P. Bloom (made a mistake in) claiming 600fps work around on upgraded FS700

G

Gene Sung

Veteran
Saw Philip Bloom's instagram post. Says he will do a full write up soon. If this works, this is super amazing.

http://instagram.com/p/es2n7BKKl4/

PB Wrote:


Hold the front page! Upgraded FS700 can do 2K raw at 600 FPS...CONTINUOUS?? This can't be right? I must be making a mistake here. Unless I am going mad that is the case if going to 24p. Bit less if 25p. How? It does 240fps at 2k 60p raw that means when conformed to 24p it's 600fps! Holy cow! At 4K it's 120 fps burst mode but also available at 60p. Which means 4K raw bursts at 300fps! Will try it out tomorrow. Shame the Sony solution is bloody massive! Camera is now a bazooka. Keen to try Convergent Design solution.

So here we go. I recorded it at 240fps at 2k 60p. Naturally it plays back looking like slow motion in the hobbit. I then ran it though resolve to prores 60p then cinema tools conformed to 24p and whilst the tech head will refuse to call this 600fps it damn well looks like perfect 600fps to me. It's 2.5x slower than he 240 fps. What matters is the end result and the end result is as I said it would be 2.5x slower than the 240fps giving me effectively 600fps. So stick that in ya pipe and smoke it. Will stick it up tomorrow as am shagged.

I know people will still argue with me. That's fine. Argue till you are blue in the face. I have "600fps" 2k raw super slow motion from my fs700 and that's all I care about.

I will shoot it "600 fps" and enjoy the perfect (as I have just tested) results. You go get a phantom. Shoot 600fps next to this and I guarantee it will look identical.
 
It may be 1:24am and I'm still on a sleep inducing client shoot, but this certainly doesnt make sense. And I'm surprised bloom has made such an error. 240fps is 240 frames per second, there's no multiplying or dividing by the playback rate. Unless there's some odd detail he neglected.
 
Yes, Bloom is wrong.

Record on 240 fps -> and play it on 60 fps -> slowdown x4
Record on 240 fps -> and play it on 24 fps -> slowdown x10.

in any case 240 fps it is 240 fps.

Smoking less, Philip )))
 
Seems wrong to me, the 60p means that it's played out from the buffer at 60p (it's the output rate of the SDI/HDMI).

I can see the confusion though, if it's set to continuous. He is convinced that he's got 600fps though if you look at the comments. I wonder how he knows he's seeing 600fps and that what he thought was 240fps wasn't. If that makes sense?

If you view 240fps at 60p it will seem slow. But if you conform it to 24p then it's really is as you'd expect 240fps to look slowed down fully.

I think it's a UI hiccup

cheers
Paul
 
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I made the same mistake when I got the EX1. I thought shooting overcrank 60fps @ 60p would give me 120fps. But alas, I was mistaken.

I do hope this works though. Both for Mr Blooms reputation and for all the FS700 users. Looking forward to a plethora of mega boring slow mo videos of water droplets :)
 
Well, I hope it does work. PB does seem pretty convinced. A lot stranger things have happened like RAW video on Canon DSLRs, which is probably the most unbelievable thing in modern video history.

And if it does work, I'll be the first film my dripping faucet :)
 
He's just stated on FB that he made a mistake. Pretty much the same mistake as I made on the EX1...
 
I saw him talking about this on twitter last night, couldn't figure out what math he was doing to get to 600fps... 240fps is 240fps. Seemed like such an obvious mistake to make, but we've all been there.
 
Cue zillions of test slo mo films on Vimeo!

Seriously I must have used 50fps in 720p about four times in the past five years so I fail to see what all the fuss about mega frame rate overcranking is unless it is due to be the next "shooting style" to go with wobbly cam and constant searching for focus cam???
 
Glad to see he figured it out and realized he'd made a mistake.

240 fps is 240 fps. Period. You can play it back in a 24p timeline to get 10x slow motion, yes -- I do it all the time with the GoPro Hero3, it does 240 fps in WVGA and I drop it in the 24p timeline and get 10x slow motion.

I believe the confusion arose because he was thinking in terms of 60fps, and 10x slow motion on a 60fps timeline would require 600fps, so ... I believe that somewhere in there lies the confusion.

But confusion it is. 240 fps is and always will be a maximum of 240 fps.
 
60/24 = 2.5. 2.5*240 = 600 (from what he wrote sounds like what he was thinking).

If 240fps was recorded and if it was played back at 60fps with 2.5 frame interpolation, it would effectively be 600fps material, which could be slowed an additional 2.5x if played at 24fps (perhaps what he was thinking?). 240fps material can easily be slowed 2.5x in After Affects (pixel interpolation) or Twixtor with minimal artifacts in many cases.

The FS700 does 960fps in AVCHD or an external recorder in a 60i or 60p container (very low res; could be useful in some cases if cleaned up with tools like Dark Energy, though post-interpolation will look better in many cases).
 
GaryNattrass said:
Cue zillions of test slo mo films on Vimeo!

Seriously I must have used 50fps in 720p about four times in the past five years so I fail to see what all the fuss about mega frame rate overcranking is unless it is due to be the next "shooting style" to go with wobbly cam and constant searching for focus cam???
Click to expand...

Actually, I'm not sure why there are so many people bitching and moaning about how there is slow motion in cameras. It's just another tool. Nobody is saying it's the "next shooting style," but for some people it's part of their aesthetic. For me, I use it a ton for skateboarding, music videos and artistic pieces. Even on paid network DP jobs, I've been doing a lot more slow-mo shots than before. Just because it's there doesn't mean you have to use it.

As for wobbly cam and finding focus, that can quite cool as well. Watching Battlestar Galatica (the show), it's shot mainly loose handheld and there a ton of zoom in (gasp!!!!) and find focus type shots; and it's very cool.

My point is, there is no "right" way to do things. Each to his or her own.
 
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