Oscar nominee 'Beasts' - 85 of 120 VFX shots created with free labor

As far as I'm concerned this is just the "intern era" chickens coming home to roost. With 100s of Universities cranking out film school graduates every year the labor pool is fairly dilute, factor this in along with the trend that no one in the biz can afford to retire (maybe they never really could) and you will start having productions where everyone below 1st Assistants are going to be working for free. . .sort of like "indie" films.
 
Something I've had a gut feeling, or perhaps a slow revelation over in relation to filmmaking as a "paying" profession.

It isn't a paying gig. Not for most of us even if we make something great that makes money. If you even get a deal or sell a spec script or something along those lines, you're still lucky to get paid.

In a way, it is artiscally liberating I suppose. At least I don't have to worry about making some crass crap like GI Joe or Twilight.
 
Historically speaking, art has never really been a paying job. Some successful artists made money by selling their paintings, or were paid to perform at a venue, etc, but it wasn't until recorded music / movies / tv that art became a big business.

Art was also never as expensive to produce until movies / tv (excluding the creation of buildings & bridges etc, which serve a functional purpose beyond their artistic value).

You can't expect to make money being an artists, as most artists don't make money, but if you are laboring on something that is being used by a business to make a profit, you should be paid for your work.

Unfortunately, the very thing that is allowing more people to make movies (decreasing cost of production) will probably be the main reason movies stop being a paying job for most people. The market is too saturated with content. Not just professional movies, but reality tv, youtube, vimeo, etc.
 
I think the use of unpaid interns is abusive. Any work should be paid in any business if, as agcohn points out, it creates a profit. The system described in that article where a non-profit Cinereach has created the infrastructure for student talent to work free is shameful. If the infrastructure was such that it produced tuition assistance for the student (e.g. tuition for athletes in college) then it might be better.

I think agcohn and Nektonic are right. I think you have to look at film as an art. I just agree. Deal the cards...

Regarding VFX, why not do what Gareth Edwards did with Monsters and do the VFX yourselves? What is this? Don't you have anyone in your community who is an editor or are fledgling VFX folks who can turn out decent composites? The deal makes me suspect and I'm not usually like that. The whole machine that produced this film, including the Sundance Institute, IFP (of which I am a member) has really gotten me thinking about this ridiculous privilege. Sorry, this movie ain't all that great! There's a whole other thread about that but I would say that it certainly doesn't belong in the category for best picture with Lincoln and Silver Linings Playbook, although each very different from the other, were examples of tremendous craft and beauty.

wow... I can't believe how much this pisses me off.
 
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I've resisted posting an emotional response but after a few I must say my first response several hours ago was an empty feeling in my stomach.
I can find good reasons why the intern deal is good with students. A great opportunity for students to work with Digital Domain for example.
Still, in the end, it's a saddening feeling that it's come to this, imo.

//edit: And it's not just about art, it's more so about technical skill. A lot of it. That's one of the frustrating parts.
 
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Gord.T said:
I've resisted posting an emotional response but after a few I must say my first response several hours ago was an empty feeling in my stomach.
I can find good reasons why the intern deal is good with students. A great opportunity for students to work with Digital Domain for example.
Still, in the end, it's a saddening feeling that it's come to this, imo.
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I think unpaid internships / apprenticeships are fine when one is being given an opportunity to learn to do work that he or she would not otherwise be offered due to lack of experience, and he or she is being trained by a more experienced individual to do a skilled job (e.g. camera assistant, assistant editor, compositor, vfx artist, gaffer, etc.)

I don't think that an intern should be answering phones, doing research, making coffee, going on runs, or doing jobs that a Production Assistant would otherwise be paid to do.

An intern should never be used as a replacement for a paid position. An internship should be treated as an opportunity for someone to come in and learn a trade; it should not be treated as free work.
 
quote from post #2 link in case anyone skipped over it. And I agree with agcohn's post. And then we have issues like this on the other side.

Several hundred people reportedly congregated outside the Dolby theatre in Los Angeles as the stars walked the red carpet, demanding better treatment for the artists who make the spectacular visuals for blockbuster movies possible. The protest was planned after the well-known Rhythm & Hues effects house filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy last week, shortly after winning a Bafta for its work on Life of Pi.
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When the visual effects team behind Life of Pi attempted to draw attention to Rhythm and Hues' plight during their acceptance speech for the best visual effects Oscar, they were cut off by the band as the speech went on beyond the stipulated limit.
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agcohn said:
Historically speaking, art has never really been a paying job. Some successful artists made money by selling their paintings, or were paid to perform at a venue, etc, but it wasn't until recorded music / movies / tv that art became a big business.

Art was also never as expensive to produce until movies / tv (excluding the creation of buildings & bridges etc, which serve a functional purpose beyond their artistic value).
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If you want to talk about 'historical'... prior to the late 19th Century 'art' or 'craft' was communicated via apprenticeship... read that as 'unpaid labor' (except perhaps room and board...). And a patroned artist often go room and board, and perhaps some 'spending' money... Materials, depending on the medium were expensive, at least for materials beyond charred sticks (even then one had to bake them in a kiln...)... and paper was expensive... at least prior to the 19th century... the introduction of wood pulp was the significant change, along with 'steam' power for paper mills.

Good marble for statues was expensive, as was the time to pound out a likeness... Not 'cheap' at all... Canvas... again, until modern manufacture... more expensive, and was reason why paintings were over painted with new scenes either by the original painter, or by later painters who needed a canvas...
 
I don't think anyone has an issue with interns learning a trade. What people have issue with is using interns instead of paid professions.
 
nothing said:
Unpaid projects are how you gain experience in this industry. It's been that way for many years, it's not new.
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It's one thing to intern on a production to work and learn under someone who is skilled and experienced (and getting paid), and contribute a small fraction to the success of a film. But when nearly ALL your special effects work comes from unpaid interns and makes a huge contribution to the final product, that is exploitation.
 
I became a VFX artist at the peak time. Early 90's were amazing. Salaries were through the roof. I couldn't find enough people to fill seats. I trained kids off the street to work on big budget projects. I bought a house, car, got married, and god know what else. By early 2000 I saw the writing on the wall, and started a different career path. I'm glad I did.
 
Batutta said:
But when nearly ALL your special effects work comes from unpaid interns and makes a huge contribution to the final product, that is exploitation.
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If you are using intern work in your finished production, then what are they there to learn actually?
 
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I don't think anyone has an issue with interns learning a trade. What people have issue with is using interns instead of paid professions.
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nothing said:
Got a source that shows that happening? The article that started this thread doesn't say that.
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From the article in the first post.

He cites the controversial decision by Digital Domain, a visual-effects company, to replace 30% of its paid workforce with tuition-paying Florida State University Students.
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This intern business in VFX industry is really sad. When you have more work being churned out by unpaid staff, that's a problem. Internship can be wonderful. In fact I interned for 2 months and was eventually hired full time. Yes it's a way to get in, but it's such an unstable business with rare full time positions. As soon as a project is done, it's good by time, and off you go to find the next one. Fine for 20 year olds, but not anyone with a family to feed.
 
This is getting good.

So Digital Domain, the best VFX house in the industry goes bankrupt. Big surprise. Everyone else is.

Let me save people looking up the link.

Digital Domain, the once-storied visual effects house co-founded by director James Cameron, has emerged from bankruptcy with new Chinese and Indian owners vowing to expand the Los Angeles-based studio.
Digital Domain Media Group announced Sunday that it had accepted a bid from Galloping Horse America, a division of a Beijing media company, and Reliance MediaWorks, part of the Indian conglomerate Reliance Group, to buy the company's visual effects studios in Venice, Calif., and Vancouver, Canada, for $30.2 million.

The deal closed Thursday and effectively removes Digital Domain from a potentially protracted Chapter 11 bankruptcy filing by its parent company in Florida this month. That filing caused the near-shutdown of the company's new animation building in Port St. Lucie, Fla., laying off most of its 320 workers.
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Gord.T said:
quote from post #2 link in case anyone skipped over it. And I agree with agcohn's post. And then we have issues like this on the other side.
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I tried to start a discussion about that, but no one seemed to care. http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?303001-Oscars-VFX-protest

Here are more articles about it:

http://fxguide.com/quicktakes/visualeffectsprotestatoscars/

http://vfxsoldier.wordpress.com/2013/02/24/an-open-letter-to-ang-lee/

http://www.deadline.com/2013/02/oscars-2013-life-of-pi-vfx-rhythm-hues-bankruptcy/

http://www.reddit.com/r/vfx/comments/1960ud/stay_classy_oscars/
 
I gave your first dvx thread a bump there but it's kind of tucked away somewhere else.

If you don't mind me reposting one of the videos...I hadn't seen that one. Wow.

 
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