Line/mic question

scorsesefan

scorsesefan

Veteran
I was told you should use "line" for wireless mics and "mic" for shotgun mics on your recorder. My question is what if you have one of each going into, in my case, a DR-100 MKII?
 
Mic-level input is used for a mic-level source. Line-level input is used for a line-level source. Simply, match your inputs to your outputs.

Microphones are, by name and by nature, mic-level.

Many wireless receivers have adjustable output levels and can switch between mic- and line-level output. Check your manual for your particular system. If you're using a recorder that only allows two inputs that are set in tandem (can only be both line or both mic), set your wireless receiver to mic-level out.

The other option would be to send your shotgun mic through and external preamp, which brings it up to line-level. If your wireless cannot send mic-level out, this is an option.

Also an option: send your wireless receiver's line-level output through an inline pad to knock it down to mic-level. Do this only if you cannot adjust the output level of your receiver.
 
Alex H. said:
Also an option: send your wireless receiver's line-level output through an inline pad to knock it down to mic-level. Do this only if you cannot adjust the output level of your receiver.
Click to expand...

Alex, is there a cable or adapter that I can buy so that I can knock down just the left channel of my wireless mic?
For instance, I want to plug my Sennheiser wireless into my DSLR but want to record one channel lower than the other (just in case the audio peaks).
Id figure this is would be a common feature since most mics are mono while DSLR can record stereo. Seems like a waste to recording a mono source to both left/right.
 
Alex H. said:
Mic-level input is used for a mic-level source. Line-level input is used for a line-level source. Simply, match your inputs to your outputs.

Microphones are, by name and by nature, mic-level.

Many wireless receivers have adjustable output levels and can switch between mic- and line-level output. Check your manual for your particular system. If you're using a recorder that only allows two inputs that are set in tandem (can only be both line or both mic), set your wireless receiver to mic-level out.

The other option would be to send your shotgun mic through and external preamp, which brings it up to line-level. If your wireless cannot send mic-level out, this is an option.

Also an option: send your wireless receiver's line-level output through an inline pad to knock it down to mic-level. Do this only if you cannot adjust the output level of your receiver.
Click to expand...
Thanks, Alex. I looked in the menu of my Sennheiser G2s and I don't see a "mic out" option. If "line" has to do with sensitivity can I just turn the sensitivity of the wireless mic down so it's not as hot?
 
scorsesefan said:
Thanks, Alex. I looked in the menu of my Sennheiser G2s and I don't see a "mic out" option. If "line" has to do with sensitivity can I just turn the sensitivity of the wireless mic down so it's not as hot?
Click to expand...

Reducing the sensitivity, or input gain, of the lav to the transmitter will cause you more problems than it will solve, as that weakened signal still needs to be compensated in the receiver. Get the strongest, cleanest signal you can in the transmitter, as the rules of proper gain staging don't change based on the output level of the rceiver.

In the menu of your receiver, there should be an AF Out setting, adjustable in 2 or 3dB steps. That's your mic/line output adjustment. Drop it below 0dB (neutral, no boost and no cut) and you're outputting mic-level. Crank it all the way up and you have the strongest output, in the neighborhood of line level. However, I have found with the Sennheiser G2/3 systems that there's often considerable noise in trying to crank line-level out of the receiver rather than mic-level, which tells me that the receiver is the source as it amplifies the output signal.

Also, be careful not to feed phantom power to the receiver. It can cause the audio to sound really thin and scratchy.
 
FourLinkSun said:
Alex, is there a cable or adapter that I can buy so that I can knock down just the left channel of my wireless mic?
For instance, I want to plug my Sennheiser wireless into my DSLR but want to record one channel lower than the other (just in case the audio peaks).
Id figure this is would be a common feature since most mics are mono while DSLR can record stereo. Seems like a waste to recording a mono source to both left/right.
Click to expand...

What you're wanting is what's called a safety track. It's a great idea, but difficult to achieve without either a mixer or independent input level controls on the camera.

While your wireless lav system is mono, and the camera has a 2-channel input, the 1/8" adapter cable is wired to send the unbalanced output to both inputs channels on the camera. The "adapter" you're asking about is not something I have ever seen, though someone handy with a soldering iron and well-versed in circuit design could, I'm sure, fashion something of a kludge.

You could try to split the output using a Y-cable, gong into two inputs of an external mixer or recorder with independent input level controls. That's a bit of a clumsy workaround, if you ask me.

Perhaps your best solution would be to add an external recorder, as there are a few out there that offer a dual recording mode that generates a safety track. TASCAM has recorders with this feature. Plus, you get the added benefit of having audio recorded to something better than DSLR in-camera sound, which isn't the best by any stretch, and you get clear headphone monitoring of what's actually being recorded (another downfall of most DSLRs).

The TASCAM DR-60D comes to mind. It has four inputs: 2 XLR, and a 2-channel 1/8". You can set dual recording mode for either pair of inputs (XLR 1 and 2, or 3 and 4 from the 1/8" in). You'd also have the option of using the XLR output cable from your receiver, and the recorder will run a dual mode in mono from any one input channel. Plus, the recorder is designed to mount under a camera, and has an output designed to feed a camera's 1/8" mic in for better reference audio.
 
A point also to remember is that the audio recording capabilities of DSLR's is less that good. So going to a recorder is HIGHLY recommended.

A simple kludgy way to do what you want in a cable is to use two 1/8" to RCA cables and connect one channel with a turnaround and the other through an attenuator.

If you really were going to work this way a lot I would get someone (or you if you can find a tutorial) to build the attenuator into a 1/8" TRS to 1/8" TRS cable. It's just a couple of resistors and some shielding.

BUT I would go for the recorder and get MUCH better sound.
 
Alex H. said:
Reducing the sensitivity, or input gain, of the lav to the transmitter will cause you more problems than it will solve, as that weakened signal still needs to be compensated in the receiver. Get the strongest, cleanest signal you can in the transmitter, as the rules of proper gain staging don't change based on the output level of the rceiver.

In the menu of your receiver, there should be an AF Out setting, adjustable in 2 or 3dB steps. That's your mic/line output adjustment. Drop it below 0dB (neutral, no boost and no cut) and you're outputting mic-level. Crank it all the way up and you have the strongest output, in the neighborhood of line level. However, I have found with the Sennheiser G2/3 systems that there's often considerable noise in trying to crank line-level out of the receiver rather than mic-level, which tells me that the receiver is the source as it amplifies the output signal.

Also, be careful not to feed phantom power to the receiver. It can cause the audio to sound really thin and scratchy.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the advice. Helpful as always.
 
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