Litepanels ASTRA 1x1 SOFT Bi-Color LED Panel

[Eric Coughlin]

What are your thoughts on the new soft version of the Litepanel Astra?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1219777-REG/litepanels_935_5001_astra_1x1_soft_bi_color.html


I have two of the original Astras and was thinking to buy a couple Area 48 LEDs to go with them so I'd have some softer LED panels, but these new Soft Astras look like it might be the ticket, plus you get internal bi-color which the Area 48 doesn't have. The Area 48 has a wide beam angle and a 160w power draw compared to the Astra's 110w, so the Area 48 should be putting out more light overall, but they're still a lot more expensive (particularly with the expensive accessories).

I wonder how soft these are. From what I was reading, the lens on the Soft Astra is what makes it softer than, say, simply putting a piece of diffusion directly on the original Astra. Putting diffusion further from the source could get the same results, but then requires more grip, size, and effort. I really like the idea of having a soft panel light that doesn't necessarily need additional diffusion all the time. Having two original Astras and two Soft Astras I feel would give a lot of versatility.

 

[Run&Gun]

I saw these last week on Newsshooter. If speed and simplicity are your utmost concerns, then they're probably worth it. I have two original bi-color, full power versions with Chimera's for each. Nice soft light the majority of the time I use them, but I can still get 'punch' if and when I need it by running the bare panels. The Chimera's are a little finicky, but only because of the horrible rounded design by LitePanel. I keep thinking about adding two more and I'd buy the bi-color full power panels and a set of Chimera's again over the soft versions because It's a more versatile set-up.

 

[Eric Coughlin]

The Chimeras do little to increase the size of the source, so I question how much they actually soften the light as opposed to merely dimming it which can create the illusion of softening. They're also, as you said, a bit finicky. I use medium size umbrellas to soften mine, with the Manfrotto Swivel Umbrella Adapter (Lite-Tite), which sets up pretty quick. Like this.

I've also used 5-in-1 reflector kit diffusion pieces to diffuse the Astras which takes more time to setup and isn't as portable for on the move b-roll.

From what I gather, the Soft Astra should be softer than the regular Astra with a Chimera on it, due to the lens design and the closeness of the lens to the source. Or something like that. I'm not sure.

I'd have a hard time imagining a scenario where I'd want four regular Astras bare; chances are a Fresnel would be better for those situations. I suppose if I was filming an event where the lights couldn't be placed close and I didn't have enough Fresnels on hand would be one scenario. I haven't used the Astras bare yet, and since I already have two regular ones, it seems that adding two of the soft ones would give me more versatility (in terms of speed of setup) than getting two more regular Astras.

 

[traviswears]

I'm curious about the Astra Softs as well but from the spec sheet, these are the exact same lights as the original bi-color Astras w/out the LED lens and w/a very thick diffusion.

The spec charts show a significant difference in fc @ 5ft. The original Astra has 425 fc @ 5' in the daylight mode, while the Astra Soft has 89fc @ 5' which is a bit less than a Kino Diva w/out the Flozier. The nice thing about the originals is you can add the DOP Snapbag, which will increase brightness even more, and also soften the light for you, while using the barn doors to shape it. W/the Soft it wouldn't do much pushing into a ceiling or superbounce for a fill light.

I haven't used either yet and am considering adding one or two to my arsenal. Also considering the Cineo Maverick, Area 48 and Litemat, though I ultimately prefer having the battery and cables all mounted onto the light, rather than strewn everywhere. I have some of the Westcott Flex lights, and while they're very color accurate, the cable system is a pain.

 

[alohype]

.

Eric, I've got a little off topic question. That big wide white background is a cardboard or plastered wall?

 

[Eric Coughlin]

I bought one Lite Panel Astra Soft which arrives today and I'll be using it on a five day shoot this week. I did notice the drop in lux ratings, which puts it closer to the lux values of the Area 48 and the Cineo Maverick; however, the Area 48 and Cineo Maverick have a 160 degree beam angle compared to the 46 degree beam angle of the Astra Soft, which means the former two are putting out a lot more light overall. Now that should only be an issue if you need to light up a wide area. The Astra Soft still has the advantage of being the only bi-color Soft LED panel currently out there (that I know of).

Of course with the regular Astra if the beam angle is too tight, you can simply diffuse it which can widen your beam angle (depending on how you diffuse it), but with the Soft, since it's already diffused, you may lose too much light by diffusing it more. It's got its niche. I can see an Area 48 or Cineo Maverick pairing with it for when you don't need bi-color but want a wider beam angle.

I'm curious about the Astra Softs as well but from the spec sheet, these are the exact same lights as the original bi-color Astras w/out the LED lens and w/a very thick diffusion.

I'd think you'd lose light from the LED lens. So in essence, without the lens, it would be similar to putting an open face light through diffusion rather than putting a Fresnel through diffusion, with the former being a more efficient way to diffuse.



@alohype: White cyc. Pretty sure it's all wood, painted white.

 

[traviswears]

Eric, curious to hear your thoughts after comparing the Soft w/the original bi-color Astra. Especially as it pertains to how punchy the light is and whether or not it needs, or can benefit from additional diffusion.

I thought the Area 48 was quite a bit brighter than the Astra or Maverick. I don't think I have those specs written down.

 

[Eric Coughlin]

The Area 48 puts out more light than the Astra, but is significantly less bright in where it puts the light since it has a much wider beam angle.

Here are the values:

Litepanel Astra (110 watt power draw) @ 3m (10 ft), 5600k, 46 degree beam angle: 1144 lux
Litepanel Astra Soft (110 watt power draw) @ 3m (10 ft), 5600k, 46 degree beam angle: 295 lux
Area 48 (122-150 (I see different numbers online) watt power draw) @ 3m (10 ft), 5600k, 160 degree beam angle: 386 lux
Area 48 (122-150 (I see different numbers online) watt power draw) @ 3m (10 ft), 5600k, 90 degree beam angle (with optional Soft Box): 737 lux
Cineo Maverick (120 watt power draw) @ 3m (10 ft), 5600k, 160 degree beam angle: 248 lux

I put the power draw down because that's often a good indication of how bright a light is.

Now if you consider the Astra is 1144 lux at a 46 degree beam angle, then at a 90 degree beam angle it would be about half of that (in terms of how much light it's putting out), which would put it at 572 lux, which is less than the Area 48 which is 737 lux at a 90 degree beam angle.

So the Soft Astra at 295 lux is close in brightness to the Area 48 in where it is shining light, but since the beam angle is three times at tight, that means it's actually putting out about a third of the light as the Area 48, which I'd guess to mean that the diffusion panel on the Astra Soft is cutting down the light more than the diffusion of the Area 48.


I've only briefly taken out the lights and put them next to each other. I did find the beam angle in practice on the Astra Soft seems to be wider than the regular Astra, I guess because the diffusion spreads it out more. It is nice to be able to look directly at the Astra Soft at full power without feeling blinded, though I didn't test them at similar levels of brightness to see if the diffusion/softness was the main thing helping with that, or it was just how bright it was. Of course the Soft is considerably less bright, as expected. The multi-bulb shadow seems to be mostly or completely gone compared to using the regular Astra bare. I'll plan to write back later when I have more time with them.

 

[traviswears]

Great reply Eric, thanks.

Have you used the DOP Choice Snapbag w/the original Astra?

 

[Eric Coughlin]

Yeah, I used both the DOP Choice and the Chimera Soft-box on the original Astra on a shoot. I preferred the Chimera because it's less finicky to put on and more secure in terms of staying mounted.

Here is a shot that was lit with the Astra/Chimera as a key, along with ambient lights. For that shoot, the Astra Soft would have worked better I think because then we wouldn't have needed to deal with a soft-box (or if we did use one, in theory it would have made it even softer) while running and gunning (and going in golf carts) with a small crew who already had a good amount of equipment to carry. To not overpower the ambient lighting, the Astra was typically only at 5-20% power, so lack of brightness wouldn't be an issue.

Note how we're at 4000k, but for other locations we walked to (without going back to home base), we were at different Kelvins, such that having to bring with us the phosphor panels of the non-bi-color phosphor lights would not have worked well for that type of shoot.

 

[morgan_moore]

I think there is a little confusion here.

The softness of a source its physical size.. a 1.1 will never have the soft wrap of of a light bounced into/through a 36 brolly or a 8.4 scrim.

The 1.1 panel with a diffuser will have less multi shadows issues than a regular 1.1 but it will not be a softer source.

Id personally go for power in the fixture and either chuck on some frost or use a physically much larger diffusion away from the fixture?

 

[Eric Coughlin]

I think there is a little confusion here.

The softness of a source its physical size.. a 1.1 will never have the soft wrap of of a light bounced into/through a 36 brolly or a 8.4 scrim.

The 1.1 panel with a diffuser will have less multi shadows issues than a regular 1.1 but it will not be a softer source.

From the B&H description of the Litepanel Astra Soft...

"The diffusion is designed to all but eliminate the multi-source shadow effect and lend a soft wrap-around aesthetic to your subject while covering a larger, less concentrated area of illumination."

So is what they're saying regarding it lending a soft wrap-around aesthetic incorrect, or am I misunderstanding that when I think that to mean it creates a softer light?

And again at 2:00...

"You can see how much more diffused that light is, and it looks like one light source. It looks like a much broader light source. Look at the way the light wraps around her face. It's the same size, but the quality of light is significantly different, and it's actually light you can use bare." - Vincent La Foret

Is he wrong too? Are these products being mis-marketed? Am I misunderstanding what he's saying? Or is the size of the source not the only thing that affects softness?

 

[morgan_moore]

Yep I think the B+H wording is misleading.. and Vincent is talking utter BS.

You can only wrap with a large (or close) source. It is physics - light does not bend.

About killing the multi shadow effect that is true.. but a $1 bit of frost does that too (if a bit scruffy)

A wrap is caused by large penumbra which is physically caused by a large source penumbra shadow

 

[traviswears]

Eric,

How's the color rendition on those Astras? The early reviews said they needed 1/4 minus green to really shine but I haven't seen a lot on that since. There's a $250 discount at BH right now. Debating pulling the trigger or waiting to see what NAB will bring.

 

[Eric Coughlin]

I think the colors are great.

Setup:

Graded Result:

Here are a few setups and results from the past couple days of shooting using the Astra Soft as a fill light. The nice thing about this setup is it enables my third off-axis camera to get a shot since I don't need a large diffusion piece for the fill which can easily block my off-axis shot.

Whether or not the Astra Soft is softer or harder at the same light intensity as the regular Astra, one thing is for sure, and that is that you can use it bare because at the same light intensity it's a lot less harsh on the eyes than the regular Astra due to it being a larger source instead of several small and blinding sources of the regular Astra bare. I'm really liking the light so far.


Setup:

Ungraded Result:

Setup:

Ungraded result:

Setup:

Ungraded Result:

Setup:

Ungraded result:

Setup:

Setup:

Ungraded result:

Astra Soft on the right in tight quarters where a soft-box or other type of bulky diffusion would have made things more difficult.