EVA1: Panasonic AU-EVA1! Announcement and latest updates

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morgan_moore said:
If you have used a lot of cams.. the good ones are good pretty much out of the box IMO. Ive had donkeys and others, the donkeys you spend infinite time painting, getting magenta shadows.. whatever. Im not saying the EVA is like this, but to suggest that a camera should only sing after a setup battle is just not correct.
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I get exactly what you’re saying. I don’t think EVA1 will be a donkey, but I also think it can be customized to taste and made ‘even better’ according to the owner/operator’s taste or for whatever is appropriate for the project (that’s why there are scene file settings). Like I said before: I’m sure to an experienced op, EVA1 will do fine with factory settings right out of the box. But even great cameras should be customized and sweetened.
 
Those of us that own the AF100 and put in hours of testing all the settings and still not reaching desired image quality, that is something I don't think anyone would ever want to deal with. There are cameras that get it right out of the box and there are the ones that don't. Let's hope this is the one that get it right out of the box.
 
Osslund said:
Those of us that own the AF100 and put in hours of testing all the settings and still not reaching desired image quality, that is something I don't think anyone would ever want to deal with. There are cameras that get it right out of the box and there are the ones that don't. Let's hope this is the one that get it right out of the box.
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Try and bring it down to your personal experience. You didn't get along with the AF100. There are many that did and made great images with it.

Again, there is no one size fits all...... (what a boring world that would be)
 
Osslund said:
Is it ever anything but personal experience?
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Correct. My comment was aimed at postings that constantly refer to "people think," "people want," without qualifiers as to who these people are.

Anyway, enough of my pedantic postings. Let's see what the EVA-1 brings. Hopefully good stuff. :beer:
 
Where did this weird hatred and fear of menus come from? What camera has a menu system so complicated that it can't be learned inside and out to quickly work in your favor?

Sony's FS7 has the most convoluted menu systems I've ever encountered, yet the FS7 is one of the most used and best selling cameras out there. It's a highly regarded camera that has seen enough success and praise from great DPs that it proves even the most complicated of menus won't stand in the way of a good camera.

There is no way in hell the EVA1 will be more complicated than the FS7. And there is no way in hell I'd be intimidated by something as petty as a menu system.
 
Bob Loblaw said:
Where did this weird hatred and fear of menus come from? What camera has a menu system so complicated that it can't be learned inside and out to quickly work in your favor?

Sony's FS7 has the most convoluted menu systems I've ever encountered, yet the FS7 is one of the most used and best selling cameras out there. It's a highly regarded camera that has seen enough success and praise from great DPs that it proves even the most complicated of menus won't stand in the way of a good camera.

There is no way in hell the EVA1 will be more complicated than the FS7. And there is no way in hell I'd be intimidated by something as petty as a menu system.
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Well the UI of the FS7 is so bad that I could, maybe, be sold an EVA or C200 assuming they are basically on par image wise and had an excellent UI.

On fast moving jobs the FS7 has certain features that just cannot be accessed quickly enough. My particular bugbear is the loss of Cache Record upon exiting High Frame Rate not to mention loss of audio upon use of HFR. Also the huge time spent moving from 4k to HD HFR.

Ideally Id shoot 4k, and then be happy with a digital punch on a lens like the 18-55, but I 'cant' use 4k as it is so slow to access when bouncing to 100+FPS HD.

All of these things significantly impact how I can shoot and are purely down to the menu paucity.

It seems simple enough to have a 'control wheel' and four buttons, colour temp, shutter angle, ISO and frame rate.

Playback is also really non client friendly.
 
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Or scroll through 'preset' favorites.

My Favorites are..

1P 300 shutter 4k (nd8)
25p 180 shutter 4k (nd2)
50p 180 shutter 4k (nd3)
100p 180 shutter HD (clear)
150p 180 shutter HD (clear)

Rarely do I shoot any other settings. If you know the FS7 you will know that these settings are a huge menu dig with a ton of long scrolls.

S
 
Menu digging is bad on FS7 but it's actually much worse on the A7 series. When I had a look on the menus of the Eva yesterday it was pretty good (reminded me of GH style menus) but I was talking more about settings tweaking to get to most out of the thing rather than actual menu digging. And despite the less than perfect menu structure on the FS7, once set it works great and fast to operate during a shoot.
 
The Sony mirrorless' have a quick function menu that allows you to program 12 different options (6 on top, 6 on bottom) plus multiple programmable buttons including the direction arrows.

Like in my case a click of the left arrow would toggle AF (on/off), right arrow = ISO, down arrow = manual audio levels, one custom button for white balance, one custom button for PP, one custom button for IS, one custom button for face-tracking...you have your knobs for shutter and aperture...I mean the cameras don't get any simpler.

If none of this was possible I do agree that it would require unnecessary digging, but I don't enter the menus for anything ever besides a framerate change...and that's still via the one click quick function menu where I have 12 other things saved.
 
The snarkiness of comments increases in direct proportion to the level of impatience.

I think Panasonic should push back the release to, oh, say March. Let's see the fur REALLY fly.

Calm down, kiddos. The end of October is well-on nigh.
 
J.Brown said:
I don't consider exposure and white balance to be image settings but all the nonsense picture profiles and settings.
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They're not nonsense. You can adjust the other settings or you can use them at factory default. The camera looks great out of the box but maybe you like a little more salt in your soup so we let you adjust it if you want. How is that a bad thing?
 
Sttratos said:
In that case, wouldn't it have been much better, wiser and serve these goals better if the camera had only been announced once it was 100% finished and footage only released then? You can't have your cake and eat it too.
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You can't be in business and do that. Not with a product such as this. You have to preview it so that people know there is something coming, and you have to gauge the market interest so that you know how many to tool up for making. GoPro announces a new camera and it's on the shelves the next day because it is a consumer device that is largely an impulse buy. An EVA1 is a more considered purchase.
 
Sttratos said:
I don't think this is what he meant. To me it's pretty clear what he meant actually. Either a camera is easy to get good results with or it's hard or nearly impossible. If you have to tweak it to oblivion just to get a good result then I don't want such a camera. This is exactly why Arris are the most popular cameras in the industry. You don't have to mess around with it to make it shine.

I have no idea how you got that he was talking about ISO, frame rate and WB when it was obvious he was talking about deep menu stuff.
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EVA1 is easy to get a good result from. Pull it out of the box and shoot. But if you want to be able to style it to your personal preference then it's nice to have the ability.

Panasonic doesn't make science projects. You don't have to struggle with our cameras in order to get them to work. You can choose to ignore most of the menus and do just fine, but it's great to have them in case you want to go for something in particular. And not understanding what's available to you even if you choose not to use it is simply cutting your nose off in spite of your face.
 
filmguy123 said:
I agree that if a manufacturer is too lazy to make a default picture profile that looks good, its really annoying to have to tweak the snot out of a camera to get it looking decent.

But I think Panasonic has generally done a great job of that on the DVX/HVX cameras, AF100, GH series, etc. "Best" is so subjective especially in an artistic field. If anything I wish some of my cameras had MORE image control (I'd love to a GHx menu setting to disable the electronic sharpening on native M43 lenses, for example). There's plenty of threads about NR -5 vs NR 0, Sharp -3, etc. etc. Frankly in good hands, they all look great, but different strokes for different folks.

Mitch said more detail is like complaining a steak is too delicious. Other DPs would say too much detail is like overcooking a steak. Who is right? Really, neither... all a default camera setting can do is dial it into what the manufacturer thought looked best. I love that I can disagree (at least to a certain extent) and hone in a look that suits my tastes, or perhaps suits a certain scenario (landscape VS portrait; indoor tungsten lowlight VS outdoor harsh sunlight, etc.).
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Thanks, perhaps you voiced this better than I.

The EVA1 looks great. We tout that it has the beloved VariCam look. So that's the default. But if you want to adjust it you have the freedom to go to town on it. There's lots of stuff in there. Many DPs made a name for themselves with their "special sauce," which could be certain menu settings, a LUT, an exotic optic or special filter, or whatever widget in the bag. Knowing what's available in the box means that you can be the hero, and that can mean (1) a better result for your client and (2) more work for you.

Back in the day I was shooting a product piece with an actress of a certain age. The client wanted to see the product clearly but also wanted to smooth out the face of the actress they'd paid a great deal of money. This client had no idea what SKIN DETAIL was, but a quick, subtle adjustment and my client sitting at the monitor thought I was a miracle worker.

The best race car drivers in the world do not need to be auto mechanics, but they do need to know the capabilities of their cars. That's all I'm trying to say here.
 
Sttratos said:
I'm sorry Mitch. But I will have to put you on blast for this one. Because this misses the mark in a way that I think DP Mitch never would. I would say it's a good idea for Rep Mitch to consult DP Mitch before posting. :thumbsup:

I know this will be one of those replies which will get down voted to oblivion and I don't care. I know there are so many with thin skins. But ...

By the way, I don't think all the snide with all the "Um, what?", "Seriously?" etc is doing someone in your position any good. But please allow me to play by those same rules here.



Seriously? Are you going to put down the DPs instead of giving the buyer what they want? Tell your customer how they should want their meal instead of giving them what they want. Business success 101. Again, no wonder Arri is killing everybody on the market. They don't argue that the client is wrong in wanting something. They just give it to them and in return clients pay good money for it.



I don't see how wanting an easy to use camera is sticking your head in the sand. But ok. I will bite. Foolish how? For which side? For the company? Arri is selling loads of cameras and they are all high priced. Their cameras are THE industry standard. Hard to call them a fool. Foolish for the buyer? No Arri user complains the cameras are too easy to use. So I don't see your point. And I'm not taking you out of context. I'm addressing your point head on.




You still can do that with a camera that is easy to use. I know you can do all that very well with the Alexas and Amira. Yet you don't have to mess with camera menus to get there. I will repeat what J.Brown said, I also don't think I ever had to mess around with the Alexa to make it shine.



Again you miss the mark so horribly. There is nothing to do with that. There is nothing to do with not wanting to know how their tool can help them achieve their vision. It has to do with not fighting their tool to get their vision. The tool not getting on the way of getting their vision. The tool making it actually easier to get their vision, so they can be freed to worry about more important things like lighting etc. Instead of spending most of their time in the video tent trying to tweak the image.






Um, what? Ridiculing buyers for not wanting to have extra work with something?
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I'm not insulted and I didn't mean to insult anyone. I'll try to make my point again clearly.

The EVA1 can be used right out of the box and deliver gorgeous images. It's an exceptionally easy camera to use, and there's even a HOME screen that's completely separate from the menu system which will allow the DP to view and adjust standard settings. Use the camera this way and enjoy it for the beauty it can deliver. End.

OR

If you want or need to , take a look at the options available in the menu system. They are not complicated to navigate and there are some interesting features available to you. You don't have to, but you might discover something that is more to your personal taste. Or maybe you'll find an interesting feature to keep in the back of your mind should you ever run into a particular situation. Your choice.

A properly-designed car's automatic transmission will generally deliver the greatest balance of efficiency and power. Some drivers are all about the automatic transmission so that they can concentrate on other things. Other drivers prefer a manual transmission so that they can have a more direct control and manipulate the engine the way they personally prefer. The nice thing about a camera like EVA1 is that you can switch between automatic and manual transmission any time you wish. But if you don't know how to drive stick you'll struggle with it, so it's a good idea to practice a bit first to see what it can do for you. End metaphor.
 
Just to clarify a couple points:

- The one menu choice you'll need to make one the EVA1 is whether to shoot in Log or to shoot in one of the Scene Files. There are several basic looks available in the Scene Files and we think they all look great. One is more useful in low light while another is better for bright exteriors, but they're all just slight variations on a theme, and there is a "standard REC709" available.

- If you choose a Scene File, all those controls for things like KNEE, BLACK POINT, etc. are available to be adjusted. These in fact are the settings that define the Scene File. You can always choose to name and save these files, even save them to an SD card, share them with another camera, etc. If you paint yourself into a corner there's a reset to factory default available as well.

- This one is important: If you shoot in V-Log, all those settings disappear. The whole point of those settings is to bake in a look on set, so if you are someone who would rather shoot flat, capture everything and then adjust in post then EVA1 will do that for you with no fuss. This probably chops the possible menu tree items in half if not more.

- The menus are quite simply laid out and finding your way to important settings is purposefully made extra-easy. Changing the system setting so that one can flip codecs and switch from 4K30 to 2K240 is designed so that it's the top item on the menu list with successive button pushes. Reformatting an SD card is equally straightforward right up to the point where a warning pops up at the end asking if you really want to do it, at which point the scroll wheel must be rotated slightly to say YES, just so that you don't hit it by accident. So yeah, these things have all been considered.

- "Hero" adjustments are available directly on the HOME screen (it looks like the display on VariCam, Alexa and a bunch of other cameras). You don't have to go into the menus for them. Likewise the 9 User Buttons come preprogrammed to what the engineers felt would be most useful, but you can change them to 28 different options included the choice to make each one do nothing if you so desire. There's a 10th adjustable control as well. Since you won't be using that Menu system most of the time, that wheel is just sitting there. There's a 3-position toggle switch to allow it to control White Balance, ISO or a user-selected function. There are a few choices for that function and thankfully one of them is to do nothing, but a nice one is to change frame rate.

- You can ignore most of this stuff and shoot great images with the EVA1. But if you choose to look at what's available, you may find some clever tools that are genuinely helpful to your work. It's good to know what's available, just in case.
 
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