Need Some Advice About Switching to the EX1

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Ben_McElroy

Active member
I'm contemplating switching from my HVX to an EX1.
The HVX is a hog with light and when using my Redrock M2 it's a nightmare.
SxS seams pretty reliable.
The only concern is the rolling shutter on the EX1 is that a real problem for folks?

Anyone come from an HVX that could lend their opinion.
Thank you
 
I came from an HVX and haven't looked back (It's dark, noisy and blocky back there).

The rolling shutter issue is real - and it is a problem for a certain (well documented on this site) situations and should not be downplayed. But personally it has given me no grief for the type of work I do.

Just beautiful images from my EX1.
 
In 1080/24p mode the light difference is about 1/2 a stop. It's better, but don't expect it to solve your M2 nightmare. You'll notice a much bigger difference if you replaced your M2 with something like a Letus Extreme or Brevis; that way you go from about 2 stops lost, down to 1/2 a stop lost.
 
In 1080/24p mode the light difference is about 1/2 a stop
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Matching noise levels on the cameras (using gain on the EX1 or boosting exposure in post) the light difference is closer to three stops.
 
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1.5 stops is still significant when it comes to adapters - it's the difference between a usable shot vs. unusable at the low end.

But I still think it's higher by my visual comparison.

And matching noise levels is the fairest way to compare the sensitivity of cameras. If you are willing to tolerate the noise, you could get another couple of stops out of any camera, so what does sensitivity mean, after all, without considering noise? The same has always held true when trying to accurately rate the ISO of film stocks.
 
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Ben,
I'm sure you did not surprise Barry with that shot. ;)

I'm sure you will find no one that likes that rolling shutter issue.

If you plan of shooting these shots, do not use a CMOS rolling shutter camera.
 
In summation, I think the rolling shutter is the single most concerning thing to happen to video cameras since the very first HDV long-GOP format. And I say that because there are shooters out there who are going to get SCREWED by it (just like they could get totally hosed by HDV). And most of those shooters have no idea of the ticking time bomb that's going to go off when they least expect it. And that isn't right, which is why I've been such a loudmouth about trying to educate people as to the issues!

But, with that said, if you fully understand what it is and what kind of shots it prevents you from getting, then it can be made to work and in the right circumstances rolling shutter cameras can get lovely footage too.. Just be well aware that it can royally screw you over and, as SteveT says, don't shoot those shots. If you need a camera that can shoot every type of shot, you don't want a rolling shutter, plain and simple.
 
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Barry_Green said:
And most of those shooters have no idea of the ticking time bomb that's going to go off when they least expect it.
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I find that the word "most" is VERY hard to believe. Especially, for investments such as the RED ONE which total easily over $30,000.00!

The same for the EX1 at $7,000.00. It's not like joe blow is going to the corner store and buying this camera. Now the HV20 at Circuit City for $720, that's a different story.

Having said that, I agree, you really need to know where these cameras fail performing.
 
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Ben_McElroy said:
I'm contemplating switching from my HVX to an EX1.
The HVX is a hog with light and when using my Redrock M2 it's a nightmare.
SxS seams pretty reliable.
The only concern is the rolling shutter on the EX1 is that a real problem for folks?

Anyone come from an HVX that could lend their opinion.
Thank you
Click to expand...

I'm shooting a music documentary, currently in Austin at SXSW. I'm constantly finding myself in very low light situations. I've got an HVX and an EX1 with me. As soon as the sun goes down I just bag the HVX.... I kind of feel bad doing it too, sort of like I'm ignoring a good friend, but the truth is that the EX1 allows me to shoot in just about any condition. I've been gaining up to about 9db and am totally fine with the noise level. I've even done some 18db shooting (I know) and couldn't believe how it held up. don't get me wrong ... at 18db it's noisy, but nothing like what I thought it would be. that 1/2" cmos sensor is amazing.

Ultimately I think it depends on the kind of shooting you do. For run and gun verite' I think the EX1 has it all over the HVX and then some. Three main reasons:
Focus
Monitoring
Low light capability (useable)

I haven't personally experienced the rolling shutter issue on the EX1, but expect that I will sooner or later. I'm sure it'll be a bummer too... .but here's the thing, if I have to chose between the POSSIBILITY of two frames being ruined when a camera flashes by the rolling shutter OR not getting the shot at all... well then I'm going to get the shot and take my chances with rolling shutter.

I'm sure Panasonic will answer in a big way to the EX1 and I can't wait... for now though, I'm sad to say that the HVX will be the camera I reach for second to the EX1
 
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I think its obvious that most shooters aren't aware of the potential probs with rolling shutters - of course most will be ignorant of it - by pure virtue of not having to deal with it before... why anyone would think otherwise is ridiculous, which is why i mantain preference for the reliable global shutter cams...
 
lawriejaffa said:
I think its obvious that most shooters aren't aware of the potential probs with rolling shutters - of course most will be ignorant of it - by pure virtue of not having to deal with it before... why anyone would think otherwise is ridiculous, which is why i mantain preference for the reliable global shutter cams...
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I prefer global shutters as well... but my preference for global shutters doesn't help me when there isn't enough light to get an exposure with the HVX.
 
lawriejaffa said:
I think its obvious that most shooters aren't aware of the potential probs with rolling shutters - of course most will be ignorant of it - by pure virtue of not having to deal with it before... why anyone would think otherwise is ridiculous, which is why i mantain preference for the reliable global shutter cams...
Click to expand...

It's obvious, how's that?
I think most who own the EX1 is aware of CMOS rolling shutter issues.

I find it really hard to believe someone drops $7,000.00 on a camera without some sort of research. They don't sell these cameras at Walmart.
 
lol well how grossly optimistic you are then stevet ;)

Hey doondoon well your doing just what you should mate - the right cam for the right job/conditions - heck it what i do with cams too mate!
 
I'd say that in my global travels training customers on their HVX200 purchases, less than 10% of the HVX200 owners I encounter have even heard of this site, or DVInfo, or Creative Cow.

I would wager that the numbers are about equivalent for EX1 buyers, and I'd say the percentage is grossly lower for HV20 buyers.

If they're not learning about the rolling shutter here, where are they?

I stand by my statement that the vast majority of rolling shutter camcorder buyers have *no idea* that there's any such thing as a rolling shutter, or that it can impact what they can shoot.
 
Com'on guys...

You mean to tell me if you were to buy something worth $7,000.00 you would not do the slightest research............ oh please...
 
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