Optimum Strategies for Shooting Stills and HD Video Simultaneously during Photoshoot?

[majordslr]

Greetings all,

I have been shooting photography and video for some time, and I am enrolled in a summer-school class where we are to come up with a brief business plan for our future photography/videography ventures.

Well, I am going to build a brand around shooting stills and video simultaneously, and I was wondeirng if anyone might have any recommendations as how best shoot hd video and stills at the same time throughout the shoot. Who are the leaders in this field?

Do any of you mount two cameras together (Such as a video camera and dslr), or set up dedicated video cameras or still cameras DSLRs on tripods? What brackets/systems/methods do you use for mounting stills and video cameras, and/or shooting stills and video together at the same time?

And of course, I will also be including a section on audio in my business plan, so any tips would rock!

Just looking for some ideas! & if I use your original idea, I'll be more than happy to provide you a reference!

Thanks in advance for the advice and insights! I will look forward to sharing the final plan with y'all.

MD

 

[wgzn]

not really sure what you mean here... shooting both high res stills and hd video from the same tripod/rig, would take two cameras (if not two operators) to do well.
most DSLRs can toggle between stills and video. but not at the exact same moment in time.

not sure what the end use for your plan would be? not saying its a bad idea. i just dont understand how it would be of value...

can you elaborate?

 

[majordslr]

not really sure what you mean here... shooting both high res stills and hd video from the same tripod/rig, would take two cameras (if not two operators) to do well.
most DSLRs can toggle between stills and video. but not at the exact same moment in time.

not sure what the end use for your plan would be? not saying its a bad idea. i just dont understand how it would be of value...

can you elaborate?

Yes--I mean a bracket or something similar which connects two cameras for shooting both stills and running video throughout the shoot. Either do DSLRS or a DSLR and a video camcorder.

Here's one method I just came across:

This guy seems to be shooting stills & video at the same time in a cool way:

War Photog Blends Video, Stills for New Combat Views | Danger Room | Wired.com

Ziv Koren is a world-renown combat photographer whose coverage of the
Israeli-Palestinian conflict has vaulted him to international acclaim. Now, he’s helping invent a whole new visual aesthetic that digitally combines still photos with moving images, seamlessly.

Koren has spent years shooting for titles, including Time Magazine, the New York Times, and Paris Match. His photograph of the aftermath of a suicide bombing of an Israeli bus was selected by the World Press Photo Organisation in 2000 as one of the most important photos in the last 45 years. But when film director Solo Avital asked Koren to be the subject of the documentary, "More than 1000 Words," the photographer found his work started to expand beyond the still, frozen frame.

In order to film Koren on the West Bank, Gaza and other hot zones, the filmmakers devised a small "finger camera" to mount on Koren¹s lens. Avital says it was the only way to get close to Koren without attracting too much attention.
But the result is that you can see Koren’s subjects as he does — through his lens. And that gives much more information, about both the photographer and the photographed.

Certainly we wouldn't tell him to stop because it is impossible, as he is showing it is possible! And i a war zone during combat!



Anybody else see anything like this out there? The more I think about it, the more I am excited about potentialities.

 

[majordslr]

not really sure what you mean here... shooting both high res stills and hd video from the same tripod/rig, would take two cameras (if not two operators) to do well.
most DSLRs can toggle between stills and video. but not at the exact same moment in time.

not sure what the end use for your plan would be? not saying its a bad idea. i just dont understand how it would be of value...

can you elaborate?

Regarding the value of it, as more and more clients are seeking video and as more and more devices access video, and as more and more people use video to build brands and share brands via social media, the ability to deliver more quality HD video clips alongside stills will let you stand apart from the competition!

 

[deltoidjohn]

Well, if this is only hypothetical for academic purposes, then here's my suggestion:

Shoot with RED. It basically takes 24 14mp stills a second. Use constant studio lighting so you don't need to interupt the video with strobes.


If however, if this project requires you to demonstrate it practically or to not rely on hypothetical cash flows, then here's my suggestion:

Have 2 cameras and 2 operators. Again, use studio lighting rather than strobes to avoid interupting the video. Decide who is going to be the primary shooter (either the videographer or the photographer) and that person will direct the shoot. The other person will have to work around the director. Shooting stills and video together is a lot more complicated than simply putting both cameras onto a bracket - sure that can work sometimes like when shooting sports from a tripod on the sidelines, but it's far from ideal. Each medium has it's own nuances and subtleties and if you are striving to create the best end product, then the best solution is to have a dedicated shooter for each medium.

 

[wgzn]

the ability to deliver more quality HD video clips alongside stills will let you stand apart from the competition!

yeah. sorry. im going to have to whole-heartedly disagree with that. for a number of reasons:

1. as deltoidjohn said and i alluded to, video and stills are two nearly-completely different crafts. sticking both on the same armature is very likely to hamper the quality (or at least functional range) of both.

1b. on an operator level. there is just too much to be concerned with with both devices. you would have to manage exposure and focus on each camera. i guess if you teamed up the right cameras, you could fly on auto to a degree. but that may well defeat your goal of higher quality...

2. as youtube has become the defacto delivery method of video delivery for the unwashed masses. the acceptable quality threshold has fallen through the floor. just as we in the content biz are working to improve acquisition quality. the uninformed masses are watching hulu and youtube on computer monitors (and walmart tvs) of dubious quality. one thing i do like about this is that content, be it good or bad, and positioning is becoming king (see that rebecca black "friday" horsecrap). deliver the right message to the right audience and it doesnt matter if it was shot on fuggin vhs!

i will definitely agree that while the content of the link you provided is pretty interesting. its overall appeal is limited. as the monetizable (is that a word?) audience who would really care about something like that is not huge.

as a niche product (a la nat geo, etc.) IF the demand validated the effort on an ongoing basis. the budget would likely accommodate both a video and still shooter. so IMHO, though its a very groovy project. as a "future of videography venture" i think managing two cameras on a single armature is an extraordinarily dead-end concept.

 

[majordslr]

yeah. sorry. im going to have to whole-heartedly disagree with that. for a number of reasons:

1. as deltoidjohn said and i alluded to, video and stills are two nearly-completely different crafts. sticking both on the same armature is very likely to hamper the quality (or at least functional range) of both.

1b. on an operator level. there is just too much to be concerned with with both devices. you would have to manage exposure and focus on each camera. i guess if you teamed up the right cameras, you could fly on auto to a degree. but that may well defeat your goal of higher quality...

2. as youtube has become the defacto delivery method of video delivery for the unwashed masses. the acceptable quality threshold has fallen through the floor. just as we in the content biz are working to improve acquisition quality. the uninformed masses are watching hulu and youtube on computer monitors (and walmart tvs) of dubious quality. one thing i do like about this is that content, be it good or bad, and positioning is becoming king (see that rebecca black "friday" horsecrap). deliver the right message to the right audience and it doesnt matter if it was shot on fuggin vhs!

i will definitely agree that while the content of the link you provided is pretty interesting. its overall appeal is limited. as the monetizable (is that a word?) audience who would really care about something like that is not huge.

as a niche product (a la nat geo, etc.) IF the demand validated the effort on an ongoing basis. the budget would likely accommodate both a video and still shooter. so IMHO, though its a very groovy project. as a "future of videography venture" i think managing two cameras on a single armature is an extraordinarily dead-end concept.

I actually think there's quite a bit of potential!

Canon Professional Network - Ziv Koren: HF10 & multimedia (shooting stills and video at the same time made it to the canon website! COOL!)

Ziv Koren has been a successful photojournalist for over 20 years and his work has been published in Time, Newsweek, The Sunday Times, Stern, Paris Match and Wired among others. Now Ziv is combining still images with video, and the results are powerful multimedia presentations that give a new insight into the decisive moment when the camera shutter button is pressed. CPN spoke to him about his recent work using a Canon EOS-1Ds Mark III SLR camera in conjunction with the Canon HF10 1080 HD camcorder.

How did the idea of combining stills photographs with video footage come about?

I started about four years ago, trying to play with the idea of how I can show the background of my work and give the viewer the ability to see where my decisive moment was by pressing the shutter.
​

--from Canon Professional Network - Ziv Koren: HF10 & multimedia

Another method from http://www.diyphotography.net/a-diy-9shooter-shooting-stills-video-simultaneously-audio-too:



http://www.diyphotography.net/a-diy-9shooter-shooting-stills-video-simultaneously-audio-too

The post below shows a simple way to capture video while taking still pictures. Sure, there is some added weight and yea, video will not get a dedicated person and will just "follow along", yet, this is a neat way to achieve video with just one person shooting, This is also a great instructional tool for yourself to see how you interact with your model, what things work and what makes them shrink.

There are two versions for this mod - a dueler which mounts a DSLR with a video camera and a 9Shooter that also has sound attached.

I think there's a future for more innovation along these lines!

 

[deltoidjohn]

The thing about the example you posted is he is not so much aiming to take high quality content in both mediums. Rather it is about documenting his artwork to give it a better context. Without the still photos, the video footage has no value to him or his clients.

To take professional quality video and photos simoultaneously is a totally different matter. Why do you think that after all these years, feature films still employ a seperate still photographer to take production stills both on set and in dedicated still photography sessions for the production artwork (DVD covers, posters, etc), despite the fact that 35mm film would give frame grabs of sufficient quality? It's becuase doing it any other way is a compromise.

I'm not saying you can't make a viable business offering both medium, only that to do it properly you need two artists working independently and simoultaneously.

 

[Lee Saxon]

You attach them to a rig together like that you're going to get reallllllllllllllllly boring video. Definitely needs to be done separately (though not necessarily by two separate people, I've managed to do both on a few shoots, going back and forth - http://www.vimeo.com/jleesaxon/xlcr)

 

[majordslr]

You attach them to a rig together like that you're going to get reallllllllllllllllly boring video. Definitely needs to be done separately (though not necessarily by two separate people, I've managed to do both on a few shoots, going back and forth - http://www.vimeo.com/jleesaxon/xlcr)

Well, if you shoot boring subjects, you will get boring video.

If you shoot awesome & exciting subjects, you will get awesome & exciting video.

 

[kgimedia]

Well, if you shoot boring subjects, you will get boring video.

If you shoot awesome & exciting subjects, you will get awesome & exciting video.

If you shoot awesome & exciting subjects you can use a cell phone and get awesome & exciting video. If you have a talented editor you might carve a niche. I equate this discussion to the fun I have been having since I switched to DSLR and doing 2nd system sound. Can you create quality products with both together? Yes. Can you create a more creative better quality product with them separate? Yes.

 

[wgzn]

Well, if you shoot boring subjects, you will get boring video.

If you shoot awesome & exciting subjects, you will get awesome & exciting video.

THAT is complete and utter nonsense!
our task as either or both shooter and editor is very often to make something "boring" appear more interesting.

clients often warn me at the start of a project of how boring their particular subject is. and i happily tell them:
"ANYONE can make a porsche look cool. it takes TALENT to make a drill bit look cool."

 

[majordslr]

Just came across this which is commentary on a NYT photojournalist Doug Mills shooting stills and video at the same time:

http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/07/13/shooting-twice-at-once/ (Shooting Twice, at Once)

When shooting stills and video simultaneously, Doug Mills, a staff photographer in the Washington bureau of The New York Times, has tried a creative trick or two. He once strapped the video camera around his neck, using his stomach to hold it in place. The results, he said, were “freewheeling and dangling and very difficult to work with.”

On Wednesday, he put his newest idea to work: a double-decker arrangement that almost looks as if his camera is wearing another camera as a hat.

& here's a rebuttal of sorts:

http://blog.9shooter.com/2011/07/top-10-reasons-why-9shooter-bracket-is.html

Top 10 reasons why the 9shooter bracket beats Doug Mills' method for shooting photographic stills and video simultaneously.
When it comes to shooting stills and video simultaneously, the 9shooting method fostered by the 9shooter bracket is superior to the method recently used by Doug Mills of the New York Times, pictured below. Long story short,

1. The 9shooter comes with the powerful dynamic image stabilization in the HD video, afforded by the hd camcorders
2. The 9shooter bracket leaves plenty of room for one to easily mount a shotgun mic or a wireless receiver, thusly transferring the sound capture away from the "click-clicking" of the shutter. Please see a Sennheiser wireless receiver and a shotgun mic mounted in the 9shooter photos below.
3. The 9shooter is more ergonomically comfortable/balanced.
4. The 9shooter is better balanced relative to the gripping point on the stills camera, as the center of mass is below the gripping point, resulting in less torque on the wrist, and more short and long-term comfortability.
5. The 9shooter is lighter, as the typical HD video camera or camcorder is far lighter than a DSLR.
6. The 9shooter allows for easier monitoring of the HD video screen on the camcorder, as all one must do is glance down with their left eye.
7. The 9shooter allows for easier relative adjustments of angles between the two cameras to be made by reaching below the stills camera and center of mass, instead of above it.
8. The 9shooter saves the flash shoe from possible damage.
9. The 9shooter leaves the flash shoe free, allowing a flash to sit in the flash shoe, thusly providing invaluable flash/fill light.
10. The 9shooter allows for far easier zooming on the video camera, as all one must do is reach down and hit the zoom lever which is located at the rear top of the camcorder. (instead of having to reach up above and out front to the lens of the DSLR, as one must in doug's configuration)
11. The 9shooter allows for far more flexibility and countless configurations--a "tinker toys" of bracket customizability, reaching below and above cameras as needed (as seen below).

Here is Doug Mills' setup for shooting stills & video @ the same time.


DESCRIPTION
Doug Mills/The New York Times
The top camera shoots video, the bottom shoots stills.
Shooting Twice, at Once http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/07/13/shooting-twice-at-once/
Here is the all-around better 9shooter setup, which will also come with a free 45SURF t-shirt:

(note the sennheiser wireless receiver which is easily mounted on the 9shooter bracket!)​

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Thoughts? Opinions?