Problem...Greed and Prizemoney

[Olaf99]

Yeah, this gets into a bigger issue that I think most people (the bottom 99% of the nation) have trouble reconciling. They'll rush out to the theatre to see a movie because Brad Pitt is in it, and then turn around and complain that he's making so much money. Or they'll give all of their retirement funds to someone to invest in Citigroup which pays the CEO millions of dollars, but then ***** when the CEO gets paid mass moolah.

If you don't think Brad Pitt should make millions of dollars, don't see his movies. If you don't think Brian Urlacher should make millions of dollars, don't buy his jersey. If you don't think the CEO of Citi should be getting 100 million dollar bonuses -- don't invest in Citi.

Most of the top 1% are there because we support them being there.

Again, though, to this topic -- it really does sound like the right people got the correct percentage. The director, honestly, should have gotten even more because it was his equipment that was used in the shoot! And, I mean, let's face it, 90% of the time the guy walking away with the most money is going to have the title Producer. If you wanted to make more money off of this you should have been a producer. They paid you 15 bucks an hour for what was, I'm assuming, a pretty good time with your friends. You and your brother should be waving your cash saying, "Hey! We have 500 bucks to invest in the next project!" THIS will get you on the bill as a producer, see?

You and your brother should know that friends and creative collaborators are oft times irreplacable. You can't do the business of making films alone. You need people aroung you. Some are going to be concerned about the money, some are going to be concerned about the artistry. You need both. Go back and make amends with these guys and move onto the next project. You guys won! You should be focused on the next project -- putting these winnings into the next project -- not bickering.

I agree with this totally. It does suck that you had different expectations about the dollar amount though. In my experience making shorts I provide cameras, tripods, makeup, props, location (in most cases), pizza, beer, lighting. My duties include writing the script, storyboarding, directing, shooting, lighting (except hauling stuff around and plugging it all in), editing, and music.

If the guys who haul the lights, did two sound effects, and applied the makeup want to get more of the prize money than I offer them they can take a flying leap. I entered a contest with a $5000 prize (didn't win) and figured on giving everyone 10%. If they want to argue I'll list how much money I spent in the last two years for equipment:
-DVX 100b
-iMac
-Final Cut
-Fluid Head Tripod
-DOF adapter
-Polarizing lens
-Lights lights and more lights
-Special effects makeup and contact lenses
-etc etc

There's just no way they can compete since we're all amateurs and I've spent $6-7 K on this black hole they call independent film making.

 

[chris f]

You have reasonable and what I would call fair points. Now take your $250 and forget about it. In future you will know to get something in writing before you shoot.

Sadly if you take legal action, youre the one most likely to seem the one to have sour grapes. And theres a reasonable chance you would lose and then be lumped with legal costs. Then you would have dragged yourself through all this pain for months for what? An extra $100? Seriously consider throwing on a smile and learn from it and move forward. Youll be much better off in the long run.

This is the best advice. Be happy you got any money at all and learn from the experience (ie. from now on don't work on projects without having a written agreement of what your deferred pay will be should the film go on to make money, unless you're OK with being at the mercy of the producers).

If it makes you feel any better a few years ago I produced a music video for a local band ( I did everything: pre-production, DP, Grip, Rented the gear, Location scout, edited, sent it into the local TV station, etc.) and they were extremely grateful and knew that they should be paying me a ton, but we had a verbal agreement that I'd do it for free and they would just pay for a few of the equipment rental fees because they were broke and I just wanted to make my first music video.

Long story short, the video wins a statewide competition for best local music video, they call me from across the country celebrating saying that they owe everything to me and then turn around and use $1,200 of the prize money to buy some equipment and pay off their studio bill and gave me $300.

I was bitter for a while and then finally decided that I should be happy I got anything because I wasn't expecting anything in the first place. Fast forward 2 years and they just called me to make their next video and want to know how much they need to pay me.

 

[Martay]

Very true in all the points suggested, just surprising to actually face firsthand the corruption of "brother against brother" when money is concerned...so much for the value of friendship.

Yeah, welcome to the film biz.

This happens all the time. I usually get minor burns from friends once before I have to treat them "all business".

Ultimately, it's just professional to do so, but It would be nice to be able to do favors and get rewarded for your efforts without having to struggle.

Short memories.

-M

 

[Kingswell]

Hey Speculator,

Really sorry to about your situation. I studied law for 3 years in England, so i'm not sure how applicable this may be to your situation in the U.S but i'm sure the major components of contract law are universal in most legal systems. Alot of people have stated that you should've got something written down which, any lawyer, would state is highly advisable. However oral contracts are just as legally enforceable, and as you stated in post 16 you had made such an oral agreement. There are some other components needed to prove a contract was made and a breach of contract actually took place, but i won't bore you with them.

Whether if it's advisable to actually take your friends to court (we have a small claims court in the U.K for such actions) is debatable. I'm almost certain you'll create some deep, probably unrepairable rifts. I wouldn't suggest any sort of legal actions.

My advice, if you haven't already done so, would to be to all actually meet face to face. Meet in a neutral location, get a friends of the group who wasn't involved with the project to mediate and sort things out.

Andy

Although the prize money division was orally agreed to be fairly split since pre-production and agreed to meetup with everyone involved to talk about it, the 3 eventually privately agreed among themselves that of the $3900 in prize money received, the actors of the film should receive $15 while the 3 other above the line members should receive $250 each.

 

[Douglas Thigpen]

I agree with the majority of others here. Live and learn, and leave it behind you.