EVA1: Panasonic AU-EVA1! Announcement and latest updates

Status
Not open for further replies.
Colinelves said:
Does this mean that the DR is maintained at 14 stops? Or is one lost in 2.2K? As I seemed to observe a drop in DR a couple of weeks ago (maybe this has changed). Also, this loss in sensitivity seemed to happen at all frame rates in 2.2K mix mode, not just the high frame rates. So what’s the situation when Shooting 24p in 2.2k mix? Is the sensitivity there or not?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

DR is 13 stops in MIX 2.2K mode rather than 14 stops. The ISO is the same throughout all frame rates in MIX2.2K mode. This was done because it was felt that most users would choose this mode in order to have access to high frame rates and it was felt that the camera automatically changing ISO capabilities at different frame rates would be confusing and problematic for users. Instead this shooting mode remains consistent throughout.
 
A brief, somewhat odd, note.

The EVA1 LCD plugs into the camera using a special multipoint connector. The reason this connector is used is because the LCD signal is more than just standard video. It is an odd frame size, as there is data displayed surrounding the picture. The LCD is also a touchscreen, so that communication takes a few pins on the connector. And the design of the camera is to be very low power draw, so there's just the right amount of juice available for this LCD.

If you think you can plug something else into the camera using this connection - don't. You may fry something (the camera or whatever you plug in) and it will not be under warranty. Same goes for plugging in the EVA1 LCD into something else -- don't do it.

I post this warning because someone tried to do something and now they're unhappy. Also, be nice to your parents and do your homework.
 
Illya Friedman said:
Camera body is so light it will spoil you when working with other camera systems.
Click to expand...

By all means the EVA1 looks fabulous from a feature set point of view. If you are not into shoulder cameras and are ok with working with handycams as an A camera, I would say the EVA1 is probably the most attractive option right now. The only thing it hangs on is the image. For some the Canon image is where it's at and they will forgive the C200 and C300 shortcomings. For others they may like the FS7 image and will stick with that. Or maybe they just like how versatile it is. But I think the image is the deciding factor for most people.

For me the EVA1 image just doesn't cut it so far. I'm waiting for the camera start shipping to see if anybody will be able to make me interested enough to try to rent one and shoot something myself. But as you said people can get spoiled and maybe I'm just spoiled by shooting on Alexa and looking at F35 videos on Vimeo. But my bottom feeder camera could be due for an upgrade. I'm using a FS700+7Q for low end jobs that can't pay for the Alexa or the crew for it. I would love to replace it with a more self contained package. But the EVA1 has to prove to me the image is that much better. For me to sell a paid for camera and cough up the cash to buy a new EVA1, it needs to blow the FS700+7Q image out of the water. I won't do it just because it's smaller and has a few other bells and whistles. Image first. So I' looking forward to all the EVA1 videos on Vimeo. Hopefully somebody will pull a Macgregor and produce something extremely cinematic with no budget that will blow us all away.
 
Last edited:
Mitch Gross said:
A brief, somewhat odd, note.

The EVA1 LCD plugs into the camera using a special multipoint connector. The reason this connector is used is because the LCD signal is more than just standard video. It is an odd frame size, as there is data displayed surrounding the picture. The LCD is also a touchscreen, so that communication takes a few pins on the connector. And the design of the camera is to be very low power draw, so there's just the right amount of juice available for this LCD.

If you think you can plug something else into the camera using this connection - don't. You may fry something (the camera or whatever you plug in) and it will not be under warranty. Same goes for plugging in the EVA1 LCD into something else -- don't do it.

I post this warning because someone tried to do something and now they're unhappy. Also, be nice to your parents and do your homework.
Click to expand...

And eat your damn vegetables!
 
Mitch Gross said:
At the highest frame rates, the sensor suffers from an electronic form of Reciprocity Failure. Anyone else here old enough to remember that term from the film days? Reciprocity Failure is the point at which the reciprocal relationship of exposure time and ISO broke down and were no longer accurate. You could expose of 1/2 the time and double the light level to keep exposure consistent, but push that relationship 10 stops in either direction and it is no longer accurate. This was important in high frame rate as well as timelapse photography. On EVA1, basically the refresh is so fast that the sensitivity is altered in a manner beyond the linear scale of standard ISO ratings. An electronic threshold is crossed, decreasing performance. Because of this, for this mode the Dual Native ISOs had to be lowered by one stop to 400/1250 in order to maintain consistent performance.
Click to expand...

Hmm interesting. I thought this only pertained to low light long exposures. I would've guessed the lower ISO was because of the 1.3x crop which would result in nearly halving the light collecting image area and therefore nearly halving the light input, increasing noise levels by approximately a stop.
 
Mitch Gross said:
DR is 13 stops in MIX 2.2K mode rather than 14 stops. The ISO is the same throughout all frame rates in MIX2.2K mode. This was done because it was felt that most users would choose this mode in order to have access to high frame rates and it was felt that the camera automatically changing ISO capabilities at different frame rates would be confusing and problematic for users. Instead this shooting mode remains consistent throughout.
Click to expand...

I’m not sure that makes sense. Users may also be wanting to use the mode as a ‘digital extender’ at normal frame ratesin which case losing that extra stop of DR and sensitivity is just unhelpful.

It would make much more sense to just have the ISO drop only when it needs to. Basically. We’re all adults here, so I feel letting the user make their own decisions is generally the best approach.

All you would need to do is provide a note in the manual to explain what happens and why.

Something that people who read the manual can use to explain to those people that don’t read the manual and ask questions on forums they could have answered themselves, had they read the manual.
 
nyvz said:
Hmm interesting. I thought this only pertained to low light long exposures. I would've guessed the lower ISO was because of the 1.3x crop which would result in nearly halving the light collecting image area and therefore nearly halving the light input, increasing noise levels by approximately a stop.
Click to expand...


That wouldn’t make sense. Each photosite remains the same size and will have the same capacity to capture photons. It’s not like the Reds lose sensitivity when they crop for high frame rates.
 
Colinelves said:
That wouldn’t make sense. Each photosite remains the same size and will have the same capacity to capture photons. It’s not like the Reds lose sensitivity when they crop for high frame rates.
Click to expand...

Of course they do... That's like saying 16mm isn't grainier than 35mm. Crop in and noise gets bigger and more visible thus reducing effective sensitivity. If that wasn't the case they'd be making 1/2" phone sensors with 15 stop s of DR and native iso2500 sensitivity.
 
miko meloni said:
Thanks for the answer.
It would be good to have a higher bitrate even with LongGOP, if possible.
Click to expand...

Agreed. This has been brought up a number of times on this forum, not just with the EVA-1 but with the GH5. The response given was "we research what many of our customers say and find the best balance for all" or something to that regards... which is odd given how many professionals on one of the most active panasonic-focused forums on the internet have requested this.
 
Sttratos said:
So I' looking forward to all the EVA1 videos on Vimeo. Hopefully somebody will pull a Macgregor and produce something extremely cinematic with no budget that will blow us all away.
Click to expand...

Well, I for one thought the footage in the "Radio 88" short shot on the EVA-1 was way more than adequate. But you probably should stick to your Alexa.
 
Lexi 2.1.jpg

Here's a frame grab out of the EVA-1. I posted this over on the dedicated FB pages, sorry if you've already seen it.
We shot 4K VLOG in camera so those images should be even better. This was out of my Odyssey 7Q+, down converted to 2K.

I used ACES IDT and Varicam35 ODT from LUTCalc with a very minor tweak to lift and saturation in Resolve 11.
The VLOG was very easy to grade. Lenses used were Zeiss C/Y.

There's some kind of compression when I upload the image so be aware there's some loss of quality.
 
Last edited:
scottfs said:
Well, I for one thought the footage in the "Radio 88" short shot on the EVA-1 was way more than adequate. But you probably should stick to your Alexa.
Click to expand...

I'm obviously not going to replace an Alexa with an EVA1. So yes, I'm sticking with the Alexa. The EVA1 was to replace my FS700+7Q which I use for low end jobs. It needs to blow that out of the water. It will never blow the Alexa. Not a far fight. So I'm not expecting it to.

But FS5 wasn't good enough for me to change. C200 didn't impress me enough either since I don't need AF. Hoping the EVA1 maybe will. But so far...
 
bill totolo said:
View attachment 127530

Here's a frame grab out of the EVA-1. I posted this over on the dedicated FB pages, sorry if you've already seen it.
We shot 4K VLOG in camera so those images should be even better. This was out of my Odyssey 7Q+, down converted to 2K.

I used ACES IDT and Varicam35 ODT from LUTCalc with a very minor tweak to lift and saturation in Resolve 11.
The VLOG was very easy to grade. Lenses used were Zeiss C/Y.

There's some kind of compression when I upload the image so be aware there's some loss of quality.
Click to expand...

Thanks for taking the time to post it. But that looks horrible. I'm not sure the problem is in my end. But if the online compression is doing that much damage I think it's not even worth posting it. Just link to the uncompressed frame. Because the way it looks here is a disservice to the camera. Just my opinion.
 
Zak Forsman said:
I much prefer the tight, finer character of the EVA1's noise to the clumpiness I see in the C200's shadows.
Click to expand...

I agree. That being said, I'd probably prefer the popping colors of the C200 over the more accurate colors of the Eva-1. Can't wait to test it side by side myself though.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top