but it has a pretty short focus throw for manual. The Canon Ls at 180 degree focus throw is longer than the Samyang. Canon Ls have the best image technically, as the Zeiss ZFs (50mm and 85mm) suffer from higher (and very noticeable) chromatic aberrations (aka purple fringing) when compared to my similar Canons Ls.
Click to expand...

Which Zeiss and which Samyung?

I have the Contax Zeiss 35mm f1.4 and the focus throw on that is insanely short - one of the main reasons i'd considering moving away, i thought the ZF/ZE versions had a similarly short focus throw.

The Samyung i got to have a look at is the VDSLR version, so smooth aperture and the reversed writing (for an operator) however the focus throw on that really isn't too bad, maybe 160 degrees. So i wonder if Samyung changed the mechanics of these lenses - i never had the DSLR version of the lens to test with.

I will pit the Samyung and Contax head to head to see how they compare optically as well

cheers
paul
 
+1 on the Rode NTG-3... even though a sound guy is nice to have, when I'm doing solo jobs I either accept it being on the camera for run&gun and when I have time to do sit downs or similar, I pull out my BoomBuddy put it on a stand and fly in a Rode boom pole with the AT4053b on it or the NTG-3.
I can confirm that the sound that comes from the FS internal preamps indeed are as good or better than the Zoom.
 
From my collection, Zeiss ZFs have about 215 degrees of focus throw, Canon Ls about 180 and Samyang about 165 or so. Samyang is definitely less than the Ls
 
gene_can_sing said:
From my collection, Zeiss ZFs have about 215 degrees of focus throw, Canon Ls about 180 and Samyang about 165 or so. Samyang is definitely less than the Ls
Click to expand...

Interesting i wonder why the Contax Zeiss version is so short compared to it's ZF successor. Although images of the 35 ZF seem to suggest around 90 degrees of travel, with very little distance between the 1m and infinity (where it can really hurt pulling focus). Do you have the 35 in ZF?

The 28 f2 by comparison is quite a bit longer then the 35 and then the 50,85 and especially 100 have long throws again stills lenses have different scales on the focus compared to cine, that's something rarely discussed.

cheers
Paul
 
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