Jib advice

I

Ian Stark

Active member
Could you please give me some guidance for purchasing a jib to mount my AF101 on?

At the moment I am using a low budget workshop-built jib that I've had for nearly ten years. It was bought on eBay and although it's not of bad quality, it is very cumbersome, heavy and fiddly when it comes to transportation and assembly. As a result I very rarely take it with me on shoots these days unless I know I won't have to carry it any distance and I know I have plenty of time to set it up. It's a shame because I constantly find situations where a jib shot would have looked gorgeous.

I don't have a typical shoot scenario (I do everything from events and interviews to b2b case studies, training and documentaries), but to give you an idea of where the jib shots would have been nice: I have recently shot promos in fashion stores and supermarkets around the UK and Europe where there are lots of members of the public wandering around; similarly I recently shot a promo at London's Royal Exchange with interior and exterior street shots; I've just shot some footage of a restored steam locomotive for a straight to DVD doco; in a similar vein I produced a short doco about a restored cold war jet to accompany a documentary about a 1950s RAF aerobatic team; I just completed a lovely little promo for one of the UK's leading solo violinists to help her raise funds to commission some new compositions. I'd have used a jib on all of them if I'd had one that was convenient to get there, assemble and use.

Although about a third of my projects involve overseas shoots I'm not necessarily looking for a teensy travel jib to fit in a suitcase, although I wouldn't discount one completely if it plays nicely with the AF101 (eg the Kessler Pocket Jib Traveller). I'm interested in ease of setting up primarily (it's normally me on my own or with one other person), but of course stability and a reasonable reach are also important. I don't use a full rig so the maximum weight would be the camera plus my heaviest lens which right now is probably the Samyang/Rokinon 85mm plus adaptor. I monitor with a Zacuto EVF Pro but I would supplement that with a decent field monitor to mount on the jib.

So, what are people using and what would you recommend? I don't have a budget in mind but I am pleasantly cash positive at the moment so I'm looking for a good fit rather than a budget pleaser. I'm particularly interested in experiences with the Kessler Pocket Jib and the Kessler Pocket Jib Traveller.

Thanks in advance of any tips.
 
The key to the praise that rig gets from EndCredits I would bet is down to the construction. Capable of 50lb loading, although I've not used that one, it's clear its well made, and capable of holding 50lbs on one end, plus the corresponding counterweights on the other - so it has to be heavy enough to do it. The mass and inertia of the jib then gives the great smooth shots that work so well. As for transport, it can get fairly small, but it's not going to be overseas friendly from the weight point of view.

My own jib is hugely heavy and this does limit how many jobs I can use it on.
 
I would love to get a new jib but I can't find what would really be useful. A jib should be something you never hesitate to bring or set up. To me most jibs are to heavy to carry and thus you never bring them or they take to much time to set up, or are tricky to assemble.

I like to see something you literally just pull out of a case and put it on a tripod and you are ready to go. No screwing around (pun intended).
 
Thanks for the suggestions.

I'm not having any luck finding a Cinevate dealer in the UK - waiting to hear from them. As for the EZFX jib, it looks great but it seems to be ridiculously more expensive to buy in the UK than in the US. The EZFX website says the basic jib is $1199 http://www.ezfx.com/prices/ - that equals £745 in the UK. But the same system in the UK is £2219 including VAT! http://cvp.com/index.php?t=product/ezfx-jib

I have checked and double checked the details to see what's included and I can't see anywhere that it includes extras such as the dolly or extensions or ANYTHING any different from the basic US package. Someone, somewhere has surely made a mistake (and it could well be me, but I'm damned if I can see where!). I can't believe that the import duty, shipping and the dealer's markup would be as much as £1474!

Still keen to hear of any experiences with Kessler.

Thanks again.
 
Hi Ian

Fellow Brit here ;)

I've been looking at jibs for a while... and the price charged in the UK for this stuff is just ridiculous! There's mark up... and profit... and then just a plain rip-off. CVP's prices are normally pretty good, but on Kessler stuff and jibs, it's just not worth it.

Even if you add import duty at 5%, plus VAT at 20%, the margin is just too vast. But, if people don't want to import for themselves, the choice is limited.

I recently ended up having to get an EORI number addition to my VAT registration (on a Ltd), so if you are planning to get anything from the USA and it's coming to you/your company (so you can get the VAT back), you might need to get one. I had a RedRock micro remote set sitting in Fedex's clearing centre for 7 days until I got my EORI and the kit was released (funny thing was that the delivery from the USA to UK was less than 30 hours!).

In terms of jbs, I'm looking at the Kessler Pocket Jib Pro & the EZ-FX- the Cinevate looks great, but the fact it's a fixed length is a negative in my book.

My use is more of a fixed jib so I can move an Epic with heavy old style cine zooms (20-120) and make it simpler to get varying height shots and reposition without having to move the sticks...

Another one I've looked at is:

Floatcam Dolly Crane (SD and HD models) http://floatcamuk.wordpress.com/dollycranes/dolly-crane/ - this is great for the counter balance and versatility (slider and all-in one)... my problem is I'd need the Pro version (for weight) so that's at the top of my spend/budget.
 
My main jib is a Trovato Tote 48 which will fly 75 lbs.

I used it for a shoot with my AF100 yesterday, and counterbalance load was around 60 lbs. with this particular setup.
 
Hey Ian,


I bought this one about 6 months ago http://www.gearcontact.com/en/ifootage_mini_crane_m1_ii.html?category_id=0

I was hesitant as it's really meant for DSLRS. There are a few similar items on the market but I bought this one because it's carbon fiber so it's light but also carries more weight than the others, up to 5KG.

So far I've used it a lot and it's been great. The only one thing that is a little scary is it's only got single thread on the small plate that connects the camera. But as long as you makes sure everything is done up nice an tight you shouldn't have an issues.

It's also super portable with a nice bag to carry it in.

I was doing a video blog on it but never got around to uploading it.

Hope that helps?

EDIT: Couple of things I should of added.

It only has a height of about 10-11 ft so if you need some amazing crane shot from a second floor window, you're not going to get it.

It's also only going to be suitable for the base camera and lenses and battery. Although I see no reason why you couldn't add a monitor as it has holes available on the centre jib pivot which sits over the main tripod and thus I can't see how this would be jepordising the weight limit.
 
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Thanks for all the advice. I'm still undecided but I will see what I can do about actually trying these jibs out first, rather than buying on spec. The USA to UK mark up seems to be dreadful, though - worse than usual - and it's going to be tough not to feel well and truly gouged.
 
I just decided to visit DVX user today to post a pic of my new Long Valley 7 jib and my AF100 and bam! There's a thread looking for Jib advice. I purchased it last winter thinking I would need more of these style shots. Oddly enough, I have only used it 2-3 times this year. But, it's an awesome weapon to have in the arsenal.

After EXHAUSTIVELY researching the subject, I found that jibs are a finicky animal. There are several key things that you MUST keep in mind:

1. Ease/speed of setup.
2. Stability/weight allowance of base tripod.
3. flex of arm.
4. Type of tripod head used on the end.
5. Types of weights used.

I ranked these in importance. The first key thing to keep in mind is: How fast is the jib to setup? You could have the most rock solid jib in the world, but if it takes 30 minutes to setup, your producer/director will want to scratch the shot. This is EXTREMELY important to keep in mind. You may fool yourself into thinking you can deal with a complicated setup, but it will bite you in the ass every single time if its not super simple and fast.

The base tripod is probably the single critical piece in the entire package. Really, when you think of it, there are three critical pieces of the jib: arm, tripod base, head. Also, perhaps a dolly/wheels if you want to go mobile for quick transport. I purchased a Kessler Kpod for the base. It's been ROCK SOLID. Prior to this, I've used several rented/borrowed jibs and can't even explain my frustration with sub par, crappy tripods. Remember, your going to put a LOT more weight on this rig even then you think, and it's always best to find a tripod that can hold hundreds of pounds. Don't try and stick this arm on your normal tripod. It will most likely destroy it.

I purchased the Long Valley 7 Jib used on ebay. I read a ton of articles. The most helpfull being this one:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/jibs-cranes-booms/496493-seven-jib.html

I wanted something that was super fast to setup, packed up into a relatively light box that I cold fit in my Honda Element. The Seven Jib is probably the fastest setup with the strongest arm out there for the best price. A brand new one is under $1k for the arm. Once you set it up once, you'll be shocked at how quick and simple it is.

Here's a pic of me operating it recently. Thats a tiny Canon camera on it, but I use my fully loaded AF100 with no problem. If anything, I need to upgrade my tripod head.

1412334_713732398646200_1165117675_o.jpg
 
I also have the Seven Jib. Before that I was using the Losmondy travel Jib which is a beast. The Seven just is half the cost and half the time to setup. Actually, about 5 minutes. I load a 25lb RED Epic on there no sweat.
 
We are running a pocket jib traveler from Kessler Crane. Its a little heavy for it, but it works.
 

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I'm thinking now about two jibs! One compact jib for when I travel and one for when it doesn't need to go in a suitcase.

Tried several times to fire an email off to Long Valley to enquire about shipping the Seven to the UK but it keeps bouncing back as spam . . . bit annoying.

The Hague Multi Jib certainly looks interesting and I'll try and get to see one in action next time I'm in their area. They offer a significant advantage to me because they're UK based. A full rig including stand and dolly costs around £1200, and there's also a remote pan/tilt head (which doubles the price so that might be something for later!)

IdahoVideo - can I ask how the weight of the AF100 affects performance of the Kessler? Is it less stable, less smooth etc? What kind of accessories are you using, if any - it's hard to figure out from the photo whether that's a real fancy focus wheel or a car in the background ;-). Looks like the jib is rated for up to 10lbs which I guess is going to be cutting it fine for anything but a basic camera and lens setup. Having said that I'm not averse to using the GH2 on a pocket jib. At the moment I don't have the luxury of any jib shots at all when I'm traveling overseas.
 
I also have a 7 JIB COMPACT XL from Long Valley (as well as a highly modified version of their Super Track dolly). I've seen my AF100 rig bend a (popular) lesser jib -- even after I stripped my rig down some.

If you're having trouble contacting Doug via email there are other options. Here's a link to his web site's contact page. Believe it or not, even snail mail still works.

http://www.longvalleyequip.com/contact.php
 
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