Mic suggestions
- Thread starter BackwoodsTerrorMovie
- Start date
mike the beginner
Well-known member
Thanks for that Jeremy and Oleg.
Jeremy i would be using the shotgun on a boom so it is away from the camera noise etc.
Obviously on wide shots i cant get in close enough than i would like but during the close up i will be able to get close in with the shotgun.
Fully appreciate what your saying with the looser pattern. Just thinking.... it may be more difficult to get exact on with a boomed mic in a rolling wave.
Did not like the rode mic sound. Can you recommend a looser pattern shotgun that is warm and rich sounding. That is what moved me to the 416 or the CS 3e they sound so natural and warm.
Oleg what do you think of the G2 as a wireless set up bearing in mind i will be using in the countryside rather than built up area? I must keep quality up high since its me that will bring quality right down (in all probability)
I shall look at the sanken lavs. What will get me nice warm sounding lav?
Thank you for trying to help it is really appreciated :dankk2: Michael
Jeremy i would be using the shotgun on a boom so it is away from the camera noise etc.
Obviously on wide shots i cant get in close enough than i would like but during the close up i will be able to get close in with the shotgun.
Fully appreciate what your saying with the looser pattern. Just thinking.... it may be more difficult to get exact on with a boomed mic in a rolling wave.
Did not like the rode mic sound. Can you recommend a looser pattern shotgun that is warm and rich sounding. That is what moved me to the 416 or the CS 3e they sound so natural and warm.
Oleg what do you think of the G2 as a wireless set up bearing in mind i will be using in the countryside rather than built up area? I must keep quality up high since its me that will bring quality right down (in all probability)
I shall look at the sanken lavs. What will get me nice warm sounding lav?
Thank you for trying to help it is really appreciated :dankk2: Michael
Jeremy Ordan
Major Contributor
It's funny you say that you don't like the Rode but like the Sennheiser sound. I think that the Rode does a pretty nice imitation of the Sennheiser characteristics.
We're dealing with a weird area here because you need a cheap microphone to get the looser pattern for the project your doing and the nature of the project, but still want a quality sounding mic.
AHA!!!
Got it. OK, this will actually solve a lot of things for you, and I'm almost embarassed I didn't think of it earlier.
THE BEST solution for this situation, to get a mic with great sound characteristics, to work the best for the situation, and to really capitalize on what you're going to be doing:
<drum roll>
AKG Blueline w/ CK93 & CK98 caps.
This is a modular microphone system (that I used to own). The caps are the hyper cap (for indoors when you are doing ADR or when you just want to record voiceover) and the shotgun cap. The shotgun cap has a similar sound signature to the AT4073a with a slightly looser pattern, similar rear rejection, similar off axis rejection, and great pick up range. This is a great microphone system for professional uses, it is very versitile, will work in humid conditions, and it's got a solid build quality... above the ME66 but lower than the 416 for comparison sake.
You get a lot for about $750. The hyper is better than the Oktava and the shotgun is just barely below the 4073a. It is a great performer, and I almost really miss this kit (I used to own it). It is by far one of my favorite modular microphone kits available and really does an amazing job. You get a lot for your money also, and I think for what you are thinking about filming this is the best solution....
Now I'm going to go out on a limb and pray that Matt doesn't come in and try to ***** slap me, but you could also look at the omni cap for this system to just get a massive broad recording and have a fully functional modular system...
That is my ultimate suggestion.
Regarding the B6, I completely forgot about being outside when I mentioned that and Oleg is right... Run away from the B6 in that case.
On a positive note, this is how you build a kit though, assess your project, look at what you need and then build to your strengths after assessing the situation through and through.
-Jeremy
We're dealing with a weird area here because you need a cheap microphone to get the looser pattern for the project your doing and the nature of the project, but still want a quality sounding mic.
AHA!!!
Got it. OK, this will actually solve a lot of things for you, and I'm almost embarassed I didn't think of it earlier.
THE BEST solution for this situation, to get a mic with great sound characteristics, to work the best for the situation, and to really capitalize on what you're going to be doing:
<drum roll>
AKG Blueline w/ CK93 & CK98 caps.
This is a modular microphone system (that I used to own). The caps are the hyper cap (for indoors when you are doing ADR or when you just want to record voiceover) and the shotgun cap. The shotgun cap has a similar sound signature to the AT4073a with a slightly looser pattern, similar rear rejection, similar off axis rejection, and great pick up range. This is a great microphone system for professional uses, it is very versitile, will work in humid conditions, and it's got a solid build quality... above the ME66 but lower than the 416 for comparison sake.
You get a lot for about $750. The hyper is better than the Oktava and the shotgun is just barely below the 4073a. It is a great performer, and I almost really miss this kit (I used to own it). It is by far one of my favorite modular microphone kits available and really does an amazing job. You get a lot for your money also, and I think for what you are thinking about filming this is the best solution....
Now I'm going to go out on a limb and pray that Matt doesn't come in and try to ***** slap me, but you could also look at the omni cap for this system to just get a massive broad recording and have a fully functional modular system...
That is my ultimate suggestion.
Regarding the B6, I completely forgot about being outside when I mentioned that and Oleg is right... Run away from the B6 in that case.
On a positive note, this is how you build a kit though, assess your project, look at what you need and then build to your strengths after assessing the situation through and through.
-Jeremy
on the fishing boat with crushing waves -10 feet from the subject there will no different what transmitter you use, better to get one that you can cut the lows not overload the capsule with strong wind .
the lavaliers sounds different on different people , the sanken is good sounding mic. its usially fits most of the voices .
check the countryman emw picked version if you going to berry the mic under heavy clothes .
what good mic to use really doesnt matter as long it can handle the wind and the humidity , dont place the mic to high if you dont have extreme wind conditions ( dont know exactly what the people going to wear) but leave it in the middle of the chest to get more open sound .
the lavaliers sounds different on different people , the sanken is good sounding mic. its usially fits most of the voices .
check the countryman emw picked version if you going to berry the mic under heavy clothes .
what good mic to use really doesnt matter as long it can handle the wind and the humidity , dont place the mic to high if you dont have extreme wind conditions ( dont know exactly what the people going to wear) but leave it in the middle of the chest to get more open sound .
First, I really appreciate all the help and expertise here. If I could put a dollar value on it, it would probably exceed all the Sankens and Schoeps at B&H.
Also, Jeremy raises an issue that I've thought about before. "Assess your project..." I ask myself how relevant that is.
The problem is, a lot of us would be very lucky to have one current project big enough to justify a $1K purchase. Instead, we need to anticipate many unknown projects ahead. That's why the emphasis on versatility...
Hypothetical example: current project will be shot with no humidity problems. The perfect mic for this project happens to be sensitive to humidity.
Next project will be in tropical jungle and pay twice as much.
If I knew about the 2nd project (and who can see the future?) I'd take a mic that's only 80% as good for the current project but resists humidity.
Does this make any sense? I think I'm getting mic fever.
Also, Jeremy raises an issue that I've thought about before. "Assess your project..." I ask myself how relevant that is.
The problem is, a lot of us would be very lucky to have one current project big enough to justify a $1K purchase. Instead, we need to anticipate many unknown projects ahead. That's why the emphasis on versatility...
Hypothetical example: current project will be shot with no humidity problems. The perfect mic for this project happens to be sensitive to humidity.
Next project will be in tropical jungle and pay twice as much.
If I knew about the 2nd project (and who can see the future?) I'd take a mic that's only 80% as good for the current project but resists humidity.
Does this make any sense? I think I'm getting mic fever.
Jeremy Ordan
Major Contributor
powerdog said:
This is going to sound arrogant, and I don't mean for it to be, but I don't know how else to say it.
Basic rule, whether you have one microphone or seventy-five... You will assess your project and see what is the best tool for the job.
When you are starting out with putting a kit together most people have a certain dollar amount that they are working with. For most people this dollar figure it very small. In that situation they normally start with a cheaper shotgun and a cheaper hyper cariod so that they can record audio inside and outside.
As you get to the point where I am at, you have a couple of shotguns, some wirelss and then a couple of hyper cardiod options. I can look at a situation and see which tool to use.
When you get to the point that Phil is at, you have several shotguns, several hypers, several wireless, several mixers, and several recording options.
When you get to the point Oleg is at, you have multiple shotguns, multiple hypers, multiple wireless, and well... you get the picture, the guy has a lot of gear.
Ultimately though you need to look at what your situation calls for and then open your bag and see which tool best meets the requirements of the job. When you are building your kit, you are assessing the most broad elements: inside or outside. As you continue you look at number of people, range, mounting method, enviornment conditions, ect.
You need to begin by assessing though.
-Jeremy
mike the beginner
Well-known member
QUOTE: On a positive note, this is how you build a kit though, assess your project, look at what you need and then build to your strengths after assessing the situation through and through.
-Jeremy__________________
Thanks for that Jermy.
Funny how you try to hang onto something when it is apparent that it is not the best mic for that particular situation. I shall listen again to the rode i just thought it sounded like...well a microphone compared to the 416
I did not like the sound of the 4073a either when i heard it in the shotgun shootout sticky. I hear reverbs coming from it that i did not hear with the 416 maybe its just my ears. Or more than likely it sounds much bettr outside.
I reckon if i am going to spend an enormous time learning all that i need to learn. spending all i have on a red camera, sacrificing probably two years of my life in a video project i at least want it to have the "potential" for it to sound really rich warm and friendly. If i make a mess thats fine at least i tried damn hard, but if i have something that sounds cheap to start with because i have selected not quite so good tools then i will be tormented forever.
Maybe i should try and find someone that will let me try out a particular mic to see how it goes BEFORE committing myself to any particular mic. Also i heard Matt mention the fact that what if your only main mic dies on you..... in my case i would have to wait till it got repaired...how quick do they repair these things and how expensive are the repairs generally (loose question i know).
Right i will get a boom pole and torch (Jay Rose suggestion) attach it to the pole and go and try it ............slight change here .....at night with the two boats. If i can keep the torch light within six inches of the anglers mouth then i will re evaluate the situation with the sanken. Now how do i persuade the others involved to go out with me.
Michael
-Jeremy__________________
Thanks for that Jermy.
Funny how you try to hang onto something when it is apparent that it is not the best mic for that particular situation. I shall listen again to the rode i just thought it sounded like...well a microphone compared to the 416
I did not like the sound of the 4073a either when i heard it in the shotgun shootout sticky. I hear reverbs coming from it that i did not hear with the 416 maybe its just my ears. Or more than likely it sounds much bettr outside.
I reckon if i am going to spend an enormous time learning all that i need to learn. spending all i have on a red camera, sacrificing probably two years of my life in a video project i at least want it to have the "potential" for it to sound really rich warm and friendly. If i make a mess thats fine at least i tried damn hard, but if i have something that sounds cheap to start with because i have selected not quite so good tools then i will be tormented forever.
Maybe i should try and find someone that will let me try out a particular mic to see how it goes BEFORE committing myself to any particular mic. Also i heard Matt mention the fact that what if your only main mic dies on you..... in my case i would have to wait till it got repaired...how quick do they repair these things and how expensive are the repairs generally (loose question i know).
Right i will get a boom pole and torch (Jay Rose suggestion) attach it to the pole and go and try it ............slight change here .....at night with the two boats. If i can keep the torch light within six inches of the anglers mouth then i will re evaluate the situation with the sanken. Now how do i persuade the others involved to go out with me.
Michael
Jeremy Ordan
Major Contributor
Don't judge a shotgun on how it sounds with interior tests. Test it outside because the reverb of a room will affect the shotgun. I never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never never use a shotgun indoors...
That test is not going to be accurate.
-Jeremy
Edit:
That all being said, the Blueline is really ideal for you.
-Jeremy (again)
That test is not going to be accurate.
-Jeremy
Edit:
That all being said, the Blueline is really ideal for you.
-Jeremy (again)
mike the beginner
Well-known member
QUOTE: This is going to sound arrogant, and I don't mean for it to be, but I don't know how else to say it.
Basic rule, whether you have one microphone or seventy-five... You will assess your project and see what is the best tool for the job.
Jeremy
Now we are getting to the nitty griity substance. If you restrict yourself you have to comprimise, right. And if you comprimise you might get away with it depending on your skill and experience at doing what is necessary to make the comprimise work for you. If like me, you are a beginner then every comprimise becomes a major challange and getting the best of any equipment that you dont have a sound knowledge of (pardon the pun) is going to be extremely difficult. Sound guys doing it for a living have to make it pay and have to make things hassle free as often as possible.
No wonder Oleg gives such sound advice (get a sound man to do it for you).
If.......BIg if indeed, i manage to turn out a sucessful video then i know the next two projects are pretty similar so no need to change equipment. Well i need something to be positive about smile.
Thanks once again Jeremy a massive big thank you to all. shall continue to evaluate
PS: Will have a good look at your suggestion certainly makes solid good sense in so many ways jeremy can't thank you enough. Books help in many ways but great advice helps in more practical ways.
Michael
Basic rule, whether you have one microphone or seventy-five... You will assess your project and see what is the best tool for the job.
Jeremy
Now we are getting to the nitty griity substance. If you restrict yourself you have to comprimise, right. And if you comprimise you might get away with it depending on your skill and experience at doing what is necessary to make the comprimise work for you. If like me, you are a beginner then every comprimise becomes a major challange and getting the best of any equipment that you dont have a sound knowledge of (pardon the pun) is going to be extremely difficult. Sound guys doing it for a living have to make it pay and have to make things hassle free as often as possible.
No wonder Oleg gives such sound advice (get a sound man to do it for you).
If.......BIg if indeed, i manage to turn out a sucessful video then i know the next two projects are pretty similar so no need to change equipment. Well i need something to be positive about smile.
Thanks once again Jeremy a massive big thank you to all. shall continue to evaluate
PS: Will have a good look at your suggestion certainly makes solid good sense in so many ways jeremy can't thank you enough. Books help in many ways but great advice helps in more practical ways.
Michael
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