FAQ Please help me decide which EVF to go with for my B-cam rig

Thanks man, but would you be so nice and elaborate with a bit more details please?

- toggling data display : how do you do it exactly; can a function button be used for it, or do you just have the Toggle in your user menu?

- why exactly do you use SD1 in one and SDI2 in the other scenario? Please do explain so that I don't invent the wheel again :) TIA

Piotr
 
there is a button called display right under the AF focus Switch on the FS7 switches characters on and off.
I use SDI1 for viewfinder and 2 for a monitor where I or my AC can see the display when shooting locked down. It really doesn't matter much one gives you a constant clean output the other lets yo show display.

moldcad said:
Thanks man, but would you be so nice and elaborate with a bit more details please?

- toggling data display : how do you do it exactly; can a function button be used for it, or do you just have the Toggle in your user menu?

- why exactly do you use SD1 in one and SDI2 in the other scenario? Please do explain so that I don't invent the wheel again :) TIA

Piotr
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Makes sense, thanks.

What does everyone think about setting WFM source to MLUTed vs. pre-MLUTed signal when shooting in Cine EI? It would sound logical to monitor the same signal which is actually recorded (i.e. not with MLUT on) - but on the other hand, Alister does seem to have a point when suggesting the whole Exposure Index concept is monitoring the MLUTed picture's exposure...

Also, for those who've been using a Gratical EVF with OLED display: how prone is it to burn in in real life, actually? All Zacuto's documentation for their Gratical line of viewfinders stress it very often that it's a real danger, but I hope my expensive Eye will last before it's totally burnt-in?

Piotr
 
moldcad said:
Makes sense, thanks.

What does everyone think about setting WFM source to MLUTed vs. pre-MLUTed signal when shooting in Cine EI? It would sound logical to monitor the same signal which is actually recorded (i.e. not with MLUT on) - but on the other hand, Alister does seem to have a point when suggesting the whole Exposure Index concept is monitoring the MLUTed picture's exposure...

Also, for those who've been using a Gratical EVF with OLED display: how prone is it to burn in in real life, actually? All Zacuto's documentation for their Gratical line of viewfinders stress it very often that it's a real danger, but I hope my expensive Eye will last before it's totally burnt-in?

Piotr
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Again each to their own.. no right or wrong way.. just use what ever method makes sense to you.. myself I go for post LUT.. to me it makes sense to have everything reading from the image Im seeing in the EVF.. I always use REC709-800 shooting EI.. I have the high/low on assign and toggle that now and again..
Re the burn in.. I think it can happen quite quickly.. if Zacuto are covering their butt .. there is probably good reason.. it would happen to any EVF.. I go with EYE frame lines.. but MLUT from the camera.. toggle on camera info as needed.. unfortunately the EYE doesn't seem to read battery info from my batts ..IDX Duo.. .. annoying but not the end of the world..
 
Thanks Donny, I also feel more comfortable with my WFM reflecting the actually displayed picture which is the Rec. 709(800); also this is consistent with zebras which cannot show the 'clean' signal 's levels... What I'm missing with Gratical Eye is the High Key /Low Key display.

Piotr
 
Why not just use the FS7 MLUT on your feed? That will then respond to Cine EI rating switch and high/low key etc, no?
 
Now the time for some less positive impressions ; I realize those who spent nearly $2000 on their 'Gratical Wonders' might not admit they have similar reservations, but here are mine anyway...

1. Considering how vulnerable these EVFs are to burn - in they better provide some added value only OLED display can... But do they? Well - the picture is indeed stunning, but hey! - EVFs are not for watching pretty pictures, are they. So I definitely hope the burn - in isn't actually that easy, fast or irreversible - otherwise, hmm...

2. I'm actually quite disappointed with the effective picture being rather small (my old LCD Z-finder Pro which I had to sell in order to partially finance the Eye 's hefty price had a much larger display, even though slightly pixellated due to its lower resolution)...

Thoughts? Cheers

Piotr
 
bengiles said:
Why not just use the FS7 MLUT on your feed? That will then respond to Cine EI rating switch and high/low key etc, no?
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Ben - I AM using the FS7 MLUT, and yet I don't seem to be able to display them... Am I missing something?

Piotr

PS. To make myself clear : of course High / Low Keys display properly on the FS7 own LCD, but NOT on my Gratical Eye!
 
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You need to go into menu - video -lut - sdi1 2 Lut on. This will put a luted output on sdi2. Sdi1 stays always clean.
Now you need to treat that as a rec709 image in you evf.
Nothing wrong about it it's really down to preference.
There are shooting Szenarios where I want to see a luted image in a fast changing environment where I want to judge exposure buy just looking at the image and sometimes I want to see log.

moldcad said:
Ben - I AM using the FS7 MLUT, and yet I don't seem to be able to display them... Am I missing something?

Piotr
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Yes, you are right, Ben - it does work. However I do have another gripe:

- the movement sensor tends to switch my Gratical off with my eye pressed against it... I don't want to disable the sensor (given the burn - in potential), so it looks like a serious design flaw to me. Again: is it just a user error?
 
You want to mount it the other way around (cables facing down) it works better

moldcad said:
Yes, you are right, Ben - it does work. However I do have another gripe:

- the movement sensor tends to switch my Gratical off with my eye pressed against it... I don't want to disable the sensor (given the burn - in potential), so it looks like a serious design flaw to me. Again: is it just a user error?
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its proximity. Then try it the other way round with me the way I put the VF to my eye the sensor misses the top of my head maybe with you its the other way round.
 
moldcad said:
I do have it mounted with the cables facing down. BTW is it a movement or proximity sensor?
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Sorry Moldcad.. might have given you wrong info.. I also still sometimes use my LCD EVF.. that allows the hi/low function.. the EYE not.. the burn in wouldn't be only the EYE.. any would do it I would think.. the eye markings are moving around 1 pixel so they dont burn in.. but from the SDI camera display/ out they wont be..

The proximity thing is not about burning in displays.. its about direct/hard light hitting the screen itself.. and actually yes I had the same thing.. for the first about 1 min of use.. the screen kept on going blank on me.. for some reason after it "heated" up.. or some other reason it would then be fine.. in the end I turned off the function.. as I kept the sometimes annoying rubber flap on anyway..

Hardest thing to remember is to unplug the power when not in use.. needs a cable with a switch.. thing is, its less than half the price of any other OLED with the same picture quality.. so you do sort of get what you pay for to some extent .. and the design is nice and small.. I didnt get the other Grat ones as I thought them ugly to look at and too big.. battery for the EVF..! as if there wasn't enough to go wrong :)
 
I just pop off my V-mount battery when Im not shooting.


Donny 123 said:
Sorry Moldcad.. might have given you wrong info.. I also still sometimes use my LCD EVF.. that allows the hi/low function.. the EYE not.. the burn in wouldn't be only the EYE.. any would do it I would think.. the eye markings are moving around 1 pixel so they dont burn in.. but from the SDI camera display/ out they wont be..

The proximity thing is not about burning in displays.. its about direct/hard light hitting the screen itself.. and actually yes I had the same thing.. for the first about 1 min of use.. the screen kept on going blank on me.. for some reason after it "heated" up.. or some other reason it would then be fine.. in the end I turned off the function.. as I kept the sometimes annoying rubber flap on anyway..

Hardest thing to remember is to unplug the power when not in use.. needs a cable with a switch.. thing is, its less than half the price of any other OLED with the same picture quality.. so you do sort of get what you pay for to some extent .. and the design is nice and small.. I didnt get the other Grat ones as I thought them ugly to look at and too big.. battery for the EVF..! as if there wasn't enough to go wrong :)
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icarusfilm said:
I just pop off my V-mount battery when Im not shooting.
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Oh yeah sure.. its not a deal breaker type thing.. and something you just get used to.. the EYE has some short comings.. but for the price its a great OLED EVF.. Im waiting to check out the new Sony OLED.. next month I think..depending on the price, how it actually looks.. would be tempted to splash out..
 
I wonder if the lack of on/off switch is just a result of corner cutting design, or it was done on purpose; here is an excerpt from Zacuto support webpage:

"If you do begin to notice burn in, you can attempt to correct it by leaving the Gratical powered on but not plugged in to a camera. Doing this with the Gratical’s blue screen displayed overnight or for a few hours can help to fix minor burn in."

And about the brightness changes during the first minutes after turning the device on:

"The brightness of an OLED will change depending on the operating temperature of the OLED. This is a trait inherent to OLED technology. In order to keep the brightness at a proper level, we make small adjustments to the brightness over the short warm up period. This adjustment should only be noticeable in the first few minutes after powering on the Gratical"

So I wonder whether they replaced the brightness fluctuations (which I don't see on my unit at all) with those short periods of blanking the display completely - what do you think?

Well - I guess (and hope) that after I get used to my new EVF I'll stop noticing those minor flaws. But - the Gratical being my very first OLED device ever (and not just EVF, but display in general), I still cannot appreciate the advantage of an EVF being OLED; with all the inherent disadvantages (burn-in first of all), I just see no important advantage... Sure blacks are deep and make the contrast great, but do wee really need it in a viewfinder? Sorry if this is lame; perhaps you could help me realize the advantage? TIA

Piotr
 
OK guys, one more question (lame one - sorry:)):

- what is the "outboard tally light"?

There is no tally light on the Eye, so how is it supposed to work?

Piotr

PS. Or are the tally light and the record indicator (the red dot which lights up when recording starts and TC is progressing) the same thing?
 
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moldcad said:
OK guys, one more question (lame one - sorry:)):

- what is the "outboard tally light"?

There is no tally light on the Eye, so how is it supposed to work?

Piotr

PS. Or are the tally light and the record indicator (the red dot which lights up when recording starts and TC is progressing) the same thing?
Click to expand...

I believe its the actual toggle switch on the outside.. that lights up red in Rec..
 
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