Odyssey 7Q Beauty / Test shots and review

Gene Sung

Veteran
So here's some beauty shots I did with the 7Q. I did wish the weather was more co-operative as it was over-cast for much of two days I had with my wife's baby brother and sister.



https://vimeo.com/83642889


First of all, I want to say I am really impressed by the footage quality. The team at Convergent did a great job.

I shot it 2K RAW, then transcoded to 4:2:2 10-bit and some 4:4:4 12-bit Pro-Res from Resolve with the S-Log profile from Resolve. Unfortunately, I could not grade in Resolve because I had to use a computer at the Studio I freelance at and I only had it for half day, so I just transcoded footage. I have a new Mac coming in 1 week or so that will run Resolve. The Pro-Res clips were graded in After Effects. I shot 60, 120 and 240 fps.

Here's my thoughts on the 7Q.

1) GRADING

I did a very basic grade for this test. Just adjusted the levels and added saturation. On the end sunset shots, I added a little red, but since this was a 7Q test, I wanted to see what the colors were like without stylizing them. Usually, I tend to keep things less saturated and lower contrast. But this time I definitely bumped up the contrast and added more saturation than usual, just to see how the footage holds up. It held up INSANE and grades so well compared to AVCHD.

With S-Log2 exported as 10-bit 4:2:2 is a huge improvement over the 8 bit AVCHD S-Log. Just a world of difference for grading and overall image solidity.

2) ALIASING

To my eye, it's not nearly as bad as many predicted. It's definitely there, but I think the aliasing on the super slow motion (120fps and 240fps) using the 7Q is less than super slow-mo AVCHD. For myself, I tend to shoot with longer focal lengths and shallow DOF, so the aliasing is probably less of an issue than someone who likes deep DOF shots. Then you probably will run into issues. If I pixel peep, I can definitely see it on some shots, but most of the time it can go un-noticed.

I want to do some 24fps aliasing tests, but I have to wait until my new computer arrives.

3) ERGONOMICS

I shot this thing entirely handheld with no tripod. Nothing against Tripods as I use them all the time, but since this was filming un-predictable kids, you had to move very fast. Here's a link to the rig I use. I now replace the Small HD DP 6 with the 7Q.

http://www.builtbyugene.com/blog/blog1_rigs.html

I made a very light rig where the 7Q hangs off the left side where most people's EVF's are and it works really well. I used Westside AV / Olof's L-Series battery plate which mounts onto the right hand side towards the center of the camera. This makes a huge difference in keep the camera balanced vs. having the battery in the center. My handheld rig with camera, lens and 7Q weights about 9.5 lbs total, so it's very light as far as rigs go and I can work super fast. I even used the very large Canon 70-200 f2.8 IS Mark II and it was fine hand holding it.

4) EXPOSURE S-LOG2

For this project on the brighter, sunnier shots I tended to just expose S-Log2 in the middle and it seemed to be fine. Looking a the bright sunny shots, even some of the stuff that was a little under-exposed was fine once I crushed the levels a bit. I'm a little paranoid to over-expose on bright sunny days, even though it might be fine with S-Log (old habits). On the cloudy day stuff, I wish I had over-exposed a little bit more. On the indoor stuff, I also wish I had over-exposed a little more. As most people say, avoid under-exposing too much as it gets noisy fast.

With that said, some stuff might be a little noisier, but I think the grain that comes out of the RAW is much nicer than the grain from AVCHD, which often looks more smudged out, as opposed to more solid grain structure with RAW, if that makes sense. I did notice that a lot of the noise on the S-Log2 gets hidden when the image is crushed back down.

5) MONITOR

I believe this has been mentioned before, but I noticed that my screen has a Flicker to it from time to time, I mainly notice it in bright sun and on playback. It's not always there, but it would be nice to have the monitor be flicker free. Firmware fix?

Overall however, the 7Q monitor is way better than my Small HD DP 6 and way better than the TV Logic (which we cannot seem to calibrate properly to the FS700) we have at work. I used the 7Q without a sun-hood and it worked decently in the bright sun. While I prefer a matte screen, the 7Q is far less reflective than the Small HD which is so reflective that it's completely useless in bright sun without the hood. Props to CD on the monitor.

6) THINGS TO WATCH OUT FOR

I have been told by CD that these issues will be fixed in the next firmware, but you need to know or else it might drive you crazy.

a) You can mix frame rates (24, 60 and 120); but right now it's better to just use 1 card for that. If you have 2 cards in, when you hit the S&Q button to switch frame rates, a "Miss-Matched SSD" error comes up and won't go away till you shut down. It does not affect the footage, but psychologically it's really hard to work with a flashing error message. If you absolutely want to use 2 cards (it is more convenient for storage space), before you switch frame rates you need to un-plug the BNC cable, switch the frame rate, then re-plug the BNC cable to avoid the dreaded Miss-Matched SSD error. Painful. I say just use 1 card for now.

b) I would just use the Record button on the LCD until the firmware upgrade comes out. Right now, if you use Camera trigger and switch frame rates with the S&Q button, it can crash the 7Q and then you have to un-plug the battery and re-boot.

If you avoid those 2 issues, the 7Q runs great. I had no problems at all after figuring that out, but if you don't know that, you will go crazy

240fps works flawlessly. Just don't mix frame rates with 240fps. It's actually easy to forget this when you are run-and-gun and turn off the camera to change a lens and the camera defaults back to 24fps. I actually did that by accident. Be very mindful when you are shooting 240fps of not accidentally mixing frame rates.

7) REQUESTS AND QUESTIONS FOR MITCH

a) My only main complaint is the Histogram (the smaller size option) is still very large as takes up too much screen space IMO. I wish it were about 1/4 of the size.

b) Can you simultaneously have the Peaking and the Zebras on at the same time? Right now, it seems like it's 1 or the other.

CONCLUSION

I love the 7Q as it's a great piece of kit. The only issue I have with the image is that there is a bit of aliasing in the 2K RAW, but like I said, it's fine much of the time and I'm not really sure CD can completely get rid of it since the 2K RAW is line skipped. It's not an issue in most shots. I'm sure the aliasing will be absent in the 4K compressed as well as the HD 4:2:2 10-bit codecs down sampled from the 4K. I cannot wait for those.

Other aspects like the color and the overall solidity of the image is fantastic. Just to be able to grade on true 10-bit 4:2:2 Pro-Res is such a huge step up from 8-bit. HUGE! I can't wait till I get my new computer to take advantage of Resolve.


IMO, the 7Q is well worth the cash. I'm DP on a possible Disney Jr. shoot at the end of the month, and I'm pretty certain we will use RAW.

More footage coming after next week when I get my new Mac.









 
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Thanks Gene for sharing your experience in details, I appreciate the effort you made. Great shots as always!
 
Very nice shots I also love the RAW image you get from the camera. But there is a strange fact: if you record in 24fps you get the same quality, but also the same compression-artifacts when recording with 240fps (with more noise in the dark areas), but it comes from the fs700, you notice it specially on the 4x peaked onboard screen (specially on very detailed high dof shots).
If you switch to 4K these artifacts are gone (makes sense as it uses another stream). i'm also looking forward for the next firmware (hopefully) next month ;-)
 
Very nice shots I also love the RAW image you get from the camera. But there is a strange fact: if you record in 24fps you get the same quality, but also the same compression-artifacts when recording with 240fps (with more noise in the dark areas), but it comes from the fs700, you notice it specially on the 4x peaked onboard screen (specially on very detailed high dof shots).
If you switch to 4K these artifacts are gone (makes sense as it uses another stream). i'm also looking forward for the next firmware (hopefully) next month ;-)

That's interesting McReedy. So the Aliasing is not less on 24fps vs 240fps on 2K RAW?

I think the workflow for me after all the firmware is released will be 60fps and under will be with the codecs associated with the 4K stream because I'm assuming there will be no aliasing. But if I need to over-crank to 120 or 240, I'll switch to the 2K RAW.

But yeah, for my style of shooting (longer lenses, shallower DOF), the aliasing isn't much of an issue. But overall, the 7Q is sweet.
 
7) REQUESTS AND QUESTIONS FOR MITCH

a) My only main complaint is the Histogram (the smaller size option) is still very large as takes up too much screen space IMO. I wish it were about 1/4 of the size.

b) Can you simultaneously have the Peaking and the Zebras on at the same time? Right now, it seems like it's 1 or the other.


Gene,

Nice video and breakdown. I especially liked the sunset shots at the end, which would absolutely kill the camera on internal recording.

That flicker issue will go away with the next firmware update.

The Histogram is the size it is after we surveyed many DPs. In the next update there will be reference marks so that you know what levels the different parts of the display indicate. I know that the FS700's histogram is much smaller, but I also consider it much less useful.

You are correct that currently peaking and Zebras are mutually exclusive. I'll ask if we can allow them to overlap as we do other functions. Most likely the code will read one off of the other, meaning that the peaked edges will automatically get zebra-ed.
 
That's interesting McReedy. So the Aliasing is not less on 24fps vs 240fps on 2K RAW?

There are two things going on here.

One is that the 2K is binning and therefore will show aliasing in some cases, 4K won't because it's not binning. The binning is happening regardless of the frame rate.

What *could* be different is RAW compression and that's a complete unknown to us. I've not done any HFR work so can't speak from experience but i've noticed in some past videos compression noise around high contrast areas very much inline with wavelet and jpeg compression. It makes sense because squeezing 240fps RAW down a 3G connection should be impossible. CD could in some cases perhaps code around artefacts so perhaps they do a good job of cleaning anything up.

McReedy, are you saying if you shoot the same test pattern or scene with 24fps and 240fps the image is identical? I don't think it would be or would expect it to be?

Gene, awesome write up and test! You have an excellent and natural eye for composition.

I think this highlights the fact that right now RAW workflow is very difficult because of application support. In the Adobe ecosystem you might be able to open up RAW but once you choose your settings you get a snapshot of your RAW data, you cannot access the full linear range afterwards. You did the only sensible thing which is to generate movie files encoded in log to compress all that data into. A log workflow is supported much better in most cases. In fact within Premiere Pro a 10 bit log file is the *only* way right now to be able to use SpeedGrade and access full range with their dynamic link.

Rigging is a challenge though, the saving grace is the monitor is pretty light for what it is. I've not found an ideal and i'm wondering what it is that Mitch mentioned for a few months time because if it's any form of EVF, plugging into the O7Q then i'm all up for that. I'd preorder it now :)

I'm not a fan of dSLR quick release plates ever since i had to catch a falling FS100 using them, i've been through a lot of rig solutions, in fact i starting writing them up and ought to finish that. I'm currently on a movcam setup with dovetail baseplates - seems best so far for me...

cheers
Paul
 
I watched your video more than one time now and put some pressure on my dealer ;.-) Unfortunately the shelf is still blank.
What lenses did you use? Shallow DOF is great, I like your style!
 
I watched your video more than one time now and put some pressure on my dealer ;.-) Unfortunately the shelf is still blank.
What lenses did you use? Shallow DOF is great, I like your style!

Thanks for the nice words Clermond. I used Tokina 11-16 f2.8, Canon 24-105 f4 on SpeedBooster, Canon 70-200 f2.8 IS II on SpeedBooster. I needed zooms to work fast. Plus, the IS on the 70-200 when handholding is a must.

I think a good way to get the 7Q is just to call or e-mail various dealers? I got mine pretty quickly because someone cancelled their Pre-Order while I was randomly contacting dealers. Also, keep an eye on this board. I know several dealers who out of the blue posted they had the 7Q in stock. You gotta just jump on it quick when you find one, otherwise you could be waiting till March.
 
I think a good way to get the 7Q is just to call or e-mail various dealers? I got mine pretty quickly because someone cancelled their Pre-Order while I was randomly contacting dealers. Also, keep an eye on this board. I know several dealers who out of the blue posted they had the 7Q in stock. You gotta just jump on it quick when you find one, otherwise you could be waiting till March.

Hi Gene, thanks for your additional information and your hints regarding dealers. I am located in Germany and as far as I know all shelves are blank here. I am very confident that my dealer will be in front of the row. And also I appreciate his service very much so that I think it's worth waiting until they realize my pre-order (which is #4 in their list)
 
Thanks heaps for posting the video and your thoughts and impressions. Much appreciated for those of us still in the long preorder queue. Love the video and the sunset shots in raw are great!
 
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