sourcekings
Member
Whats the big difference on video mics then studio recording mics i have over 7k in studio mics. i record with what the indasry are using. but when it comes to the out in the field dont know.
Not new to audio but new to video audio
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Richard Crowley
Veteran
I also come from an audio background before getting into video (several decades ago). Primarily because of the very sorry state of sound for video that I was hearing, I decided I wanted to try to do something about it.
The primary difference IME is that in a studio (and somewhat in a live performance setting) the visual impact of microphones, stands, cables, etc. is expected, and few people think twice about it. But unless you are shooting "reality" video about the sound biz or musicians in a studio, etc. the image frame is expected to be free of visible (or recognizable) video, lighting or audio infrastructure.
That means that "shotgun" line-gradient mics (generally outdoors) or hypercardioids (generally indoors) just out of the frame on a boom are widely used at much greater working distances than we are accustomed to in traditional audio production.
And/or tiny, (hidable) lav mics with wireless transmitter/receiver kits. Sometimes by the dozens for big "reality" shows. Lectrosonics (one of the leading vendors of pro wireless equipment) just released a small, portable unit with EIGHT wireless receivers...
This is driven primarily by the "reality" show business where practically everyone on-screen has their own wireless lav mic. And, of course, to go along with that the productions that can afford it much prefer individually tracking each mic vs. trying to do any kind of mix in real-time. Multi-track digital recorders are expanding in track count every year. A prime example is the Sound Devices 788T...
The primary difference IME is that in a studio (and somewhat in a live performance setting) the visual impact of microphones, stands, cables, etc. is expected, and few people think twice about it. But unless you are shooting "reality" video about the sound biz or musicians in a studio, etc. the image frame is expected to be free of visible (or recognizable) video, lighting or audio infrastructure.
That means that "shotgun" line-gradient mics (generally outdoors) or hypercardioids (generally indoors) just out of the frame on a boom are widely used at much greater working distances than we are accustomed to in traditional audio production.
And/or tiny, (hidable) lav mics with wireless transmitter/receiver kits. Sometimes by the dozens for big "reality" shows. Lectrosonics (one of the leading vendors of pro wireless equipment) just released a small, portable unit with EIGHT wireless receivers...
This is driven primarily by the "reality" show business where practically everyone on-screen has their own wireless lav mic. And, of course, to go along with that the productions that can afford it much prefer individually tracking each mic vs. trying to do any kind of mix in real-time. Multi-track digital recorders are expanding in track count every year. A prime example is the Sound Devices 788T...
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JordanBlock
Well-known member
In production, clean dialog is the primary goal. Mics and preamps shouldn't color the sound, and the weight of the mic and accessorries is a big deal when at the end of a 20' pole. Mics and mounts made for studio recording tend to be heavy.
Richard Crowley
Veteran
...and large and not especially suitable for the longer working distances one typically encounters in video production.
I guess your question's initial impulse can be considered as very arrogant or very stupid. But then again someone can spend nearly as much on a single Neumann and much more if its vintage. So 7 grand might not gain one very much insight. Therefore, "Video Mics" whether condenser or lav deal mainly with the audio dynamics of the human voice, while hidden from view. They will no where match the specs a large diaphragm mics. However, video is visual medium and careless about its audio source.
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mainstreetprod
Veteran
There is a bit of crossover between the two, specifically the Oktava MK012, which is routinely used to record drums and acoustic guitars in studio settings.
Other lightweight studio hypers might lend themselves to indoor use.
Other lightweight studio hypers might lend themselves to indoor use.
There are so many things wrong here, not the least of which is starting a post with an insult.
For some one crossing over from studio recording to ENG/EFP/audio-for-film, it can be a concern if more must be invested in mics. A $7k mic cabinet can be pretty well-stocked, and it's not a pleasant thought that little or nothing of that very large investment will be of use in this new endeavor.
To assert that video, being a visual medium, is "careless about its audio source" is completely absurd. Audio is no less than half the picture... 75%, depending on whom you ask. The audio source is crucial, but the context has already been addressed here by Jordan: production audio should be as clean and uncolored as possible. Accuracy is key here, as well as rejection of extraneous noise/reflections.
The basics for audio production in TV and film, as far as mics are concerned:
- Short shotgun
- Long shotgun (not as versatile, but useful in a mic kit)
- Hypercardioid, small-diaphragm condenser (the lighter the mic's weight, the better)
- Omnidirectional lavaliere mics, either hard-wired or wired for wireless transmitter
There are other mics that can be useful here, like PZM/plate mics and single-point stereo mics. The basic starter-kit, however, is a short shotgun (like the Rode NTG-3) and a hypercardioid (AT 4053b, AKG CK93, Oktava MK012), plus a boom pole with proper isolation mount and windscreening.
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Ok, you missed the point, I was not dismissing audio in video. Just that there is a audio source that has a monoply. There really isn't such a thing as "video mics", there are dialog mics and field recording, but its is still just a subset of the entire audio/sound source domain used in video/filmmaking. I've used studio mics in video work many times, even to record narrations and dialog, the human voice sounds much better through them. Really, video content makes the potential of audio source possibilities endless. I can tell you this, there are many freelancers in nyc, with a protools rig, a couple of racks, synths, and some primo mics (that don't include a single shotgun mic), that are making a comfortable living in video realm off work from viacom/cbs, time warner, and others.
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
Well other than making very little sense "there is a audio source that has a monoply [sic]"? What the heck are you talking about??? You show some pretty deep lack of understanding about the field. Those NYC folks are not doing production work, so any reference to them and production work is irrelevant. Also if they have "racks of synths" they are probably either composers or are doing low budget one stop shop jobs. Though the later is often just the in house folks at an agency.
So to get to the OP's question. It has been assumed by most of the responders that you want to do production sound. For that the suggestions mentioned by other posters are very on point. If your doing post then it's much more varied. For VO and (arguably ADR) what you have should be fine. For FX recording you might still not need much of a change. One thing you probably don't have that you would need is a stereo pair that is light and housed in a (or pair) of zeppelins. Also field recorders/ preamps. If it's music for video/ film you probably are set.
From your post I tend to think that the other folks were correct in assuming you want production mic advice, so you may want to clarify.
Stop inferring "production", when was that mentioned?, plus its such a loosely defined word.
"lack of understanding about the field"? What field? Yours? Doing voice overs, editing, boom operator? Really, stop inferring.
I imagine you have your own little business ( I'm saying it little because you post too much to be really busy) doing post audio or something. You assume that everyone else's world looks like yours, which is why you infer everything.
Have you ever been to a party in new york? because everyone is a independent producer.
Again, "video mics" was the question and my point was shotgun and lavs are not the totality of what is used. Do you disagree because even after your pointless diatribe you sorta said the same thing? Oh, you used the industry words like "VO" and "ADR", I said recording voice, less formal, I have nothing to prove, but we agreed with "studio mics" akg, neumann are used, yes? So the original poster's 7 grand in studio mics could be put to good use? ...Also, so you don't think composers/music producers should be included because...they are creatives? ...and you are more in the "ditch digger" side of production?
JordanBlock
Well-known member
What are we supposed to infer from 'Video Mics' then? It seems most of us read the question the same way. Without anything further from the OP, who's to say exactly what OP is after?
Anyone with garageband can call themself an 'independent producer' these days.
Like you say 'production' can mean a lot of things these days. In the context of this board, though, it tends to mean film / tv / video production. If the OP was looking for responses relating to a different field, the question probably wouldn't have been posted here.
Richard Crowley
Veteran
Perhaps "ettubaby" killed it. :grin:
Happy New Year to those of us here in North America where we have an hour or two of 2009 remaining.
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
"Stop inferring "production", when was that mentioned?, plus its such a loosely defined word."
Lets see in post (oh gosh sorry to use an industry term) you wouldn't need to know about "video mic's" since your not recording to video. Everybody but you seemed to get the same "inference" so quite possible it was the right one. Well no it's not loosely defined in the film & video field. Just because you don't understand what it means you shouldn't "infer" that others don't.
OK I'll be straight. YOU don't seem to know anything about film and video production or postproduction OR the difference between the two.
Yes, little business, and 15 years working professionally in film and another 20 or so in theatre. I assume my world looks very little like yours, it involves working on professional productions with skilled people. Another really active poster (on another site) is Randy Thom so I don't think posting gets too much in the way.
Yes, and what's your point. Go to the right party and every high schooler with a Digi M-Box is a "sound designer". If I called my self the president of the US would you believe that also?
That is true, you forgot to mention Hyper's. With those three types you have 99.9% of the mics used for production.
Less formal? Try not the same thing. OK VO is pretty much the same thing but ADR certainly isn't. Also none of that is production. Now I very confused about how YOU define studio mics. Neumann and AKG are used a lot in film work but not the Studio Mics they make, at least not in production work. Big heavy mics are used in certain aspects of post, scoring stages for instance.
Depends on what he wants to do with them and what they are. He probably has a few small diaphragm hyper condensers, so with some wind protection those might work well.
I think editors are "creatives". I think composers/music producers are not included because they don't do production audio. Actually they don't do post audio either.
Nope, I'm in that creative wonderland of filmmaking. I do 90% post and 10% production, some music recording and mastering. I haven't had to dig a ditch in years.
Lets see in post (oh gosh sorry to use an industry term) you wouldn't need to know about "video mic's" since your not recording to video. Everybody but you seemed to get the same "inference" so quite possible it was the right one. Well no it's not loosely defined in the film & video field. Just because you don't understand what it means you shouldn't "infer" that others don't.
OK I'll be straight. YOU don't seem to know anything about film and video production or postproduction OR the difference between the two.
Yes, little business, and 15 years working professionally in film and another 20 or so in theatre. I assume my world looks very little like yours, it involves working on professional productions with skilled people. Another really active poster (on another site) is Randy Thom so I don't think posting gets too much in the way.
Yes, and what's your point. Go to the right party and every high schooler with a Digi M-Box is a "sound designer". If I called my self the president of the US would you believe that also?
That is true, you forgot to mention Hyper's. With those three types you have 99.9% of the mics used for production.
Less formal? Try not the same thing. OK VO is pretty much the same thing but ADR certainly isn't. Also none of that is production. Now I very confused about how YOU define studio mics. Neumann and AKG are used a lot in film work but not the Studio Mics they make, at least not in production work. Big heavy mics are used in certain aspects of post, scoring stages for instance.
Depends on what he wants to do with them and what they are. He probably has a few small diaphragm hyper condensers, so with some wind protection those might work well.
I think editors are "creatives". I think composers/music producers are not included because they don't do production audio. Actually they don't do post audio either.
Nope, I'm in that creative wonderland of filmmaking. I do 90% post and 10% production, some music recording and mastering. I haven't had to dig a ditch in years.
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I agree
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