FS7: Microphone Choices for FX9

powervideo

powervideo

Well-known member
Anyone have any ideas for microphone choices on the FX9? I'm looking for a short stereo shotgun solution that can mount in the standard 21mm mic holder that comes with the camera. Has anyone used the Sony ECM-MS2? I like the compact design and the stereo soundstage (even if very simple) might be useful on B-Roll.


sony mic.jpg
 
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I use this Audio Technica mic on my Fs7:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/495302-REG/Audio_Technica_AT875R_AT875_Short_Condenser_Shotgun.html


I'm not a Sound Recordist or particularly scrupulous about sound, but it came highly recommended and does what I need.

One down-side of that Sony you mention is the double-xlr presents a minor problem when you want to plug a wireless into one of the two channels because you then have the unused xlr of that Sony mic dangling with no home and needing to be secured. Same as when your Sound Op plugs in his snake and your onboard shotgun's single XLR needs to find a home. My solution is a Bongo tie around the rear of the camera's top handle, the Bongo used to secure the end of the XLR not being used at the time. Another little niggle with that Sony is that the cables are made "into" the rear of the mic and do not disconnect. Which means if one of those two cables goes bad you will be without the mic while having that repaired. With the Audio Technica I linked, the cable is not permanently attached. If it goes bad you simply swap it out with another short xlr cable. Or, if you want to detach the cable altogether while you are going off your Sound Op's two-channel snake, you can. That said, the likelihood of the cables going bad is pretty slim. Chances are you could run with that mic on your camera for years and abuse both the mic and the cables and it would hold up to that.

That Audio Technica is around $100 less than the Sony. Granted, it isn't a stereo mic like the Sony. But whatever you decide the length of both the Sony ECM-MS2 and the AT875R is where you want to be. For a time I had a Rode shotgun on my camera that is longer in length than those two mics and it was an issue when using super-wide lenses. The Rode intruded into the frame and had to be backed off anytime I went super-wide.
 
I’m considering that Sony mic as well. And complement it with a better mono mic for more critical circumances.
I’m shooting a lot of live events, then a stereo mic for room ambience would be great.

JPNola said:
One down-side of that Sony you mention is the double-xlr presents a minor problem when you want to plug a wireless into one of the two channels because you then have the unused xlr of that Sony mic dangling with no home and needing to be secured.
Click to expand...
I’m planning to solve this by getting one of the Sony wireless receivers that plug into the MI shoe...
 
I am also buying the Sony mic for the Z280. You can use it as stereo or mono as described below. But if used in stereo the multi shoe on the Sony cameras with their wireless is great. Especially if you replace the Sony wireless mic with the Saken COS11D. It does mean I can not use my Lectro system, but the Sony wireless has stood up well in the last year.

From Sony Product page:
Stereo and mono operation
The ECM-MS2 offers mono operation when stereo is not required, simply by cutting off the power supply to the right channel. This capability is useful for recording environmental sounds with one channel, while the other channel is being used with an additional wireless microphone system.
 
The ECM-MC2 is a great little mic for day-to-day use. I move it from camera to camera when I want something small and light, and that doesn't protrude too far above the lens. The sound is excellent.
For more serious applications I use a ECM-680S on the camera or a boom pole.
 
+1 on the ATR-875R if you're happy with a mono ambience channel (I personally prefer that.) If I was buying now, I'd also consider the new Rode NTG5.

A mono feed then leaves XLR2 as a spare input for whatevers.

I'm pretty fastidious about sound. I'm a producer/solo op with an AP (my wife) and we shoot with a discrete footprint all over the world. She booms a mic on a radio butt plug TX when we're on the move.

After years of always running principle sound through cables, we've recently done a couple of fairly big projects using the Sony dual radio RX on the MI Shoe, receiving either:

1) Two radio lapel/lav TXs or

2) One radio lapel/lav TX plus one Sennheiser 416 butt plug TX, on a boom pole with a quick release so Cath can ditch the pole and go in close with the mic mount.

We've just completed post on a 30 min doc for the NHS here in the UK and I'm really happy with the amount of dynamic range and low noise we get with the Sony radio system - we'll carry on using it for booming actuality sound and lavs, as the tiny trade off in audio quality is more than made up with portability and zero cables.

We still run an Oktava MK012 as our static interview mic (boomed over the interviewee) and that always runs on a cable.

As a small team trade off, it all works well for most of our scenarios - and the MI Shoe is a fantastic thing to have and a very clever way of keeping you in the Sony eco-system.

Ben.
 
Thanks everyone for the replies. I'm curious about the new URX-P40 receiver with SMAD-P5 setup. I really like the smaller size, simple frequency-sync facility and the digital interface. But no dual-channel yet.
 
Also planning on buying the fx9.. I will have a look at the new Rode NTG5.. all the reviews Ive read say its very good..
 
Thanks, the Saken CS-M1 looks great and is short enough for smaller cameras. But checking further the reviews are not that great. CS-3e has great reviews, but is too long. And it is only for ambient sound, not like my boom mic. So I think I will give the Sony a try. Can't loose at that price, and Doug has always recommended it.
 
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Paul Cronin said:
Thanks, the Saken CS-M1 looks great and is short enough for smaller cameras. But checking further the reviews are not that great. CS-3e has great reviews, but is too long. And it is only for ambient sound, not like my boom mic. So I think I will give the Sony a try. Can't loose at that price, and Doug has always recommended it.
Click to expand...

Yes sir. The CS-3e is pretty long. When I first saw your thread I didn't respond because it seemed like you were looking for a short mic. Then people started chiming in with what they intend to use so I figured it was time for me to hop on board. haha

The CS-3e is often used as a boom mic but I've never used it for sit down interviews. I think the reach would be detrimental and introduce more reverb (like most good shotguns do).
 
Thanks, appreciate you hopping on board. Any sailing analogy will get my attention.

It is so rare I even use an onboard mic unless the camera is locked down, and i need ambient sound. But I am shooting more stock so the Sony looks like a good mic to try.

I love my Saken COS-11d lavs on all my wireless gear. They make a huge difference over all the other lavs I have tried. So I am sure the CS-3e is very nice. But for boom I have the Sennheiser MKH-60 which I love. Even more then my Schoeps CMIT 5 U which I sold.

If you do not use the CS-3e for boom where do you use it?
 
Paul Cronin said:
Thanks, appreciate you hopping on board. Any sailing analogy will get my attention.

It is so rare I even use an onboard mic unless the camera is locked down, and i need ambient sound. But I am shooting more stock so the Sony looks like a good mic to try.

I love my Saken COS-11d lavs on all my wireless gear. They make a huge difference over all the other lavs I have tried. So I am sure the CS-3e is very nice. But for boom I have the Sennheiser MKH-60 which I love. Even more then my Schoeps CMIT 5 U which I sold.

If you do not use the CS-3e for boom where do you use it?
Click to expand...

I actually use a Schoeps CMC 641 for booming interview dialog. The CS-3e stays on top of my FS5 as my on camera shotgun. I prefer the mono, targeted sound it picks up for my work.

edit: and I also love the COS-11d lavs. I've got three of them -- two XLR for interviews and one for a Tascam DR10-L. I've got two more in my wish list for whenever I go the Sony dual wireless route paired with the FX9.
 
I also usually boom interviews with a Schoeps 641 or 541 (same MK41 mic capsule, different preamps). But I've recorded interviews with a CS-3e when way out in the wilds... it works just fine and rejects a lot more reverb than say a 416. But the CS-3e doesn't have as wide a coverage area as the Schoeps and that can be an issue with overly fidgety interviewees. Mostly I use the CS-3e when booming in noisy environments; it's fantastic for that.

The short Sanken CS-M1 is on my maybe-buy list.
https://www.sankenmicrophones.com/production/shotgun/cs-m1/

CSM1.jpg
 
CS-3e’s are great microphones. I own two. But for “booms” mostly for interviews(also a Shoeps). On my F55 is use the CS-M1. It’s almost comically small. I posted this on another thread with it on camera and also next to a 3e for size comparison. No way I’d run the 3e on-camera.

Run&Gun said:
I have mine mounted in a Sony mic holder. It actually only goes back about half-way into the mount, the rest of it is the XLR barrel.

Also pictured with a CS-3e for size reference.

View attachment 137217
View attachment 137218
View attachment 137219
Click to expand...
 
Thanks Guys,

You have renewed my interest in the Saken CS-M1 for my small on camera mic. I will try it side by side with the Sony ECM-MS2 and see how it goes. Be surprised if the Saken does not win in that test. Will perform test in the field (were it will be used 98% of the time) and my very dry recording studios for the full range. Might all be a bit overkill for the test but have the time this month.
 
JPNola said:
I use this Audio Technica mic on my Fs7:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/495302-REG/Audio_Technica_AT875R_AT875_Short_Condenser_Shotgun.html


I'm not a Sound Recordist or particularly scrupulous about sound, but it came highly recommended and does what I need.

One down-side of that Sony you mention is the double-xlr presents a minor problem when you want to plug a wireless into one of the two channels because you then have the unused xlr of that Sony mic dangling with no home and needing to be secured. Same as when your Sound Op plugs in his snake and your onboard shotgun's single XLR needs to find a home. My solution is a Bongo tie around the rear of the camera's top handle, the Bongo used to secure the end of the XLR not being used at the time. Another little niggle with that Sony is that the cables are made "into" the rear of the mic and do not disconnect. Which means if one of those two cables goes bad you will be without the mic while having that repaired. With the Audio Technica I linked, the cable is not permanently attached. If it goes bad you simply swap it out with another short xlr cable. Or, if you want to detach the cable altogether while you are going off your Sound Op's two-channel snake, you can. That said, the likelihood of the cables going bad is pretty slim. Chances are you could run with that mic on your camera for years and abuse both the mic and the cables and it would hold up to that.

That Audio Technica is around $100 less than the Sony. Granted, it isn't a stereo mic like the Sony. But whatever you decide the length of both the Sony ECM-MS2 and the AT875R is where you want to be. For a time I had a Rode shotgun on my camera that is longer in length than those two mics and it was an issue when using super-wide lenses. The Rode intruded into the frame and had to be backed off anytime I went super-wide.
Click to expand...

IMHO, camera ops shouldn't mess around with stereo microphone setups. Also, Sony doesn't generally make good microphones either, as
far as the value equation. This goes way back to the Betacam days.

Almost guaranteed you will run into various M/S and phase cancellation issues that will be detrimental to how you are using the camera.
Leave the stereo to the sound mixers. Not saying you can't use it, saying, as a camera op, it will be a PITA and could make life
more difficult for you or your clients in post/sound mix. Live stereo recording in sound for picture into camera is rarely used and for good reason.
Our jobs as camera ops and DPs isn't to get into the finer points of stereo sound recording, and there are many.

FWIW, I have been using the AT-875r since it was introduced and it's generally regarded as the ideal ob-board camera mic and not bad
at the end of a boom pole either.

Your money, do what you will. I just suggest you don't.
 
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