Joel 3:15

Thanks for the review. I really do appreciate it.

The light coming through was no afterthought, purely intended from the start. Just ask those who read the script beforehand. :)

I also find it interesting how some don't think that people would start killing themselves after a few days. In other movies we see people committing suicide over much sillier reasons. As far as they know... this is the end of the world! I think there would be mass suicides across the globe. Especially considering the news that was coming over the airwaves.

As for the Joel 3:15 tie in... it's like the radio announcer says. The church states that it's a test of Faith.

The point of the movie is how people react to the situation. Everyone reacts differently... I don't think the way that this couple reacts to their situation is a stretch at all.

Those with Faith ultimately survive this test.

I bit off a lot for five minutes but I hope that I managed to tell a decent story.
Thanks again for the feedback! I intend to make a lot of notes when all is said and done and try to improve all around for the next one.

Cheers,

Mike
 
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Hey Kyser,

I've always had a very negative look on suicide...like I would never do it and I think very little of people that have done it because it's just the easy way out. I think that people have an overpowering will to live and that they would fight longer then three days to stay alive. Yes, you can say that the world is ending so what's the point, but people in general know that they will die someday maybe the next day, but just knowing that doesn't mean they are going to kill themselves right now because..."we're going to die anyways." You know what I mean.

I would buy it more if we saw the woman's progression to giving up, but with her husband there that she obviously loved, why would she give up so easily? He is the biggest part of her world and she hasn't lost that yet. It doesn't convince me. Maybe if you played up the fact that the alternative would be a slow, agonizingly painful death...like she was starting to freeze or something and it was unbareable.

Your point of the film was to see how people react and to test their fate. I guess in the way it is now that is okay, but I guess I think it would be more interesting if it were with just the two people...like she wants to give up and he is trying to convince her to live and go on. Then after she dies then he gives up as well from the pain of not having her anymore and kills himself. I know this is what you did in a way, but I would have liked to see just that instead of the 'rest of the world.' I think this is where the bigger then 5 minutes comes into play where if it was just the 2 chars you could definitely fit it into 5 but trying to tell the story of the whole world makes it too much for 5 mins.

Just thought of this cool shot. After the guy shoots himself, you should have a shot of him dying as the sun starts to shine on his face so it's like with his last view before he dies he sees the sun...maybe even a ECU of his pupil dilating. Oh snap.

Laters,
Ando
 
Well, I don't think anyone should have a positive outlook on suicide, but I get your point. :)
You probably can't relate and that's completely understandable.

As a side note...
Just look at what the Orson Welles "War of the Worlds" radio broadcast in 1938 did. And that broadcast lasted less than 2 hours. Now imagine that the sun has vanquished and the entire world is in a state of anarchy, world leaders have disappeared and scientists are claiming that there are just a handful of days left before the world freezes. Some people will take the easy way out.

You don't have to agree though and I'm really not trying to make you. Just trying to show you where I was coming from.

andoguru said:
Hey Kyser,

Just thought of this cool shot. After the guy shoots himself, you should have a shot of him dying as the sun starts to shine on his face so it's like with his last view before he dies he sees the sun...maybe even a ECU of his pupil dilating. Oh snap.

Laters,
Ando
Click to expand...
That's cool. I actually thought about something like that but how many times have we seen the dying person in a movie look at something just before they close their eyes? :cheesy:

Still cool when done properly though.

Thanks again for your impressions, I'll add them to my notes.

Cheers,

Mike
 
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Hey Mike,

I understand where you are coming from and that's cool.

In 1938, though didn't they still believe milk spoiled because of gremlins? We are quite a bit more advanced now, especially in ways of thought. Maybe if this was a period peace back then I could understand...I mean I guess with all the movies coming out with about mass infection etc. that seems more effective in scaring people enough to kill themselves instead of the sun going dark...though as I type this that would be pretty nerve racking too.

Maybe I'm just talking because I like debating especially debating films.

Oh, I think in the shot on his eye, his eye wouldn't close it would stay open and just dilate as the sun hit it...kinda a little trick that it might be dilating because when people die I think their eyes dilate, but also dilating because of the bright sun.

Laters,
Ando
 
andoguru said:
Hey Mike,

I understand where you are coming from and that's cool.

In 1938, though didn't they still believe milk spoiled because of gremlins?
Laters,
Ando
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Cool. But if CNN and the rest of the world is telling you that the sun is gone, days pass by, the world grows colder, and you look outside and the sun IS gone. That might be different. :thumbsup:

andoguru said:
Maybe I'm just talking because I like debating especially debating films.
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That's cool, so do I.

Thanks again for the review, we can carry this on via PM's if you wish.

Cheers,

Mike
 
Kyser

I just watched your film. Wow...great ending. I loved the script...the shots were tight...the edit nice and the acting solid. I love how you never show the radio guy and how the light is just starting to peek at the credits. It had me waiting...waiting...wanting to see the light again. Well played. I totally enjoyed that.

There was only one minor thing that bothered me and it will sound trite, especially when I consider how good this was...BUT....if they were cold and everyone was going to freeze to death...why were your actors in light clothing and not bundled up? No clue why that bothered me...but I wanted to see the wife under the covers or wearing too many layers and still shivering. Maybe your main characters were not in the coldest area but with so many references to the cold..I really did expect them to have more layers as the scenes progressed. It is the only thing about the whole project that did not work for me.

Otherwise...this was a really well done short film and it could easily be expanded to a full length by letting us see all the chaos around the world.

PS...ever think of having the light flash full on about 1/3 in to the credits just to give us that light we are hoping for? not full on or for long...but just enough to give us what we start to wait for...then go black again for the credit roll to finish....
 
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Michele Seidman said:
Kyser

I just watched your film. Wow...great ending. I loved the script...the shots were tight...the edit nice and the acting solid. I love how you never show the radio guy and how the light is just starting to peek at the credits. It had me waiting...waiting...wanting to see the light again. Well played. I totally enjoyed that.

There was only one minor thing that bothered me and it will sound trite, especially when I consider how good this was...BUT....if they were cold and everyone was going to freeze to death...why were your actors in light clothing and not bundled up? No clue why that bothered me...but I wanted to see the wife under the covers or wearing too many layers and still shivering. Maybe your main characters were not in the coldest area but with so many references to the cold..I really did expect them to have more layers as the scenes progressed. It is the only thing about the whole project that did not work for me.

Otherwise...this was a really well done short film and it could easily be expanded to a full length by letting us see all the chaos around the world.
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Some great comments! Thanks...

As for the cold... the radio announcer stated... it was more like fall like temperatures at the moment, but getting colder. The wife does have a blanket wrapped around her in front of the fire and the husband is wearing a fleece in the house.

I did a lot of research on this subject and the consensus is that it would take quite some time for the planet to reach critical temperatures. It was just the thought of freezing to death that drove them over the edge.

Michele Seidman said:
Kyser

I just watched your film. Wow...great ending. I loved the script...the shots were tight...the edit nice and the acting solid. I love how you never show the radio guy and how the light is just starting to peek at the credits. It had me waiting...waiting...wanting to see the light again. Well played. I totally enjoyed that.
Click to expand...

Thanks so much!

Mike
 
andoguru said:
Hey Kyser,

I've always had a very negative look on suicide... but just knowing that doesn't mean they are going to kill themselves right now because..."we're going to die anyways." You know what I mean.

Laters,
Ando
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Ando

I have to debate the point you are making. 'War of the Worlds' on radio caused at least one or two suicides even though more were reported and found to be false. That happened within minutes after broadcasting...not 3 days.

The crash of the Stock Market in the 1920's caused suicides just because life would not be the same. Those took place that day and for several afterwards and those people were not about to die. They were just considering that life would not be as they had always known it.

Kamikaze pilots were willing and loaded with Absinthe in order to do it without threat of their own imminent deaths...just threat to the ideal of their way of life. Suicide bombers abound world wide in all cultures and faiths...but you don't think 2 people freaked out by the darkness of possibly Biblical proportions could not even consider suicide?

Yes, the will to live is great and most fight against death with all their might but there are people who would kill themselves before suffering and if they are isolating themselves it would be easier for them to consider.

I am not debating if it is right or wrong, and I don't think suicide is a way out either...but it is a little naive to think there are not people out there who would do exactly what this couple would do.

History makes the point for me.
 
Kyser said:
I did a lot of research on this subject and the consensus is that it would take quite some time for the planet to reach critical temperatures. It was just the thought of freezing to death that drove them over the edge.

Mike
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Got ya...maybe one more shot of the wife in panic would do it for me then...lol!

I really respect you did the homework on the weather and my sound issue might have missed the 'fall' reference. I really do need to do something about my sound here.
 
Michele Seidman said:
PS...ever think of having the light flash full on about 1/3 in to the credits just to give us that light we are hoping for? not full on or for long...but just enough to give us what we start to wait for...then go black again for the credit roll to finish....
Click to expand...
The final shot was a tough one for me. I actually wanted to show even less and leave the audience guessing. I'm still not 100% on what it will look like in the Directors Cut. Still working on it...

Thanks again!

Mike
 
Hey Michele,

I do know that people are quick to act sometimes with the thought of a sudden life changing and scary incident that they don't understand happens, such in the case of the "War of the Worlds" original broadcast...I almost want to say that their was more then just a few suicides.

Stock Market crash, yes, people losing all their money and then killing themselves.

Kamikaze's for the honor and Suicide bombers for their faith or sometimes 40+ virgins in the afterlife which always confused me because having 40+ virgins would only be good for the lust of the flesh and do they have 'bodies' in the afterlife.

Anywho, my argument comes down to where I think the story was. Kyser has already told me that he wanted the film to focus more on the world and it's reaction to the sun going dark and that's fine except that I think trying to fit that into a 5 minutes is too difficult without having a lot of exposition dialogue or the use of a narrator.

I felt the more interesting story lay with the husband and wife and their actions. Not that suicide couldn't be the outcome for both of them but I would have liked to 'see' the motivation for them coming to that end. I think that the same message could be conveyed, but with more interesting a situation by focusing on the husband and wife.

I think it would be a great 'debate' between the husband and wife. Should they keep fighting to stay alive or just give up to avoid an agonizing death? The husband could be the char wanting to live and the wife wanting to give up and at the same time they both love each other so much so that makes it that much more painful that they are both wanting to take different paths. The reason why I didn't buy that the wife would commit suicide is because I didn't see her motivation for it. The radio DJ talked about the cold becoming unbareable but I only saw the wife in a normal bathrobe...not in a heavy coat and gloves slowly freezing to death. I think Mike was going this way and showed some shots of her by a fireplace but it wasn't sold to me that she was suffering...it more looked like she was just a little chilly in the house.

I do agree people kill themselves for smaller things then the sun going dark, but I think if I had seen more of a buildup for this women wanting to kill herself because she is suffering so much and she wants to live because she loves her husband, but it is just too painful then I would feel so much for that character. That character and the struggle with her husband would be high drama and filled with such emotion. But as it is I think of her as a flat one dimensional character not worth keeping alive anyways.

This all comes down to me wanting to see the couple mainly and Kyser wanting his film to focus on a broader group and that's fine, but I think it's more poignant seeing it in a real personal situation with the couple. I can relate more to that then I can relate to the whole world.

I love debate. I like Kyser's film and this is only shows how good a story his film was or could be because all my thoughts are coming from what I saw in his film.

OH SNAP! Sorry I say this a lot, but I thought of this while writing this....WHAT IF the main character when he is sitting there with his dead wife and is ABOUT to blow his brains out...wait for it...SEES THE SUN COME OUT!!! WOW...now he breaks down knowing that he just killed his wife and that if she could have just held out for a little longer they would be alive and saved! BUT with the emotional weight too much for him to bare he turns the gun on himself again and blows his brains out with the sun shining!!! OH SNAP!!! Now that would so sweet. I get chills just thinking about it.

Laters,
Ando
 
andoguru said:
Hey Michele,

OH SNAP! Sorry I say this a lot, but I thought of this while writing this....WHAT IF the main character when he is sitting there with his dead wife and is ABOUT to blow his brains out...wait for it...SEES THE SUN COME OUT!!! WOW...now he breaks down knowing that he just killed his wife and that if she could have just held out for a little longer they would be alive and saved! BUT with the emotional weight too much for him to bare he turns the gun on himself again and blows his brains out with the sun shining!!! OH SNAP!!! Now that would so sweet. I get chills just thinking about it.

Laters,
Ando
Click to expand...
All of these were possible endings and I actually discussed them with others, but far too predictable for my taste. I chose to do a much different film. The viewer is left with nothing really, just a bleak tale of two people who gave up on life without really knowing the final outcome. Much like life sometimes... less like Hollywood. The lack of Faith actually hits home better this way as well. There is more to this if you look a little deeper.

This in a sense was a test from God. The Sun goes out, Scientists are baffled, the world slips into chaos and the Faithless chose an easy way out. The bigger question is... what is the world like after the sun comes back? That would make for an interesting conclusion.

andoguru said:
I felt the more interesting story lay with the husband and wife and their actions. Not that suicide couldn't be the outcome for both of them but I would have liked to 'see' the motivation for them coming to that end.
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This is where we really disagree, what more motivation does one need? The world is ending. Nuff said.

We would have obviously made two really different movies based on the subject. And that's why I love this medium! :)


Michele Seidman said:
I am not debating if it is right or wrong, and I don't think suicide is a way out either...but it is a little naive to think there are not people out there who would do exactly what this couple would do.

History makes the point for me.
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Couldn't agree more. :thumbup:

I want to thank you both for taking the time to think about the film and the message. That alone tells me that I'm on the right track.

I also want to thank everyone who mentioned that I managed to portray a large scale movie in a <5 minute short. It wasn't easy. Obviously I couldn't fit in everyone's view, but I think I managed something with this couple... in this house.

This really was just their point of view, mostly his tale. The outside world described by the narrator/radio announcer.

I also want to thank those that took the time to send me a PM as well.

Cheers,

Mike
 
andoguru said:
Hey Michele,

I felt the more interesting story lay with the husband and wife and their actions. Not that suicide couldn't be the outcome for both of them but I would have liked to 'see' the motivation for them coming to that end. I think that the same message could be conveyed, but with more interesting a situation by focusing on the husband and wife.

I think it would be a great 'debate' between the husband and wife.

The radio DJ talked about the cold becoming unbareable but I only saw the wife in a normal bathrobe...not in a heavy coat and gloves slowly freezing to death. I think Mike was going this way and showed some shots of her by a fireplace but it wasn't sold to me that she was suffering...it more looked like she was just a little chilly in the house.

But as it is I think of her as a flat one dimensional character not worth keeping alive anyways.

Laters,
Ando
Click to expand...


I see where you are coming from. I too wanted to see some other moment or indication from the wife of fear or concern. I think the husband is fine and we get enough from him...I think a few extra shots of the women showing major fear in a subtle way would make it work without going to the debate you speak of. I do see why a debate between the husband and wife could solve it but I think that depth would have no choice but to be saved if he ever turns it full length.

I also questioned the cold but his research said it would not be that cold yet and I understand that. However...it is a movie and he could make the choice to suspend reality and make it colder faster simply by adding 2, 3 second shots of them in warmer clothing or even a simple shot of the husband trying to keep the wife calm as she cries or freaks out.

I would have liked a stronger indication of why they made the choice even if I could understand the choice in theory.

As for the ending...change it to him shooting her and then seeing the sun before he kills himself...lol no dag nab it. That storyline has been done to death as the main story, as the under lying story, as the back story of a character.

I like it better that neither of them makes it to see the sun. I would like to feel more sympathy for the wife than I do. I feel all of it for the husband and the surprises me but she seems so wimpy...not the actress...the character.
 
Michele Seidman said:
As for the ending...change it to him shooting her and then seeing the sun before he kills himself...lol no dag nab it. That storyline has been done to death as the main story, as the under lying story, as the back story of a character.
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I Agree completely!

Michele Seidman said:
I like it better that neither of them makes it to see the sun. I would like to feel more sympathy for the wife than I do. I feel all of it for the husband and the surprises me but she seems so wimpy...not the actress...the character.
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Perfect. Her performance was intended that way. If I had more time I would have developed that further.

Glad you liked the ending!

Cheers,

Mike
 
Hey Michele,

I know that story has been done before but as in most cases, most stories have been done before and most movies we watch, even the best ones, are rehashes of the same story.

I just like the idea that the wife killed herself because of fear and something out of her control and then the husband would killed himself because of something he chose to do and could have stopped and it seems like his suicide would have some real worth/honor to it that I think viewers would relate to that more. I mean think about if you killed someone you loved and then found out soon after that you didn't have to. Most people would probably turn the gun on themselves.

I find that story, though most people would see it coming, still intriguing because I could relate to it. Also, I think that it would help to drive home the idea of having faith or at least the will to survive because taking the 'easy' way out in this case ended up being terrible.

Alas, these are two different short films we are talking about now. Maybe I'll ask you (Mike) if I can use your story as a base for another short. :thumbsup:

Laters,
Ando
 
andoguru said:
I find that story, though most people would see it coming, still intriguing because I could relate to it. Also, I think that it would help to drive home the idea of having faith or at least the will to survive because taking the 'easy' way out in this case ended up being terrible.

Alas, these are two different short films we are talking about now. Maybe I'll ask you (Mike) if I can use your story as a base for another short. :thumbsup:

Laters,
Ando
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I bolded the "I" because that's the point. Believe it not... many people can relate to the story the way it is. :thumbsup:

As for using my story... not yet. I may flush this out into a deeper short and enter it into a few festivals. Or possibly even a feature some day.

Glad you liked it enough to try your own spin on it.

Cheers,

Mike
 
Kyser said:
I Agree completely!

Perfect. Her performance was intended that way. If I had more time I would have developed that further.

Glad you liked the ending!

Cheers,

Mike
Click to expand...

Then she nailed it and so did you!

andoguru said:
Hey Michele,

I know that story has been done before but as in most cases, most stories have been done before and most movies we watch, even the best ones, are rehashes of the same story.

Laters,
Ando
Click to expand...

Very true....what is the old idea there is man vs nature, man vs man, man vs etc etc...so we have a handful of stories and we add twists. I guess I meant to say the twist you described felt over done for me....and that is why I liked the ending as it was.

Dag nab it I just want a big splash of light at the credit...just a second of it before it goes to black to run the scroll....
 
Michele Seidman said:
Then she nailed it and so did you!



Very true....what is the old idea there is man vs nature, man vs man, man vs etc etc...so we have a handful of stories and we add twists. I guess I meant to say the twist you described felt over done for me....and that is why I liked the ending as it was.

Dag nab it I just want a big splash of light at the credit...just a second of it before it goes to black to run the scroll....
Click to expand...

Thanks! As for the light... I like just a taste myself. :laugh:

Mike
 
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