Little venting and frustration

All you can record on SD card is heavy-compressed and long gop stuff,
i participate to GH13/GH2VK adventure and i know very well the capability of SD card.
even if the technologie of solid state & sd card will be better
P2 card is a standard easy to use, easy to share, ( like SD )
and it'll probably going well in the near future so i don't think HPX250 is the last P2 based camcorder.
We may expect a AF100 with P2 and 10 bit intra-frame compression.
 
inefab said:
P2 is SD card ! 4 SD in one P2 card...
AVCHD is pretty limited for "professional" use, i mean small flexibility in color correction, difficult to track fast-moving object.
and about AF-100; even throught a recorder you got 8 bit stream, so color banding can also appear ; that's a big inconvenient of AVC HD codec too.
maybe P2 card must be more affordable, mainly since the technologie of high-speed SD-card is.
But P2 card is a broadcast standard and broadcast industry is able to pay the high-price ... supply and demand... it's a pitty for low budget project.
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And what camera do you use?
 
In the broadcast world I use a P2 camera every day and its great. The AF-100 is a awesome camera, even the codec is far better than anything in its class. Its a camera that cost under $5K! I for one am happy it doesn't have P2 and AVCIntra. Then it would cost a whole lot more and I might not have bought it. Hello. Panasonic has a huge investment in broadcast cameras right?
Every time I show footage I shot with the AF-100 converted to ProRes it gets that wow factor. I cant say that about any 1/3 chip cams or even most 2/3 chip cameras with higher end codecs. Producers don't see codecs. Clients don't see codecs. They see a really nice filmic, very clean cinematic image from the AF-100, and I have pushed the codec around in post and I cant really complain. Its pretty darn good.
We have lots of options, buy the camera that works for you. I'm sure Sony or Red would take your money.
 
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Erik Naso said:
The AF-100 is a awesome camera, even the codec is far better than anything in its class.
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Agreed

Erik Naso said:
I for one am happy it doesn't have P2 and AVCIntra. Then it would cost a whole lot more and I might not have bought it. Hello.
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This is why I think 2 models would have been a great idea. Some people like you would be fine with the AF100. Some of us wanted more, but didn't have a choice.

Erik Naso said:
Every time I show footage I shot with the AF-100 converted to ProRes it gets that wow factor. I cant say that about any 1/3 chip cams or even most 2/3 chip cameras with higher end codecs.
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The "wow factor" you are getting from the broadcast people has more to do with the m43 sensor size (low light capabilities, easily achieved shallow DoF). Broadcast people are used to 1/3, 1/2, and 2/3 inch chips.

Erik Naso said:
Producers don't see codecs. Clients don't see codecs. They see a really nice filmic, very clean cinematic image from the AF-100, and I have pushed the codec around in post and I cant really complain. Its pretty darn good.
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That mentality, for instance, is what gets some home builders in trouble. The new home owners only sees a new house until there is structural issues, mold issues, etc. The fact that the AF100 is a camera that records onto SD cards and not P2 can mean there is potential for problems. Don't get me wrong, it's a gamble I take every day with my AF100, but it'd be nice to not worry about it.

Erik Naso said:
We have lots of options, buy the camera that works for you. I'm sure Sony or Red would take your money.
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Yes we do have lots of options. I had a RED MX, but sold it because it was too much for most of my clients. And I want to stay with Panasonic if I can, they've done me well over the years. Lately it's hard to sell clients on a camera that has very little, if any, advantages over the F3. The AF100 had a short life span because, in my opinion, it was lacking P2. The "F3" has become the latest buzz word in town spreading thru the industry. An AF200 that recorded onto P2, even with lesser hardware, would be able to compete. I still get all the jobs, I just sometimes make less since I have to rent an F3. Panasonic as always helped put money in my pocket, it's just becoming less and less everyday, and it's a bummer.
 
Sometimes client asks for a 5D but that doesn't make much difference on what I charge for equipment after putting all the stuff onto it. But I feel alot safer shooting with the AF. Will be adding Samurai as soon as it arrives and that'll be even safer.
 
mcgeedigital said:
My clients do not tell me what camera to use. I do.
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+1 I've never had a client tell me what to shoot on - they just trust I'll provide them with great content. The AF101 with the right lenses and set up, is as good as anything out there at the moment.
 
Maybe this will help your SD card concerns.

Jan Crittenden Livingston comment on another thread.

"First, Sandisk does not make any Panasonic Card, I don't care what they say, it is just not true.

Second, the Silver UHS-1 card is the Professional offering of the UHS-1 line of Products. There is software that you will be able to use for an extended Recovery Application and a Card Checker software as well, download site is in the package and neither of these work with the Gold cards or the cards from SanDisk. It has a one year warranty unlike the Gold one. These are the cards to buy for the most robust and reliable card."

And here is the link on the Panasonic site: http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp...GroupId=182542

Best,

jan
 
Brian@202020 said:
I've always bought Panasonic cameras, I thought they were way a head of the curve in their codecs, but always lacked a little in the sensors and hardware. For years my complaint with the Sony's were the codecs, but their hardware was top notch. My thoughts, like everyone else's here in MN, was the hardware doesn't matter if the codec can't take advantage of it so buy Panasonic. With the advent of affordable external recorders, codecs have become less important. Don't get me wrong doing everything in camera is a benefit, just not as huge in my opinion as it once was. I live in Minneapolis and this was a Panasonic town. Since the DVX100, nearly everyone owned a Panasonic. The rental houses here were easily 80-90% Panasonic. The 5D changed that with an affordable large sensor solution. Now everyone is requesting large sensor cameras. I believe, as much as I like the AF100, the AF100 was the the turning point for Panasonic. Although I think the m43 sensor size was the perfect choice, Panasonic should have, in my opinion, use that little codec benefit they still had and made the AF100 with the AVC-Intra codec to stay ahead. Or at least had 2 models released at the same time, the AF100 and the AF200, much like the AC160 and HPX250 are. The HPX250 would have been awesome last year. It'll be a great camera no doubt, but I think in the grand scheme of things it'll fall a little flat. They know codec's so why get rid of that in the AF100. I think so many people were put off by the AF100 and it's lack of P2 support that it damaged the companies reputation permanently, at least in this town. People here were trying to sell extra P2 cards. Everyone thought P2 was over and wanted to get as much as they could for their extra cards while they could. I bet Panasonic cameras have fallen to 30% in the Minneapolis rental houses. 90% to 30% in this town in the last 2 years is one hell of a swing. I'm still loyal and own an AF100, which I like a lot, as well as an HPX170, and a GH2, but for the first time I'm feeling the temptation to move to a different camera company. I truly hope Panasonic does well with the HPX250 and come out with a large sensor AVC-Intra camera soon. The m43 sensor, when stopped down, can have a similar look to a 1/3 inch sensor, and with fast lenses can get amazing shallow DoF. It's the best of both worlds. Maybe Panasonic needs to make a m43 camera the shoots both AVCCAM and AVC-Intra both to P2. I'd buy it for sure as long as it comes out in the next 6-8 months. OK enough venting, thanks for listening.
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I

I totally agree with everything that is said above, but I know from personal experience that posting it here is akin to questioning the Gospels at a Catholic mass... just too many fundametalist Panasonic fan-boys on this forum...

I am one of those people who spent $7000 on P2 cards with the assurance that they were future proof beyond my HPX500.. Now the 500, lens and cards are barely worth that. Someone said the AF100 is a "tool" - very original... Well, anyone who's tried to take apart a car's suspension with bargain basement sockets knows why the pros use Snap-On. personally I didn't ask for the $5000 price point.
 
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Sparky874 said:
+1 I've never had a client tell me what to shoot on - they just trust I'll provide them with great content. The AF101 with the right lenses and set up, is as good as anything out there at the moment.
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I never did either until RED was a buzz word that somehow caught on with clients a few years back. Then every other client was RED this, RED that, we need to use a RED, bla bla bla. Now it seems the buzz words are Alexa this, F3 that. Maybe it's just Minneapolis, but that's how it is here.
 
This thread is rediculous. Plain and simple, if you don't like the features the camera has to offer, don't use it. Many of us who are on a budget love the AF-100 because it has so many professional features at a great price. Sure many of you didn't ask for a $5000 camera that doesn't have p2, but many more of us did ask for it.People are so spoiled these days -_-
 
I'm still peed because Panny left me stranded when I was a Ml and Mll user.#$$%&(()
#$$%%^^&&&&
@#$$%^&&**(




Just kidding folks

My stable
DVX100
HVX200
HPX170
HPX2000 w/AVC-Intra
AF100 w/ SD lens from the Mll camera

"Let it go Louie"
Mule
 
canons announcing something new so theres a stop gap.
panasonic would probably announce something at NAB next year. maybe what were all been waiting for. I just hope they release it in time :)
 
ryansworld10 said:
This thread is rediculous. Plain and simple, if you don't like the features the camera has to offer, don't use it. Many of us who are on a budget love the AF-100 because it has so many professional features at a great price. Sure many of you didn't ask for a $5000 camera that doesn't have p2, but many more of us did ask for it.People are so spoiled these days -_-
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+1
 
P2 option should be available for the AF100. You know, the EX cams allows you to use either SD or SxS cards. Why can't Panny offer an option as well?
 
chromeboy007 said:
P2 option should be available for the AF100. You know, the EX cams allows you to use either SD or SxS cards. Why can't Panny offer an option as well?
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as was mentioned numerous times, both in the development and roll out of the product, it was to meet a certain price point.

If you want an AF-200, and who doesn't, wait until NAB 2012.
 
mcgeedigital said:
as was mentioned numerous times, both in the development and roll out of the product, it was to meet a certain price point.

If you want an AF-200, and who doesn't, wait until NAB 2012.
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I sure hope so :)

To counter my own argument, the Sony FS100 only uses SD cards...
 
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