Ninja Star and F35 handheld

[yachacha]

This is not an argument that the atomos ninja star is the best recorder for the Sony F35. It is the smallest prores recorder on the market that isn't build into a screen and it is what I wanted for this setup. I still own a 7Q, I believe the 7Q is the best bargain for the sony F35 as it opens up every frame rate and bit-rate possible. I had to make a lot of concessions to make this tiny recorder work.

Trying to keep the cables clean, I will probably zip tie everything once it is set but you will see the biggest downside of this setup is the cables, lots and lots of cables and hdmi plugs to break. My current solution is to keep lots of spares in the case. The back of the 502 is by far the most fragile part of this setup.

So the Ninja Star actually works great with F35 after I discovered strange work around and offers the ability to record TRUE 23.98P (not psf) Prores. Of course the 7Q is still the F35 king but my original plans for this camera to make the lighest weight balanced handheld setup possible. The truth is for a dramatic piece this handheld camera is intended for, I do not need 50p or 12-bit. 10-bit 422 still looks great.

I personally can't stand the ergonomics caused by the IF box, also with 10-bit 422 as the end goal, i am fine using the monitor out port. I want a camera i can hold on my shoulder for hours, more important than 12-bit for this setup.

SmallHD 502 was a bulky option (say over Zacutto Eye $$$) but I kind of liked how it resembles Arii Amira viewfinder setup. The 502 is also essential for the conversion of the HDSDI to HDMI for the Ninja Star HDMI only recorder.

I have spent a lot of time trying to get a viewfinder right for the F35, you need it far out in-front of the camera if you actually want to keep your head straight and comfortable.

Dtap powers Ninja Star and 502. I also like using the battery for Dtap now because even if i power down the F35, recorder doesn't loose power as can happen when using the side 12v output.

The trick to F35 settings was a little bizarre but it works nicely. The F35 when set to 23.98 is always outputting a pSf signal. The 502 is ok with the pSf and displays it, the Ninja Star is not and show no video lock at any setting. The F35 has a menu option to make monitor out port always 1080i (meant for legacy monitors), once I enable this, the ninja star can see the signal.

Now the Ninja star has built in 1080i to 23.98 reverse telecine option and once I select that, I get true 23.98P files onto the cards. Sort of a backwards way to do it but I seem to get same quality as pulling out IF box to 7Q 10-bit 422 and the pSf has been removed.

 

[dhessel]

Nice work and a very interesting find. I wouldn't have though the star would have been an option at all for the reasons you discribed . Can't imagine getting a more compact setup than that.

 

[jenningsp]

the real question is those settings. -3db and 550%. that your go to? or working something specific?
I've shot everything at 800% 450. but would love to hear your thoughts

 

[yachacha]

Those settings don't mean much. I have been working on finding the best "burnt-in" color on the F35 for a while. And I do like -3 or even -6 whenever i do interviews because it helps make the blacks really clean. My settings are usually one of the Hypergammas but i do like the rec 709x5 setting also. I mess a lot with the saturation and black saturation menu because the F35 by nature is very flat color. My goal was to find the best color straight out of the camera, I have the SLOG workflow for the best dynamic range but I find once you start crushing the blacks in camera, the image get's a lot cleaner.

 

[yachacha]

Here is the last shoot i did with 2 F35's, didn't record the ISO which I think was -3 but could of been 0 because it was so dark.

I know these are all decisions that someone is going to say "WAIT YOU ARE CRUSHING THE DR!". The goal of the setup was as clean as possible which i achieved with these settings. I know SLOG allows the same possibility but with some post work. I wanted to create a clean, higher saturation look and burn it in. Rec709 actually is quite clean even compared to Hyper gamma because it is already crushing the blacks up, HG settings still see into the noisy shadows. The Extended DR when off also looses a bit of noise in blacks because it is seeing into those shadows. I find the nice silky smooth roll off off the highlights is not ruined by changing these settings. The biggest place i found changed and helped footage greatly was both reducing dr into the shadows and in turn making much cleaner blacks without the dancing noise of the F35. F35 grain I love but with anything, if goes from desirable to distracting quite easily.

Here is the doc if anyone was wondering : http://www.imdb.com/title/tt6423664/

 

[rbirnbaum]

Yachacha, there is a ton of info in this post. Thanks for posting pictures and setups. I still have to get into the menus and really start messing with things. I have been playing around with the camera in CineEI mode and exposing for ISO 400. Love the results I am getting but it is true that the blacks get noisy. I saw other posts where they talk about In Camera Noise Reduction achieved in 2 different ways. One is through the NR menu and the other one is through the Detail Menu? Anyway, lots to discover.

I have been thinking about removing the IF Box off my F35 as I am only shooting 10bit ProRes HQ... Any suggestions on how to mount the battery to the back? Did you custom make that plate?