MJPEG high bit rate footage-stills & comparisons.

Wouldn't it be ironic if we ended up not getting 24p working and people started using the old 5D optical flow tactics to convert their 30p stuff?

I'm confident Tester13 will get it sorted out, though :)

Also I'll cut together some of my 720p MJPEG stuff from today and post the Vimeo link here in a bit.
 
Hey guys,

I did upload some footage in Vimeo but when i looked at the uploaded (and re-encoded i assume) result it kinda looks crappy. Here is the link anyways:

http://vimeo.com/12354524

Update: Just uploaded to youtube as well and result is equally crappy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8m-adg-wIIE

Maybe i am doing something wrong. Anyways, If anyone wants to look at the footage, I am happy to provide a download link (file is around 400MB). By the way - this is still 30fps.
 
Has anyone been able to say with authority that the higher bitrate MJPEG looks better than AVCHD? Has anyone shot the same composition in AVCHD and done a comparison? The MJPEG stills posted here look great, but it seems more to do with good composition and proper exposure than the codec.
In Summer 2009, when everyone was just testing out their new GH1's, the MJPEG option was dismissed out of hand, not only because of the 30p, but because it apparently contained more false detail (sharpening) than the AVCHD that couldn't be removed. Is that not the case?
Just throwing my skepticism into the arena. It would be nice to see an A to B comparison of AVCHD and high bitrate MJPEG footage of the same thing so we could make a direct observation.
 
Bleh. My edit of the footage looks like garbage when I convert it to H.264 for Vimeo upload. I mean it's not terrible, but it makes it impossible to judge the gains made by the increased bitrate, since the compression erases it to a large extent.
 
dvbrother said:
Has anyone been able to say with authority that the higher bitrate MJPEG looks better than AVCHD? Has anyone shot the same composition in AVCHD and done a comparison? The MJPEG stills posted here look great, but it seems more to do with good composition and proper exposure than the codec.
In Summer 2009, when everyone was just testing out their new GH1's, the MJPEG option was dismissed out of hand, not only because of the 30p, but because it apparently contained more false detail (sharpening) than the AVCHD that couldn't be removed. Is that not the case?
Just throwing my skepticism into the arena. It would be nice to see an A to B comparison of AVCHD and high bitrate MJPEG footage of the same thing so we could make a direct observation.
Click to expand...

Just look at the snapshots in the first post - the third comparison i think. It shows fast panning with the mjpeg and the avchd. You can see the mud garble the AVCHD implemented in the GH1 outputs and what a smooth image you get from the MJPEG. This is precisely why i shoot mjpeg only - mud free. Just try and shoot some 1080p AVCHD with a complex scene and fast motion ... bleh
 
Oedipax said:
Bleh. My edit of the footage looks like garbage when I convert it to H.264 for Vimeo upload. I mean it's not terrible, but it makes it impossible to judge the gains made by the increased bitrate, since the compression erases it to a large extent.
Click to expand...

Yup, same here ...
 
dvbrother said:
Has anyone been able to say with authority that the higher bitrate MJPEG looks better than AVCHD? Has anyone shot the same composition in AVCHD and done a comparison? The MJPEG stills posted here look great, but it seems more to do with good composition and proper exposure than the codec.
In Summer 2009, when everyone was just testing out their new GH1's, the MJPEG option was dismissed out of hand, not only because of the 30p, but because it apparently contained more false detail (sharpening) than the AVCHD that couldn't be removed. Is that not the case?
Just throwing my skepticism into the arena. It would be nice to see an A to B comparison of AVCHD and high bitrate MJPEG footage of the same thing so we could make a direct observation.
Click to expand...

I don't remember the Photo JPEG mode being dismissed on sharpness or false detail. I do remember it being a drag because of 720/30 and there was, for me, a fixed pattern over the footage.

However, I had always noticed an obvious quality difference between the 1080 AVCHD and 720 PJPEG modes, the latter of which just looked "money".

From what I see in the footage being posted already, just knowing these cameras (All DSLRS) I'm noticing an almost 5D like, still-worthy video file. That's even with YouTube compression.

Of course, scientific is the way to go, skepticism well-warranted, from the side of experiencing all modes and even still having footage left over, it really does look like a much better image to me.

Especially in the video of panning and the waterfall rushing.

I agree, though, let's get some side-by-sides. I'm very very tempted to just grab a GH-1, PL mount and mount some Cooke's to do some testing.
 
Oedipax said:
Bleh. My edit of the footage looks like garbage when I convert it to H.264 for Vimeo upload. I mean it's not terrible, but it makes it impossible to judge the gains made by the increased bitrate, since the compression erases it to a large extent.
Click to expand...

I'm no compression guru, but for my 7D uploads lately I've been outputting H264 without rescaling or anything like that.

Maximum Depth, etc.

And I try to get the file size to 1MB per second. So if it's a 60 Second clip, I'll set a limit of like 3,200Kbps Data Rate.

30? 7,400Kbps max Data Rate

When Vimeo gets ahold of it, it degrades it a bit but enough to where it doesn't look horrid.

As well, remember, Vimeo gives you the option to allow the original file to be downloaded.
 
dvbrother said:
Has anyone been able to say with authority that the higher bitrate MJPEG looks better than AVCHD? Has anyone shot the same composition in AVCHD and done a comparison? The MJPEG stills posted here look great, but it seems more to do with good composition and proper exposure than the codec.
In Summer 2009, when everyone was just testing out their new GH1's, the MJPEG option was dismissed out of hand, not only because of the 30p, but because it apparently contained more false detail (sharpening) than the AVCHD that couldn't be removed. Is that not the case?
Just throwing my skepticism into the arena. It would be nice to see an A to B comparison of AVCHD and high bitrate MJPEG footage of the same thing so we could make a direct observation.
Click to expand...

I can say with authority that the image quality 10x better than the avchd. The original mjpeg had artifacting & some moire (I have this bamboo fence in the yard the the mjpeg & avchd hated) but this is because of higher detail.
Also colour banding was a issue and I had probs with reds being a bit crushed.
Now I dont have any issue....theres no moire...very very fine artifacting that you can only barely just see from pausing some footage...the image has a more smoother filmic look (in comparision to the harshness of the original mjpeg) this must all be to do with compression settings.
I want to upload some footage...but I have a free vimeo account and use my limit. Come saturday I will post something up.
 
A quick test today between MJPG High Bitrate 720 30p and AVHCD 1080 24p

A quick test today between MJPG High Bitrate 720 30p and AVHCD 1080 24p

It appears I missed the latest patch by about 20 minutes last night! This test would have been with the high bit-rate AVHCD but alas, I missed it. Will grab it today/tonight for some tests.

Here is a frame grab from two shots both having the same medium fast pan of a high detail scene. I used the MJPEG settings found with the avg bit-rate of 79mbs found on page 187 or so of the main thread.

Here are the settings I used from Jobless for the mjpeg

Quality settings (E1 to E4) - 512, 352, 220, 200
Table settings (E1 to E4) - 24, 24, 24, 24

Using a SanDisk Extreme III 30mbs class 10 card with 16gb of memory.

This Footage was not in infinity focus, so only the flowers and Rhody's are in focus (next test will be infinity. Smearing on the edges is my lens. Schneider Xenon 28mm F2 arriflex mount lens (c. 1972).

AVHCD

AVHCD2.jpg



AVHCD Scalled down 1:2 in VLC

AVHCD3.jpg


Here is MJPEG

MJPG.jpg


MJPEG.jpg
 
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dvbrother said:
Has anyone been able to say with authority that the higher bitrate MJPEG looks better than AVCHD? Has anyone shot the same composition in AVCHD and done a comparison? The MJPEG stills posted here look great, but it seems more to do with good composition and proper exposure than the codec.
In Summer 2009, when everyone was just testing out their new GH1's, the MJPEG option was dismissed out of hand, not only because of the 30p, but because it apparently contained more false detail (sharpening) than the AVCHD that couldn't be removed. Is that not the case?
Just throwing my skepticism into the arena. It would be nice to see an A to B comparison of AVCHD and high bitrate MJPEG footage of the same thing so we could make a direct observation.
Click to expand...

I did some Avchd vs mjpeg tests...
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=213082&page=7
 
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Here are two frame grabs from the GH1's 1080P mode I just did a few moments ago.

These are not upscaled 720P files like a few days ago at the beginning of this thread. I have been trying out the 1080P mode and this I can say this seems very close to true 1080P. The 720Ps are great, however the 1080P's have punch. Either it's got one hell of a upscaler, or it's real 1080, or close enough. Tomorrow I will shoot some out door stuff and see how well it does.

Mjpeg is truly awesome. I frame goodness at good bit rates.


Picture70.jpg


Picture71.jpg


GH11080PMODE.jpg


Picture67copy.jpg


Picture76copy.jpg



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Papa, Tester13, you dont know how good this is

Papa, Tester13, you dont know how good this is

PappasArts said:
Just posted a few frame grabs shot real quick from the GH1's 1080P Hi- Bit rate MJPEG mode.

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=2015034&postcount=71

Pappas
Click to expand...

Or what you've found here! This is a massive breakthrough because although mjpeg 1080p may not be suitable for everyday shooting for video, for stills this is incredible, 30fps 2mpx stills of this defintion can be very handy indeed for sports capture-impromptu capture, 3-5 secs like this is fine for many stills shooters, and baecause we can get down to lower shutter in a continuous mode this helps enormously. Tester13, would love to explore the highest res we can go in mjpg too. These are fabulous! look like 4k scans!!!! This is getting better and better. Tester13 anymore on the 120fps at a 720p res? again 5-10sec of that would be oh so good
 
Pappa, can you list exactly what paramaters and settings you have checked for this. Just 10 secs of this type of footage would be awesome for fast stills extraction, sports, in promputu capture, truly awesome.
 
Adventsam said:
Or what you've found here! This is a massive breakthrough because although mjpeg 1080p may not be suitable for everyday shooting for video, for stills this is incredible, 30fps 2mpx stills of this defintion can be very handy indeed for sports capture-impromptu capture, 3-5 secs like this is fine for many stills shooters, and baecause we can get down to lower shutter in a continuous mode this helps enormously. Tester13, would love to explore the highest res we can go in mjpg too. These are fabulous! look like 4k scans!!!! This is getting better and better. Tester13 anymore on the 120fps at a 720p res? again 5-10sec of that would be oh so good
Click to expand...

They remind me exactly of 4K scans down sized to 2K. Mjpeg is the holy grail for this camera in doing hi res work. I have been messing with this all night. Avchd is great for long form cause of file size' this is fantastic for shooting top projects. Mjpeg is highly regarded and is capable of beautiful results. Get this to over 80Mbits and it gets even better.

MJPEG 1080P mode
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=2015034&postcount=71

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Yes, can we get your exact settings, Pappas? I've just tried 1080 MJPEG using settings publicized, er, elsewhere, and had consistent record freezes after just one second.
 
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