Question about dialog editing.

I just tried it with Audition, but it won't let me click on it. The crossfade is grey, in the sense that you cannot use it at that time or for that purpose, but haven't been able to figure out how to get it so it's "click-able".
 
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In some programs the crossfade has to be a minimum I think...

But anyway... cutting and pasting sylabs is not the right way... It will sound very strange.

What can be done is searching one sylab when in a word there's a annoying sound.

For example: "hee you, watch out, for that doggy". And on the ggy from doggy there's a WIOJJOEJIIE sound.
So now you can search for the same sounding "ggy" sound and add it (or even better replace "doggy".

But you can't cut "he, e, y, ou, w, a, t, ch, ou, t, f, or, th, at, do, g, gy" out of different takes and just paste them together.
 
Okay thanks. So I should just copy and paste the whole line and just either add in or cut on little parts in between? I tried getting the actors to redub them but not all are exact matches. Some however, even though not enough, look like it will pass? Is it too risky to match them up exactly?
 
Well I tried uploading it sound cloud, but soundcloud would not accept it cause there was video, and I tried youtube, but only the video will upload. I don't know... Even if I uploaded it what you will hear are popping sounds in the syllables, would that help you identify the problem? Audition's crossfade is still not 'click-able', and the crossfades in Premiere Pro, still do not work. Adding a track of room tone still does not help, and the popping sounds just the same. I can't afford vocalign right now. But before vocalign existed, movies were still made anyway, so there must be some way to solve this problem.
 
ironpony said:
Well I tried uploading it sound cloud, but soundcloud would not accept it cause there was video, and I tried youtube, but only the video will upload. I don't know... Even if I uploaded it what you will hear are popping sounds in the syllables, would that help you identify the problem?
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Yes... "popping" could mean a few things, so it's helpful for us to hear what you're hearing. You need to export audio and video together into a single video file, then upload that. YouTube shouldn't be stripping the audio unless it's detecting copyrighted material. If it's just your video with original dialog, there shouldn't be a problem. Maybe try Vimeo?

ironpony said:
Adding a track of room tone still does not help, and the popping sounds just the same. I can't afford vocalign right now. But before vocalign existed, movies were still made anyway, so there must be some way to solve this problem.
Click to expand...

Adding the room tone underneath the edit isn't going to cover anything up if the edit is bad.
 
ironpony said:
But before vocalign existed, movies were still made anyway, so there must be some way to solve this problem.
Click to expand...

Well not to be snide they were and they were edited by sound editors. People have given you the "easy answers" and either they don't work or your not doing it right. It's hard to tell which since you don't sound like you have any real sound experience.

I don't know Audition, but it is not a common app for film sound (yet?). You can't with out great effort get decent results cutting sound in a picture editing app like Premiere, FCP, Avid, etc.

It is also hard to get decent results if you don't know what you are doing and do not have a mentor who can be WITH you to see just what is going on.

Folks love analogies so it's a little like saying you want a really smooth running car. Your going to do your own repairs and you have a screwdriver and a hammer. Depending on the repair you might be fine but for many things you are going to have to get better tools and more knowledge.

That seems like your situation here. You have probably done all you can do with the hammer and now you either need a better tool or someone with more knowledge to help you.

This forum is a bit limited because we can only talk about it. To paraphrase "talking about sound is like dancing about art". You have to hear it or at least talk the same language.

You started off talking about popping on cuts and now it's popping on syllables. Not sure what that is. Could be your cutting into the sound because your using a frame bound app, could be the hiccup because your edit is not all that it could be. May be just the discontinuity and your calling it a pop but a sound person wouldn't. That is why folks are asking to hear what you are talking about. BTW you don't need to send picture for this problem. Nobody knows what YOU are talking about when you say "popping". They are guessing based on what THEY would call popping. But it's just as likely that you are talking about something a sound person would not call popping.

Don't know where you are but there isn't a place with decent internet that is too far from a sound person. Find someone local to help you.

OR get someone on this forum? There are people here you could send the files to and have it done.

Personally unless I wanted to do sound for a living I would have someone who does do this. They will do it faster, and better.
 
ironpony said:
But before vocalign existed, movies were still made anyway, so there must be some way to solve this problem.
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Well, sure... if one is to use 'real(tm)' movie productions as a guide... if the sound one has, is so bad, and the shot is necessary... there are two options. 1) reshoot the scene. 2) ADR the sound.

If the actors aren't up to 'ADR'... and you can't reshoot the scene... and the dialog is absolutely essential... do what Orson Welles did... Dub it yourself...
 
X100 what Noiz said, it just sounds like the problem needs to be heard and fixed by an experienced person with the right tools.

you cant replace talent or experience with ambition.

sadly Im willing to bet that at least 3 or 4 of the people responding to this post could have it fixed inside of 10 minutes if they had the files.

Good luck
 
Thanks but, I did ADR the scene. I have good ADR, but I just can't match it up without the popping. The original ADR recordings are good though, just when they are lined up with the scene there are several pops. Okay I finally was able to get the sound on youtube. Here's an ADR sentence:

http://youtu.be/n5irT_Kj0c8

So the line is 'I have nothing'. I had to ADR the nothing again, since that word did not get recorded well. But when I synced it up, it's all poppy sounding.
 
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ironpony said:
Thanks but, I did ADR the scene. I have good ADR, but I just can't match it up without the popping. The original ADR recordings are good though, just when they are lined up with the scene there are several pops. I will try to get the files on here again.
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Sorry but that is like being slightly pregnant. Out of sync ADR is not "good". They won't be "good" till they are in sync AND you have filled in all the FX and Foley that is needed.

What you have are recordings of dialog that you like done after the shoot. If you had good ADR you wouldn't be here looking for help.

I'm not trying to rag on you but you have to be realistic about the situation.

Looking at your other posts you are taking on a HUGE amount of very difficult tasks for a first film. So really look at what is needed. It's much better for you to realize you bit off too much and chalk it up to experience than to get completely frustrated by it all.

We are not trying to make you feel bad but you are talking sync and "pops' as if it's just a simple thing. It's not. Studios would hire high school students with Pro Tools Le in a heartbeat if they thought they could get by with it. And to be clear I am not an ADR editor. I have done some but I am not a big star ADR editor. What they do is magic.

A profesional ADR editor is only going to get through 10 -20 "lines" a day (11 hour day). A star may be doing 30 but that is a lot. They are using really good tools and have a LOT of experience. It's not that you are "bad" or incompetent. It's a LOT of work and it's not easy to do a good job. It's a big job for someone who knows what they are doing. You are working very old school (straight cuts) with less than optimum tools. Figure even an experienced editor would probably take twice as long to cut given the same limitations you have a long haul to get good results.

It's not that it can't be done but it's a LOTTTTTT of work. It sounds like you think if you can just get someone to tell you the "secret" it will all be good. The "secret" is lots of experience and lots of time.

So if you want to do it that is good. But realize your an underdog and you will have to work your butt off to get good results. If you pull that off you get major Karma points and I want you in my address book. But it's also no shame to realize it's too much with everything else.

I still recommend having a sound person work with you. Filmmaking is a TEAM sport and the sooner you start working with a team the sooner you will start doing better at what you really want to do.
 
Okay thanks. I would like to learn for future projects though. Perhaps I will try to find a tutor but have been looking and no one where I live knows about matching ADR. Did you hear the clip I posted? http://youtu.be/n5irT_Kj0c8 Basically when he says Nothing it pops, cause nothing had to be redubbed into the scene.
 
Sounds like severe clipping to me, either in the initial (or ADR) recording or in the NLE or DAW.
If it's on the recording audio file, I have doubts any restoration software can adequately fix it either.
How about grabbing the audio from an OK sounding outtake.. or inserting the same word from another line somewhere. (which may or may not work)
 
Yes it does sound like overloading. But it also sounds very robotic. I'm assuming that is the editing. Sync is important but it's more important to keep it sounding like a human actually said it. It might be better with more context, as in a longer clip, since if that is a really bad bit and the rest of the edits sound good you can probably futz it to sound OK. But if it all sounds that choppy and you don't want it to sound like a robot you have a problem.
 
Okay thanks, but the original take actually does not clip. It only sounds like that, after I sync it up with the syllables. That's the popping I was talking about. I don't have any soundtakes from the shoot where that line was recorded well. The originals clipped, so I did ADR and those ones are fine, but they sound clipped after syncing it up with video. I had to cut the word down a just a tad to match the syllables, but in between the cuts, it sounds clipped, or 'popping'.
 
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Well this isn't the only line, all the ADR sounds like this, after it's synced up. But sounds good and not clipped before syncing. How do I sync it up so it doesn't make those popping sounds? The crossfade in audition is still highlighted grey and is not 'clickable'.
 
Perhaps I missed it, but what exactly do you mean by the phrase "sync it with the syllables"? Did you try to cut individual syllables out of words and replace them with other syllables from other takes or do you mean cutting up words between syllables so you can establish lip sync to the picture on a syllable-by-syllable basis? Step-by-step, what software did you use, what exactly did you do, and how did you do it? Can you make the original source and edited, but un-YouTube processed, versions of that clip available for download somewhere so we can load it into an editor and view the actual waveform of both your raw and edited tracks?
 
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