Lens question for the black magic pocket 4k.

K

kevin baggott

Well-known member
Thanks for taking a look at this.
I'm not a DP - but a filmmaker who sometimes has to shoot my own stuff while I'm also acting/directing/writing.
I have the BMPC4k with the panny 12-35. Also just picked up the moza air 2.
Ive been noticing vignetting with some of my shots. i read premiere can remove this in post but would rather it not there to begin with.
Also this whole focus by wire is not good with the panny lens. I need a proper cine lens with hard stops.
I've been looking at the Meike 16mm cinema lens.
I have 2 brand new lens when i bought my black magic cinema camera back in the day. I used them for one shoot years back and they've been sitting here since then.
Those are the sigma 17-50 and the tokina 11-16 with a novoflex adapter. I never sold the cinema camera nor the original pocket camera either.
My question - forgive me for taking so long to get here - is should i sell the the 2 lens mentioned above and the original cinema camera and the original pocket? If I kept the tokina is there an adapter I can get for it with my new BMP4K? I assume there is. I realize the question is a little fuzzy. Any thoughts would be most appreciated.
 
You can get a regular adapter or a speedbooster for the 11-16 in either nikon or Canon mount (depending on what you have).

It would make sense to sell whatever you're not using, including the 17-50 if you're not happy with it.

Budget cine primes include the Meike, SLR Magic, and Rokinon/Samyang which you can surely find used for a song

All 3 brands come in micro four thirds, but if you get a speedbooster for your Tokina, you could buy full-frame or APS-C lenses from Rokinon/samyang and benefit from extra light and less DOF (if that's what you want)
 
Actually, probably the most cost effective thing to do would be to use the Tokina with a regular adapter and then buy a Rokinon 24 and 35 in either M43 or the same mount as the Tokina. And you could also buy a 50 if you want something more telephoto
 
Thanks Ahalpert - I might pick up a dumb adapter for the tokina 11-16 and see what it looks like.
it's not that im not happy with the sigma 17-50 - Im just not using it since i bought the BMPC4k. Hmmm - maybe there's an adapter to MFT?
is there one lens you keep on the yer BMPC4k - if that's indeed the camera you use?
Thanks again for yer feedback :)
 
you would need a smart adapter to open and close the aperture on the tokina or the sigma. just an electronic adapter. it doesn't need to be a speedbooster.

the 17-50 with a speedbooster would be the type of lens you can keep on your pocket. I don't own a pocket but I have M43, S35 and FF cameras plus 2 speedboosters and I do a lot of focal length multiplication.

On my gimbal camera, I typically keep a 24-70mm or 24-105mm full-frame lens.

The Panasonic 12-35mm equates to a 24-70mm with the 2x crop factor. But the P4K has a larger sensor and smaller crop factor which must be why you're getting vignetting.

The 17-50 might do the trick for you with a speedbooster. And if you have a simple smart adapter as well, you could use that instead of the speedbooster when you want to zoom in a bit more.

Here's the .71x speedbooster I use with my GH5 for Canon lenses: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...ik_L2YGtA88oaA_Xy_JcsT1NqZytfENhoCoVcQAvD_BwE

I like it. The Metabones might have some advantages but I'd say they're pretty similar and the Metabones is much more expensive.

The Sigma 18-35 Art lens is one that people seem to keep on their Pocket cameras a lot. With the 1.9x crop factor of the P4K multiplied by the .71x crop factor of the speedbooster, it comes out to a 24-47mm lens in full-frame equivalent. And it's a very pretty lens with a fast aperture. You would have your 11-16mm when you need to go wider. 35mm with a simple adapter at a 1.9x crop factor equates to 66mm full-frame. So you may still need something more telephoto, depending on what you're shooting. But you might be OK.

But then again, the Sigma 17-50 with the option of a speedbooster and a simple smart adapter could be literally all you need.
 
If you decide to go for a Metabones Speed Booster, make sure you get the Pocket version and not the other version for Panasonics/etc.
 
merci nobro - yes i saw they had one just for the pocket.

Hey Norbro - since yer here - do you own the BMP4k? If so do you have a fav lens for it?
 
I just sold it yesterday! But Voigtlanders are my favorite MFT lenses.

Just a really lovely look and great performance starting around ~f/1.4.

With that said, if you're planning on using a follow-focus system you'd be better served with a lens with built-in gears (even though you can get a special gear ring for those lenses).

Since there is no AF with the BM, there is no point in purchasing almost any Panasonic or Olympus lens if you're interested in precise manual focusing for traditional filmmaking.
 
Yeah - i had the voighlander 25 for an older panny camera and I think I sold it for the panny 12-35.
'Since there is no AF with the BM, there is no point in purchasing almost any Panasonic or Olympus lens if you're interested in precise manual focusing for traditional filmmaking.' I hear ya on that. thanks again for yer input.
 
I considered the voigtlander as a shallow-DoF option on the p4k, but it felt a bit too expensive. I bought the Mitakon Zhongyi 25mm f/0.95 instead. And I have to say: it's surprisingly good. Yes, it's soft wide open, but so is the Voigtlander. By f/1.4 it's acceptable, by f/2.8 it's fine.

As a wide angle I'm using the Samyang 12mm f/2.8 which is a very nice lens, but I like it a lot more on APS-C sensors than on m43, where it's not as wide and it is softer (you're using the central part but you're blowing it up quite a bit compared with APS-C).

For portraits any good 50mm f/1.4 will work great.
 
I use a Sigma 17-50mm for stills, but it's really not a good lens for video, as it has a very short focus throw, it's not parfocal, and has a lot of focus breathing as I remember.
 
If you want to splash out on a cinema zoom lens, DZO makes a micro four thirds cinema zoom 20-70mm T2.9 for $1500: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1507682-REG/dzoptics_dzo_6226611a_20_70mm_t2_9_m4_3_lens.html

I've never used it. Good reviews at B&H. 20mm is not wide enough for many circumstances, but that's where your 11-16mm Tokina can come into play. With those 2 lenses, you could frame anything you want except wildlife/birds and that sort of long-range shooting.

If you're not a big wide-angle person, the 20-70 might never leave your camera. But it is more expensive than some of the other options you were looking at, although it would replace about 3 prime lenses
 
ahalpert said:
If you want to splash out on a cinema zoom lens, DZO makes a micro four thirds cinema zoom 20-70mm T2.9 for $1500: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1507682-REG/dzoptics_dzo_6226611a_20_70mm_t2_9_m4_3_lens.html

I've never used it. Good reviews at B&H. 20mm is not wide enough for many circumstances, but that's where your 11-16mm Tokina can come into play. With those 2 lenses, you could frame anything you want except wildlife/birds and that sort of long-range shooting.

If you're not a big wide-angle person, the 20-70 might never leave your camera. But it is more expensive than some of the other options you were looking at, although it would replace about 3 prime lenses
Click to expand...

I really, really wish that they instead (or in addition to) made a 14-50 or something like that with all of these features. The longer reach (70mm) is great, but on m43 sensor, something around 50-ish is fine for portrait shots, and you really do need something significantly wider than 20mm for wide shots. Having to switch to their wide zoom lens is an option, but I'd prefer to compromise a bit at both end but not have to switch lenses for doc work. If you have the time to switch lenses, then I'd just go with faster primes since t2.9 is not ideal to begin with as far as speed goes.

What a great price though. The Fujinon mk series delivers a slightly better focal range for what I'm talking about, but it's expensive. All that said, I'm not an optical designer. Maybe going 14-50mm at T2.9 would mean a lens that is twice the size and 3x the cost. Just dreaming about a single parfocal cine zoom lens for doc work on m43. Doesn't exist as far as I can tell. Add OIS to solid mechanical functions like the Canon 18-80 and it would be a dream lens on m43 systems. Obviously, at that point it would not be a $1500 lens.
 
Hey Ahalpert,
The DZO is a good suggestion. I'm gonna sniff around that lens for a bit now. Don't think I will be able to get it on my moza air 2 though. Will have to research.
I keep going back and forth between keeping my panny 12-35 for shots where I need some throw and don't have to pull focus and picking up the Meike 16mm to keep on my gimbal.
I hear with with the '11-16mm Tokina can come into play.' but I hear folks saying with the viltrox adapter they have to focus the lens on the adapter to play nice with the tokina. It seemed maybe a little too tricky for me. I thought of the olympus 12-40 MFT and the sigma 17-50 with a viltrox adapter. I might just get viltrox adapters for the two lenses I have(the tokina and sigma) and see what they're like.
Damn that DZO zoom lens looks sweet. :)
 
Viltrox may have quality control issues, so make sure you purchase your's from a reputable dealer with a good return policy. Also, don't forget to the calibrate the adapter's optical element for infinity focus.
 
kevin baggott said:
Hey Ahalpert,
The DZO is a good suggestion. I'm gonna sniff around that lens for a bit now. Don't think I will be able to get it on my moza air 2 though. Will have to research.
I keep going back and forth between keeping my panny 12-35 for shots where I need some throw and don't have to pull focus and picking up the Meike 16mm to keep on my gimbal.
I hear with with the '11-16mm Tokina can come into play.' but I hear folks saying with the viltrox adapter they have to focus the lens on the adapter to play nice with the tokina. It seemed maybe a little too tricky for me. I thought of the olympus 12-40 MFT and the sigma 17-50 with a viltrox adapter. I might just get viltrox adapters for the two lenses I have(the tokina and sigma) and see what they're like.
Damn that DZO zoom lens looks sweet. :)
Click to expand...

Well, the DZO is only 6" long. But it weighs almost 2.5lbs, so you might have to slide the camera/lens pretty far back to balance it. The Moza can take the weight but the balance may or may not be tricky. Adding some weight on top of the camera body would probably help balance it on the platform better but then it gets even heavier. Or maybe it will balance with zero issues.

What does "throw" mean in the context of the 12-35? Zoom range? Or telephoto focal length?

I don't know what that means focus the lens on the adapter to play nice with the Tokina. I've used the Tokina on a Viltrox EF-M43 speedbooster and it focuses normally.

Maybe they're referring to calibrating the speedbooster for infinity focus, as Imamacuser mentioned. You do this by checking to see if your lens (or, ideally, 2 lenses - a wide-angle and a telephoto) can make it to infinity focus on the speedbooster. If they can't, you have to grab the edges of the optical element in the speedbooster and rotate it (clockwise, I believe). You give it a complete rotation or two and then look through your lenses again to see if you have infinity focus yet.

You only have to do that process once. I haven't touched my speedbooster's optical element since I calibrated it. All my lenses focus normally on it.

I do get a bit more flare in some heavily backlit situations when using the speedbooster as opposed to no speedbooster. But it's not that bad. Sometimes it looks nice. And I think that the Metabones contributes to flare as well as the Viltrox though I'm not 100% sure. I shot one interview heavily backlit against a window and I decided to pull the speedbooster and use a regular adapter because I needed to diminish flare. But that was a supremely backlit situation and the only time out of scores of shoots where the speedbooster gave me a visible issue.

It looks like the olympus 12-40 can manually focus with hard stops, which is cool. But otherwise it's basically the same as the panny 12-35. It may vignette on you as well. Or it may not, you'd have to test. (the 12-35, 12-40, 17-50, and 20-70 are all basically the same thing. Accounting for crop factor, they equate in full-frame focal lengths to a 24-70, 24-80, 25.5-75, and a 40-140. So, the 20-70 is a bit more telephoto than all the other lenses, but they are all basically midrange zooms.)

And with the viltrox adapters - they make booth a speedbooster adapter and a regular no-optics adapter. Both are useful because if you want more light or less depth of field, you can use the speedbooster. If you want to zoom in more or get more depth of field, you can use a regular adapter. (Of course, you may want to stick with the same adapter and aperture throughout an entire scene. But the point is that you have options.)
 
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