MJPEG 70mbits+ 1080p settings

I bought a Kingston Class 10 card today, but unfortunately it froze up after 10 seconds recording with the 720/30p 4:2:2 settings from the 'stable settings' thread.

I didn't do exactly scientific tests, but I did try and shoot some of the same scenes with both the AVCHD c settings and the suggested MJPEG 4:2:2 (for less than 10 seconds).

I'm going to try and upload some grabs as soon as I figure out how to best do that, but I will say that in motion, the AVCHD seems sharper and with much less aliasing, but when comparing a grab from the two videos side by side, the 4:2:2 mjpeg appears to have much better dynamic range and color.
 
I notice that the 4:2:2 causes more errors with the settings shooting charts that have hi-detail..

So I tried the DVCPRO HD 1280X1080 frame size.. It appears the same charts are topping at 79.10mbits- and it records. I'll know better tomorrow though. You can do it yourself, just set the width in Ptool from 1440X1080 to 128OX1080.


MJPEG 1280m Encoder settings.
MJPEG 1280p width - input 1280
MJPEG 1280p height - input 1080
MJPEG SIZE 1280m - SELECT
MJPEG ENCODER 1280m Encoder -SELECT
MJPEG 4:2:2- SELECT
QUALITY SETTINGS [ 384, 330, 300, 276 ]
TABLE SETTINGS [ 24, 24, 24, 24 ]


Pappas
 
lpowell said:
I've also had good results on a Class 6 Transend 16GB SD card after reducing GOP length. I reduced the 1080p GOP from 15 down to 12, and the 720p GOP from 30 down to 15 (after checking the 720p 59.94 -> 29.97 patch as well). These settings produce a 0.5 second GOP length in both modes.

A shorter GOP length produces better image quality when panning and filming moving objects. Since we have more bitrate available now, it seems reasonable to use some of it to reduce GOP length.
Click to expand...


How does one check if their GOP values get the required 0.5 value? Can you do it through simple calculations or do you have to review footage to see?

cheers.
 
MR Fanny said:
How does one check if their GOP values get the required 0.5 value? Can you do it through simple calculations or do you have to review footage to see?
Click to expand...

You could use an AVC stream analyzer like Elecard Stream Analyzer to check the GOP size.

That ratio of half your frame rate is not required just simply a guideline. You can change the GOP size to any number you would like but some numbers are better optimized for AVC and the GH1. It seems like the GH1 freezes with GOP sizes 6 and under from what I have tested.

A good rule of thumb is to divide the frame rate by 1/2, 1/3 or 1/4. Just remember the smaller the GOP size the more I-frames. More I-frames means a less compressed higher quality file.

GOP size can effect the video quality even more than the bitrate within reason. We should be using both bitrate and GOP size to optimize the video quality.
 
Last edited:
Man this is weird. My camera must be the exception that proves the rule or something.

So for the last few days I've been experimenting with the AVCHD settings, going up as far as the "C" settings to see what would happen with my lowly SanDisk Ultra class 4 card. Shooting some "foliage of death" for clips up to 45 seconds long and couldn't lock up the camera. Today I tried a two minute clip, not foliage, but lots of wild pans, and everything went fine.

So, I thought I would try the MJPEG settings Pappas lists at the beginning of this thread. Remember, I am still using the lowly class 4 SanDisk Ultra 8GB card. Do the patches and fire the camera up. As expected, even in a static shot, got 1 second of footage and the camera quit. Tried again and got 2 seconds of footage before the camera quit. So I switched over to AVCHD and shot some stuff. I compared the AVCHD with the MJPEG and must admit the MJPEG looks much better to my eyes (lower contrast, more organic and realistic colors).

So I wanted to see if I could get the AVCHD to look more like the MJPEG (since I won't be getting my class 10 card for a few days). I went into the camera menu and changed the Film Mode from Standard to Smooth and changed contrast to (-1) and Saturation to (-1). Shot some more AVCHD and did a two minute clip (still testing to make sure I can shoot unlimited with this class 4 card).

Then just for fun I switched back over to MJPEG. Started shooting a static shot, expecting the camera to quit after a couple of seconds. But it kept going. After 15 seconds I picked the camera up and started slowly moving it around to see if that would crash it, but it kept going. After 30 seconds I started moving around faster. And it just kept going. Finally after 1 min I shut it off.

So this is Pappas settings, with a lowly SanDisk Ultra 8GB class 4 card. Maybe it has something to do with the Film Mode settings. Maybe smooth doesn't tax things as much as Standard does. But when I look at the clip in Quicktime, it tells me the data rate is 73.89 mbits/sec.

Amazing. And confusing.

Best,
-Tim

PS: Here are all the patch settings I am using with this build:
Version change - naturally
Third Party Battery - Checked
Native 24p/25p - Checked
MJPEG Size 1280m ->1920m Checked
MJPEG Encoder 1280m ->1920m Checked
MJPEG 1280 width - 1440
MJPEG 1280 height - 1080
MJPEG 1280 420 -> 422 color sampling Checked
MJPEG E1 Quality - 384
MJPEG E1 Table - 24
MJPEG E2 Quality - 330
MJPEG E2 Table - 24
MJPEG E3 Quality - 300
MJPEG E3 Table - 24
MJPEG E4 Quality - 276
MJPEG E4 Table - 24
Video Buffer - 40000000
Video Bitrate Adjust - 50000000
Overall Bitrate Adjust - 52000000
Limiting Bitrate Adjust - 60000000
1080p24 GOP size - 8
 
Last edited:
PappasArts said:
I notice that the 4:2:2 causes more errors with the settings shooting charts that have hi-detail..

So I tried the DVCPRO HD 1280X1080 frame size.. It appears the same charts are topping at 79.10mbits- and it records. I'll know better tomorrow though. You can do it yourself, just set the width in Ptool from 1440X1080 to 128OX1080.


MJPEG 1280m Encoder settings.
MJPEG 1280p width - input 1280
MJPEG 1280p height - input 1080
MJPEG SIZE 1280m - SELECT
MJPEG ENCODER 1280m Encoder -SELECT
MJPEG 4:2:2- SELECT
QUALITY SETTINGS [ 384, 330, 300, 276 ]
TABLE SETTINGS [ 24, 24, 24, 24 ]
Click to expand...

Papas,

I am trying to use the 4:2:2 setting with your settings but I think my Transcend class 6 card can not handle the 4:2:2 with your settings. Your settings without 4:2:2 work grear with the Transcend 32GB Class 6 card

Are you having any problems with the Sandisk Class 10 and 4:2:2? I want to make sure 4:2:2 will work with that card before I buy it.
 
nubins said:
Papas,

I am trying to use the 4:2:2 setting with your settings but I think my Transcend class 6 card can not handle the 4:2:2 with your settings. Your settings without 4:2:2 work grear with the Transcend 32GB Class 6 card

Are you having any problems with the Sandisk Class 10 and 4:2:2? I want to make sure 4:2:2 will work with that card before I buy it.
Click to expand...

As mentioned above, I'm getting 4:2:2 with Pappas' settings onto a SanDisk Ultra 8GB class 4 card. There's something going on here that we're missing.

Best,
-Tim
 
Timmyjoe said:
So, I thought I would try the MJPEG settings Pappas lists at the beginning of this thread. Remember, I am still using the lowly class 4 SanDisk Ultra 8GB card. Do the patches and fire the camera up. As expected, even in a static shot, got 1 second of footage and the camera quit. Tried again and got 2 seconds of footage before the camera quit. So I switched over to AVCHD and shot some stuff. I compared the AVCHD with the MJPEG and must admit the MJPEG looks much better to my eyes (lower contrast, more organic and realistic colors).

So I wanted to see if I could get the AVCHD to look more like the MJPEG (since I won't be getting my class 10 card for a few days). I went into the camera menu and changed the Film Mode from Standard to Smooth and changed contrast to (-1) and Saturation to (-1). Shot some more AVCHD and did a two minute clip (still testing to make sure I can shoot unlimited with this class 4 card).

Then just for fun I switched back over to MJPEG. Started shooting a static shot, expecting the camera to quit after a couple of seconds. But it kept going. After 15 seconds I picked the camera up and started slowly moving it around to see if that would crash it, but it kept going. After 30 seconds I started moving around faster. And it just kept going. Finally after 1 min I shut it off.

So this is Pappas settings, with a lowly SanDisk Ultra 8GB class 4 card. Maybe it has something to do with the Film Mode settings. Maybe smooth doesn't tax things as much as Standard does. But when I look at the clip in Quicktime, it tells me the data rate is 73.89 mbits/sec.

Amazing. And confusing.

Best,
-Tim

PS: Here are all the patch settings I am using with this build:
Version change - naturally
Third Party Battery - Checked
Native 24p/25p - Checked
MJPEG Size 1280m ->1920m Checked
MJPEG Encoder 1280m ->1920m Checked
MJPEG 1280 width - 1440
MJPEG 1280 height - 1080
MJPEG 1280 420 -> 422 color sampling Checked
MJPEG E1 Quality - 384
MJPEG E1 Table - 24
MJPEG E2 Quality - 330
MJPEG E2 Table - 24
MJPEG E3 Quality - 300
MJPEG E3 Table - 24
MJPEG E4 Quality - 276
MJPEG E4 Table - 24
Video Buffer - 40000000
Video Bitrate Adjust - 50000000
Overall Bitrate Adjust - 52000000
Limiting Bitrate Adjust - 60000000
1080p24 GOP size - 8
Click to expand...


Hey Timmyjoe, Excelent report!

Yes, different settings can change the bit rate slightly. BTW these Mjpeg settings top out at 83.01Mbits. I shoot certain charts that forces the camera to push the mbits rate to peak. One goods real world thing to films is the ocean crashing over rocks.

**New MPEG Setting tests**
Last night I tried the DVCPRO HD 1280X1080 frame size..
It appears the same charts are topping at 79.10mbits- and it records. Give it a try, just set the width in Ptool from 1440X1080 to 128OX1080.

This combination could be the most stable yet! If it is, I will update the first post.

**New settings!
MJPEG 1280m Encoder settings.
MJPEG 1280p width - input 1280
MJPEG 1280p height - input 1080
MJPEG SIZE 1280m - SELECT
MJPEG ENCODER 1280m Encoder -SELECT
MJPEG 4:2:2- SELECT
QUALITY SETTINGS [ 384, 330, 300, 276 ]
TABLE SETTINGS [ 24, 24, 24, 24 ]



Pappas
 
nubins said:
Papas,

I am trying to use the 4:2:2 setting with your settings but I think my Transcend class 6 card can not handle the 4:2:2 with your settings. Your settings without 4:2:2 work grear with the Transcend 32GB Class 6 card

Are you having any problems with the Sandisk Class 10 and 4:2:2? I want to make sure 4:2:2 will work with that card before I buy it.
Click to expand...


Last night I shot my charts that peak the codec. It shut off with the 4:2:2 patch. So I decided to lower the headroom a bit by adopting the ""DVCPRO HD 1280X1080"" frame size instead of the 1440x1080 being used. That worked! Dropped the Mbits rate in the 10 range. More tests today, so far so good.

Give it try.

Pappas
 
Just tried 1280x1080 and 4:2:2. Seems to work well with the Transcend Class 6 cards.

1440x1080 and 4:2:2 seems to have a lot of write errors and does not work for more than 2 seconds.

Should a class 10 card handle 1440x1080 @ 4:2:2 or are there problems with 1440?
 
nubins said:
Just tried 1280x1080 and 4:2:2. Seems to work well with the Transcend Class 6 cards.

1440x1080 and 4:2:2 seems to have a lot of write errors and does not work for more than 2 seconds.

Should a class 10 card handle 1440x1080 @ 4:2:2 or are there problems with 1440?
Click to expand...


Excellent!

It seems that ""DVCPRO HD 1280X1080"" in 4:2:2 mode is working. Still more tests needed to push it. However, I noticed that average is 75mbits and peak is around 81.97 mbits.

I have sanddisk class 10 extreme. I got the failures too at 4:2:2 with older settings. Class 10's are at the 80mbits threshold.


**NEW 1080 MJPEG 4:2:2 SETTINGS TO TRY**

MJPEG 1280m Encoder settings.
MJPEG 1280p width - input 1280
MJPEG 1280p height - input 1080
MJPEG SIZE 1280m - SELECT
MJPEG ENCODER 1280m Encoder -SELECT
MJPEG 4:2:2- SELECT
QUALITY SETTINGS [ 384, 330, 300, 276 ]
TABLE SETTINGS [ 24, 24, 24, 24 ]




Pappas
 
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short question: you resize 1280x720 MJPEG to 1440x1080 in camera to sqeeze it to 1920x1080 in post, is that correct?
why dont you resize it to 1920x1080 im camera directly? too much bitrate?
thanks
 
Has anybody else noticed a softness to the footage.

I have used some DVCPRO HD cameras and always thought they looked soft because of the 1280x1080 anamorphic scaling. While doing some tests at 1280x1080 all the footage looks fairly soft just like DVCPRO HD.

I almost think we would be better off recording at 1280x720 and upresing to 1920x1080 in post.
 
Last edited:
Just got back in from getting eaten alive by the Chicago mosquitos while shooting "foliage of death".

Using the previous MJPEG settings (1440 x 1280), my lowly class 4 card couldn't handle the foliage and the camera quit after a couple of seconds. So I loaded the new settings Pappas posted, which basically is just lowering the 1440 to 1280, I left everything else the same. Back out to the foliage/mosquito field and bam, couldn't get the camera to quit. Handled it like a pro. So the new settings worked great for me:

**NEW 1080 MJPEG 4:2:2 SETTINGS TO TRY**

MJPEG 1280m Encoder settings.
MJPEG 1280p width - input 1280
MJPEG 1280p height - input 1080
MJPEG SIZE 1280m - SELECT
MJPEG ENCODER 1280m Encoder -SELECT
MJPEG 4:2:2- SELECT
QUALITY SETTINGS [ 384, 330, 300, 276 ]
TABLE SETTINGS [ 24, 24, 24, 24 ]

I now need to process the footage and see if I'm noticing the same image quality things that Nubins did, but there were no problems with the camera quitting with these new settings, even with my SanDisk Ultra 8GB class 4 SD card and hand held panning through "foliage of death".

Best,
-Tim
 
nubins said:
Has anybody else noticed a softness to the footage.

I have used some DVCPRO HD cameras and always thought they looked soft because of the 1280x1080 anamorphic
scaling. While doing some tests at 1280x1080 all the footage looks fairly soft just like DVCPRO HD.

I almost think we would be better off recording at 1280x720 and upresing to 1920x1080 in post.
Click to expand...


I agree. I don't like having to use the HDcam/DVCpro squeeze process either. Though at this Mbit rate it's a lot less
destructive. The bandwidth, especially since 4:2:2; filled up more. Shooting 720P 4:2:2 at 70+mbits is
like having 1080 around 140mbit. If you look at my 720P samples, they were smooth and resolute.
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showpost.php?p=2008984&postcount=1

70+ mbits thrown at a 720P image is a great deal of quality compression that produces a gorgeous image.

That said, getting 70+mbits at 1080P in 4:2:2 at a DVCPRO HD's squeezed format for a 1000 bucks seems like theft.

I haven't used the 4:2:2 on the 720P mode yet. Gonna do that latter...-

Here are some macros I did while testing settings for MJPEG 1080. These Macros are little soft since
I slapped a 2X adapter on the macro 210mm lens.
Picture13.jpg


Picture14.jpg


Picture4.jpg


Picture15.jpg


Picture20.jpg



Pappas
 
Hi Michael,

How are you going? Are you sure you haven't shot this macro stuff with a RED ONE by mistake, by any chance? ;-)

E. :-)
 
Emanuel said:
Hi Michael,

How are you going? Are you sure you haven't shot this macro stuff with a RED ONE by mistake, by any chance? ;-)

E. :-)
Click to expand...


Hey Emanuel,

I'm doing good, how about you?

Shhhhh, ( whispered ) "I'm beta testing scarlet- it's not really the GH1".......

I wish it was Red! That's a great system, and a cool company.

Pretty amazing what that little guy is capable of; isn't..?

Lots more testing to do though- :-)

Pappas
 
PappasArts said:
Hey Emanuel,

I'm doing good, how about you?

Shhhhh, ( whispered ) "I'm beta testing scarlet- it's not really the GH1".......

I wish it was Red! That's a great system, and a cool company.

Pretty amazing what that little guy is capable of; isn't..?

Lots more testing to do though- :-)

Pappas
Click to expand...
Fine, thanks. LOL I knew you are the guy :-) What have you been preferring most? Higher 1080p resolution or 720p with higher bitrate per pixel?
 
I have not had any luck trying to use 1280x720 and 4:2:2. I keep getting card errors so it could be my Class 6 card but I don't think that is it.

I have been able to get 1440x1080 with 4:2:2 to work but it is unstable.
 
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