Official Sony NEX-VG10 Thread

So, how does this compare to the Panny HMC40? Looks like with Panny you get framerate options, with new Sony you get lens.

Which cam would you recommend to hobbyist indie filmmakers, videographers looking for $2k cam?
 
e-steve said:
This thread turned a little ugly once the tone changed to insulting the members of this community. I guess you'd have to expect that DVXUSER members might have a tendency to prefer cameras that shoot 24p... since that's what started this whole thing to begin with, no?

It does seem like this camera's demographic would benefit from more framerate options, XLR input, etc - it would surely be a hit if it had just a few more features, but we can't say for sure what will change when the camera is released.

I think it can be productive to discuss the features we feel are missing for our tastes, because you never know who will be reading this thread and how it can affect upcoming product launches.
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I think the problem is that people voicing such strong opinions don't travel outside the US/Canada, so they don't really see what is going on elsewhere.
 
CMcMahon said:
If that's true, then what's the point of the APS-whatever sensor and the interchangeable lenses? If you don't have any pretensions about cinematic qualities, why spend $2000 on this camcorder when you could get what you need for far less?
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Cinematic quality is not defined solely in 24p. For less than the cost of my current GL2, which does not have a 24 frame mode either, this camera rocks. One can certainly appreciate the increased sensitivity and aesthetic qualities offered by the larger sensor DOF characteristics without being enslaved to 24p. If you shoot video for video, 24p is irrelevant.
Hell I used to shoot 16mm industrials for video finish at 30fps because I hate the 3:2 pull down cadence. 3:2 pull down video has none of the aesthetic cadence qualities of 24fps projected film with a 48fps shutter. Straight 30 frame video is so much better.
 
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dop16mm said:
18-200, f3.5-6.3 are you kidding me??? A video lens shouldn't drift more than one stop over its range, constant being Ideal. A 2.8/4 split could work if 2.8 was constant for a range of say 18-50, as that is were most interiors would be.
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This 18-200mm is in line with most other lenses by other makers, Canon and Nikon are f/3.5-5.6, the Panasonic 14-140mm (that covers the generally the same FOV) is f/4-5.8, and Sigma is f3.5-6.3. They are 11x zoom lenses termed the "vacation lens"; Jack of all trades, master of none.

Its also not really "drifting", its merely the maximum aperture, most telephotos are variable aperture lenses because fix aperture lenses are bigger and more expensive; most fixed aperture zooms are incredibly expensive (not the type of lens you would want to bundle with a camera). If you really intended on taking a shot where you are zooming in and out from from 18mm to 200mm then you merely need to set it at f/6.3 or above to get a constant exposure.
 
Guys, knock it off. No more sniping or baiting or any of that.

DVXUser requires polite, respectful interaction. This thread has already run off the rails a couple of times, we don't need any more.
 
Peter J. DeCrescenzo said:
Hi Steve: There is no "2.0x crop factor" or significant reduction of FOV or selection of lenses, for GH1 users relative to the most common 35mm motion picture film format. Again, the GH1's crop factor relative to 35mm motion picture film is ~1.18, not 2.0x.

One of us is missing Barry's point, and I'm pretty sure it's not me. But I could be wrong. Please advise.
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I think there should be a "crop factor" sticky somewhere. Probably most people on this forum, myself included, are not hardcore filmmakers, and when we try to imagine whether a lens is "tele", "wide", or "neutral", we think of a 50mm lens as being neutral. That's because most people are familiar with the ubiquitous 35mm still film format, and most removable lenses we've had a chance to touch in our lives have been so called "full frame" for 35mm still film.

That gives us a quick conversion in our heads if we know the crop factor. 1.6x for APS-C? Why, for a 50mm lens, that's 80mm, something like a portrait lens. 2x crop for 4/3? At 100mm, now we're closing in on tele range.

For me, to say that 4/3 is 1.18 compared to 35mm movie film, is confusing.

Maybe we should think that way but we don't. :)
 
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5 minute original sample video of the camera, provided by Sony:


http://vimeo.com/13344064


Honestly, nothing you couldn't do with most video DSLRs out there.
I don't think they improved sensor readout compared to NEX5. I can see quite a bit of moire/aliasing but haven't downloaded the original file to check (>1GB).

The problem with this camera is it's position in market, aimed at consumers, so features have to be cut. Many people here are right imo saying that this camera only offers form factor and better microphone over current DSLRs and even lacks progressive framerates and variable framerates while being more expensive.
EDIT: I forgot, it offers in camera shake reduction if I remember right


To me, this camera still doesn't make a lot of sense somehow.
I feel like this is more of a cue from Sony than a serious product, showing everybody that they have been first.
But maybe this will sell like hell, who knows?
 
Really like the industrial design and form factor of this camera. I have to admit, I was very close to pre-ordering before I learned it was only 60i- it's just incredible that they would release something without progressive frame rates. They could sell a ton of these if they just added 24p and 30p.
 
so is the only bad issue with this camera is that it outputs an interlaced signal?
correct me if im wrong, but before the gh1 was hacked - didnt it also output a interlaced signal?
perhaps this one can be hacked as well :)

what im curious about is the ergonomic design of the camera. since it does not have a mechanical/servo zoom rocker, why is shaped like a camcorder? if the left hand has to support the weight of the lens, it will be difficult to zoom without rocking the camera
 
stip said:
I don't think they improved sensor readout compared to NEX5. I can see quite a bit of moire/aliasing but haven't downloaded the original file to check (>1GB).
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You absolutely right - according to the press release and published specs, the VG10 uses the exact same image sensor and image processor as the NEX 5, so I don't expect much better quality than what you would get out of their mirrorless cameras.
 
teuron said:
so is the only bad issue with this camera is that it outputs an interlaced signal?
correct me if im wrong, but before the gh1 was hacked - didnt it also output a interlaced signal?
perhaps this one can be hacked as well :)
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The GH1 put out a 720p60 signal, as well as a 24p signal that was wrapped in a 60i container - that's how it was able to be hacked for 24p. The VG10 will only output a 60i signal. This is far from the only bad issue with the camera. It still uses the same sensor and image processor from the NEX 5, so more than likely aliasing and moire issues will not be addressed. It does have a slightly higher bit-rate (24 Mbps), but it's yet to be seen if this will have any significant effect on image quality. It may be able to be hacked to output a 30p signal, but who knows?

This seems to me, IMHO, to be a hastily conceived concept camcorder that simply places a NEX 5 in a Handycam form factor. They took away RAW shooting ability and added manual control of shutter speed, lens aperture, ISO sensitivity and white balance - which isn't available in the NEX cameras (but is in every other video DSLR).

I would say the biggest this the VG10 has going for it is a headphone jack. I wish it was a great product, but at $2k it's going to have to dance a pretty good jig upon release for me to be impressed.

teuron said:
what im curious about is the ergonomic design of the camera. since it does not have a mechanical/servo zoom rocker, why is shaped like a camcorder? if the left hand has to support the weight of the lens, it will be difficult to zoom without rocking the camera
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This is a big concern for me as well. The design seems a bit cumbersome to use, but until I get one in my hands I can't say for sure.
 
a 2K-for-$2K Super35mm Handycam is freaking awesome

a 2K-for-$2K Super35mm Handycam is freaking awesome

JMG100 said:
I have to admit, I was very close to pre-ordering before I learned it was only 60i- it's just incredible that they would release something without progressive frame rates. They could sell a ton of these if they just added 24p and 30p.
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It's 30/25PsF: a progressive image in an interlaced container. Any NLE can remove it without impacting the image quality. (NTSC is 30, PAL is 25.)

In addition, apparently the HDMI output is on during recording, meaning you can hook it up to an AJA Ki Pro which will remove the PsF and turn it into P before it is recorded as ProRes 422.

This is a 2K-for$2K Super35mm Handycam with interchangeable lenses that shoots 25PsF. That's close enough for anyone wanting to make films. Add a Ki Pro and it's just awesome.

P.s. They did tweak the sensor and imaging for video.
 
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