Need Buying Advice for FS700

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pifemaster

Well-known member
Hello,

I am a wedding disc jockey and for a little over a year I have been shooting highlight videos at weddings that I perform at using a Panasonic AG-AC160A. I am wanting to upgrade my camera and have pretty much settled on the FS700R (or FS700RH).

I shoot most of my videos during the open dancing portion of a wedding reception, so light is at a minimum. I mostly shoot run and gun style and a good auto-focus is important to me. On my current AC160A, I shoot with my zoom wide open most of the time and most of my footage is captured hand held.

I have been following the FS700 forum for several months and needless to say I am a little overwhelmed with all of the information. I see talk of different lens & adapters such as the metabones speed booster and I am just not sure what it is that I need to order.

I am looking for opinions on the best camera/lens combinations for my situation.

Thank you,
Robert Pfeifer
Pifemaster Productions
 
jcs - Thank you for the reply. The link you posted results in a 404 error. How dol I know which lens have Auto Focus capabilities?

Thank you,
Robert Pfeifer
Pifemaster Productions
 
Sorry about the link- I tested it before pasting. Must have worked because of cookies (shortened it from the super-long link).

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=892387&Q=&is=REG&A=details

The description will mention autofocus when it is present (same with image stabilization).

There is also the LA-EA2 adapter which allows for phase change focusing through a transparent mirror. However, it appears on the FS700 (and others?) the max effective aperture will become F3.5 (not clear if aperture control is possible either). Not a super big deal on the F3.5, but something to be aware of (especially for low light). The advantage is super fast, accurate focusing and more lens choices. See: https://vimeo.com/41323029

For low light event shooting, the stabilized Canon 24-105 F4 with Speedbooster becomes T2.8. Using a picture profile where the noise looks OK in low light works well (anything above ISO 6400 starts to be challenging IMO. While Neat Video works well, prefer to shoot clean when possible (no NR and associated processing time in post)). A 24-70 F2.8 II would become F2 (not stabilized- needs a rig of some kind). I have found a monopod inserted into a belt pouch along with a Manfrotto 701HDV head to work very well for event style shooting (vs a shoulder rig: relatively light & not complex), especially when having to manual focus and zoom. Focus peaking is very helpful too. For fast event shooting, a true event style camera works best (good autofocus, variable power zoom).
 
If your main use is to run around between mixes grabbing footage, then a FS700 seems to be overkill. But maybe you have other goals with the filming as well? Otherwise the FS100 for half the money is a tiny bit better in the dark for all I've read/heard and maybe the Canon C100 would be a better choice as well?
 
I'll second that. I own a 700 but were it not for needing slow motion would have gone for the 100. You may want to think twice about an interchangeable lens camera for that purpose (unless you need shallow DOF). If you don't, there are lots of fixed lens cameras that would fit the bill better.
 
dmitrizigany said:
If your main use is to run around between mixes grabbing footage, then a FS700 seems to be overkill. But maybe you have other goals with the filming as well? Otherwise the FS100 for half the money is a tiny bit better in the dark for all I've read/heard and maybe the Canon C100 would be a better choice as well?
Click to expand...

Since I test Canon C-100 for a while I've got a feeling that it's really "Wedding camera" - seems so small, light and easy to run.....

Canon_C-100_1.jpg


Canon_C-100_2.jpg


...but, as far as I know - there is NO really good auto focusing option on Canon "cinema"- cameras.. and also, there is NO any real Slow Motion available, as we have it in FS-700...


So.. if Robert Pfeifer planning to shoot "cheap, silly weddings" there a plenty of room for C-100.. and he don't need anything else :) ...

....but for really good wedding video, with a "Love Story" and other stuff SLOW MOTION can be VERY IMPORTANT!!!

Personally I cannot imagine Wedding without Slow Motion scene, when they "run to each other and flowers flying around" , .. if you know what I mean ... :)

and.. let's try to look to this from perspective: IF you get something simple just in case to save a few dollars today, you may find out that you need to sell it tomorrow and get something better for what are you filming..
Why do you think it says on B&H site about Canon C-100: "Item is non-returnable" ?

It's like a toy.. compare to FS-700 .. .and it's NOT as "small" as you may think, IF YOU USE 24-70/2.8 and 70-200/2.8 lenses:

C-300a.jpg


C300b.jpg



.. and look to FS-700:

OlegStuff_06b.jpg


I just shoot all day long in Staten Island Theater last week and without this POWER ZOOM I will be not able to do the job..
as for some special stuff you need to "zoom in and zoom out" very slow and smooth with the same speed, what is almost impossible to do manually without focus puller !!!

On Steadicam it's good with Sony 10-18mm OSS lens ... and Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 Zoom will be available soon :)



.... and don't forget about 4K RAW option! :tongue:

FS-700_01.jpg


:2vrolijk_08::2vrolijk_08::2vrolijk_08:
 
I love my fs700 but the last thing i would want it for is run and gun. Get a fixed lens cam EX1 anything else ...700 is spend 2 hours set up cam...for a great shot...ha ha..plus u need great glass with it...go camcorder
 
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SergeSmArt said:
...but, as far as I know - there is NO really good auto focusing option on Canon "cinema"- cameras.. and also, there is NO any real Slow Motion available, as we have it in FS-700...
Personally I cannot imagine Wedding without Slow Motion scene,
Click to expand...
There was a recent firmware update that was supposed to improve autofocus on C100s immensely.
And as he said he pretty much only filmed during the dancing (I assume between mixes, as he was also the wedding DJ) and that it was usually very dark, that would also mean it would be too dark for good slo-mo anyway so the slow motion capabilities of the FS700 are moot.

Don't get me wrong. I believe the FS700 is great and am planning on getting one myself very soon. But from the described usages in this case it seems like a total waste of money unless he has further ambitions with his filming beyond the wedding stuff.
 
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dmitrizigany said:
And as he said he pretty much filmed during the dancing (I assume between mixes, as he was also the wedding DJ ) doing wedding stuff...
Click to expand...

Or, My God !!! :shocked:..sorry, I didn't notice it.. I would kill myself, If all what I have to do, gonna be only a " wedding stuff " :Drogar-BlackEye(DBG


:-Laugh(DBG):
 
As others have said, I'm not sure the FS700 is the right camera for you. You're not going to get 2k/4k unless you add on an external recorder, either the odyssey 7q or the Sony offering, you'd also need to build in shoulder mount, rails, EVF, extended battery etc to make it suitable as run and gun. The subtle light weight camera will become a huge (and expensive) beast.

If you're not stuck on the idea of super-35mm sensor, then take a look at the Sony PMW-200 or Canon XF-305, both robust and good quality cameras.

If you want to go the super-35mm route, then sony Nex-fs100 paired with either the Sony zeiss 16-70 f4 (manual zoom) or Sony g 18-105 (servo zoom). We have the former, stunning lens and incredibly fast autofocus. The latter isn't available until Dec, but also promises to be a decent lens. Not the fastest of lenses, but if you go down the metabones EF route, you're stuck in manual focus, manual zoom and manual iris (the metabones will run auto iris but the lens will adjust in discrete steps, you'll see flickering on the exposure)
 
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Stuart Keasley said:
As others have said, I'm not sure the FS700 is the right camera for you. You're not going to get 2k/4k unless you add on an external recorder, either the odyssey 7q or the Sony offering, you'd also need to build in shoulder mount, rails, EVF, extended battery etc to make it suitable as run and gun. The subtle light weight camera will become a huge (and expensive) beast.

If you're not stuck on the idea of super-35mm sensor, then take a look at the Sony PMW-200 or Canon XF-305, both robust and good quality cameras.

If you want to go the super-35mm route, then sony Nex-fs100 paired with either the Sony zeiss 16-70 f4 (manual zoom) or Sony g 24-105 (servo zoom). We have the former, stunning lens and incredibly fast autofocus. The latter isn't available until Dec, but also promises to be a decent lens. Not the fastest of lenses, but if you go down the metabones EF route, you're stuck in manual focus, manual zoom and manual iris (the metabones will run auto iris but the lens will adjust in discrete steps, you'll see flickering on the exposure)
Click to expand...

second the fs100. under 3k these days. i dont likethe iq of my copy of the sel1670z that muchbut its surely convenient. look forward to sel18105f4pz.

also the tiny nex primes are great, esp sel50f18 oss
 
Well I will start off by saying "You guys have taken the wind out of my sails", but I thank you all for the responses. Before this post, I was dead set on a FS700, an Odyssey 7Q and something like the MovCam shoulder rig. I do not mind spending the money as long as the camera will do what I want it to do.

To give you a better idea of the types of videos I am currently capturing here is a link to my Vimeo Portfolio http://www.pittsburghbride.com

Although the videos consist of primarily reception footage, I also capture the wedding ceremony (if it takes place "on-site") and also like to get some detail shots of the banquet hall & decorations.

I was set on the FS700 because I really like the idea of being able to capture the slow motion footage, along with the super-35mm sensor and the ability to eventually capture a high quality 422 or 444 image using the 7Q. Right now my Panny AG-AC160A just does not seem to have enough dynamic range/image quality.

Now I am more confused about what to do than before :undecided

Thank you,
Robert Pfeifer
Pifemaster Productions
 
firehawk said:
What?! Are you joking about that Sigma Lens? For E-mount?
Click to expand...

I NEVER joking about good lenses! ...:Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)

Here it is:

Sigma-18-35_d.jpg
Sigma-18-35_e.jpg


... and this "Art-series" Sigma lens are VERY GOOD quality!!! It's available with Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Sigma and Sony-A Mounts ....:tongue:

Read this review about this lens: http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/sigma-18-35-1-8 ... and take a look how good is it on F1.8 :

Sigma-18-35_f.jpg


...I just wait when this lens will be in stock in B&H http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/967344-REG/sigma_18_35mm_f1_8_dc_hsm.html

:2vrolijk_08:
 
pifemaster said:
Well I will start off by saying "You guys have taken the wind out of my sails", but I thank you all for the responses. Before this post, I was dead set on a FS700, an Odyssey 7Q and something like the MovCam shoulder rig. I do not mind spending the money as long as the camera will do what I want it to do.
Click to expand...
Sorry for that!
The camera WILL do what you want it to do. It was just my question of "is it worth $10.000+ to film drunk people dancing?"
Are you looking to expand the video part of your business? Do the clients pay good money for the clips of them dancing? Do you think that better looking videos will get you more DJ-bookings? Do you have an interest in filming things for yourself beside the business?
If the answer is "yes" to any or all of those questions, then by all means, go ahead and get it! I wish I could afford an FS700 with a 7Q!

Watching your videos made me think of this song that outlines the differences between western weddings with those of eastern europe:
:)
 
dmitrizigany said:
It was just my question of "is it worth $10.000+ to film drunk people dancing?"
Click to expand...
I laughed out loud when I read that :-)

I do appreciate everybody's input and that was the reason I requested opinions before I jumped in and made my purchase.

The videos have increased my DJ bookings and have also increased the amount I am able to charge. I do believe better looking videos would help even further. Some day I may look to expand my business to include videography, but I need to improve my abilities quite a bit before I could do that.

I understand what almost everyone is saying about the FS700 not being the best camera for run and gun type event shooting. That being said, what is everyone's opinion of something like the new Sony PMW-300K1 XDCAM? Would this camera be better suited for what I am looking to do? On the plus side it has three 1/2" Exmor Full HD CMOS sensors as opposed to the 1/3" 2.2 MP 3MOS Sensors in my current Panasonic. I also like that it can record MPEG HD422 at 50Mbps. From everything I am reading online, I would love to have 2/3" sensors, but spending around 20K is just a little over my budget.

Thank you,
Robert Pfeifer
Pifemaster Productions
 
SergeSmArt said:
I NEVER joking about good lenses! ...:Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)

Here it is:

Sigma-18-35_d.jpg
Sigma-18-35_e.jpg


... and this "Art-series" Sigma lens are VERY GOOD quality!!! It's available with Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Sigma and Sony-A Mounts ....:tongue:

Read this review about this lens: http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/sigma-18-35-1-8 ... and take a look how good is it on F1.8 :

Sigma-18-35_f.jpg


...I just wait when this lens will be in stock in B&H http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/967344-REG/sigma_18_35mm_f1_8_dc_hsm.html

:2vrolijk_08:
Click to expand...

I have this lens in Canon mount (it wasn't available at B&H but I found it elsewhere on line
about a month and a half ago.). I am putting a review of it up on my blog tonight or tomorrow.
Short version it's one of the best still camera lenses for shooting video, that I have ever used.
At a little under $800 it's a no brainer.
 
pifemaster said:
Well I will start off by saying "You guys have taken the wind out of my sails", but I thank you all for the responses. Before this post, I was dead set on a FS700, an Odyssey 7Q and something like the MovCam shoulder rig. I do not mind spending the money as long as the camera will do what I want it to do.

To give you a better idea of the types of videos I am currently capturing here is a link to my Vimeo Portfolio http://www.pittsburghbride.com

Although the videos consist of primarily reception footage, I also capture the wedding ceremony (if it takes place "on-site") and also like to get some detail shots of the banquet hall & decorations.

I was set on the FS700 because I really like the idea of being able to capture the slow motion footage, along with the super-35mm sensor and the ability to eventually capture a high quality 422 or 444 image using the 7Q. Right now my Panny AG-AC160A just does not seem to have enough dynamic range/image quality.

Now I am more confused about what to do than before :undecided

Thank you,
Robert Pfeifer
Pifemaster Productions
Click to expand...
Hmmm, OK, let me try and answer in a different way...

The NEX-FS700 is a great camera, very versatile and capable of providing some great results. The starting block is the camera body, the brains of the unit, you then have a multitude of options available to make the camera suit your application. You've mentioned run and gun style filming, primarily at weddings, so I would suggest:

- Shoulder mount rig, eg the MovCam, with rails for the front and rear
- Some form of external monitor, either an EVF (eg the Alphatron or Zacuto), or a full monitor (e.g the Odyssey 7Q), with a monitor arm
- A decent range e-mount lens, preferably with servo zoom control, e.g the new Sony G OSS 18-105 F4 (e-mount lens will give you access to auto iris and autofocus)
- Grip relocator, to allow you to place the camera's grip on the front rails, e.g zacuto grip relocator
- Battery plate to mount on the rear rails, both to power the camera and EVF, and to provide counter balance for the camera and lens, e.g the MovCam v-lock battery plate (you'll also need to get batteries and charger to suit)
- Battery adapters for camera and EVF/monitor
- A shotgun mic to get decent unidirectional sound ( e.g the Rodes NTG1), cold shoe anti vibration mount, and dead cat to reduce wind noise if you're shooting outside

It will end up being quite an impressive rig once you build it up, handy when you want people to see you and the camera coming from a mile off. I can't see the price adding up to too much over $16,000 if you're sensible.

The FS700 on board high speed is a great bonus, provided the light at the wedding is nice and high you should get some great results (you'll need to be using a shutter speed of double the frame rate to get decent results, so 240 fps you'd need a shutter speed of 1/500th of a second, you'd need 8 times more light than normal shooting at 1/60th)

The Odyssey 7Q will also give you access to 2K raw, and continuous 200fps if you opt for a version 3.0 unit. Post processing raw files shouldn't take you too long once you get the hang of it, I reckon I can get an initial first pass grade done in 5 minutes per clip on resolve, you can then dump out to your preferred editor to get them all together for the edit and final grade...

:thumbsup:
 
maybe you should think about a C100 or at least rent it for a test?
It has beautiful Canon like skin tones, great low light perfomance adn
(hopefully soon) the upgraded 70d autofocus.
 
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