Is the HVX true 24p?

J

jdv

Well-known member
Hey guys + gals - I was reading the machinist's post in the "questions" thread below that said that the HVX is not actually 24p, but 23.98 p. I know the new Canon is not, and I'm not sure about the JVC1000.

I know I also read that Barry said the sensor chips were imprinted as true 24p, not interlaced (like the new Canon).

SO, a couple of three questions:
1. Is the HVX exactly 24p?
2. If not, what are the ramifications for a 35mm film out? 3. Is every frame 'pure' but the last one?

Thanks for any information on this, John
 
Luis Caffesse said:
No it's not.

It's 23.98 :)

Yes, it is "true" 24P, so you have no problems with a 35mm film out as long as you have a smooth post workflow.
Try using the search function or checking out Panasonic's HVX site, both should give you all the answers you need.
Click to expand...

Luis - Could you explain why/how that's true? It seems like eventualy that .02 difference would cause a snafu, especially on long takes.... John
 
I was just being a bit of a smartass really.
Ransom is right, in the video world 24P is used as a name for convenience, in the same way we talk about 30fps NTSC video when it's really 29.97fps.

When 23.98 is shot and a pulldown is added the result is a 29.97 NTSC compliant signal. The HVX will use a pulldown on 1080P footage in the same way it uses a pulldown on the DVX to achieve 24P.

24fps is 80% of 30fps
23.98 is 80% of 29.97

When transfering 23.98 to 24fps film the frames are simply transfered 1 to 1.
The difference in timing is roughly 3-4seconds per hour.
I imagine that if need be the audio can easily be retimed to make up for the .02fps difference
(in the same way audio is retimed now for PAL orginated material, and in that case you're talking about a full frame per second)
 
Its such a miniscule difference it doesn't cause any problems.

We're talking 2 hundreths of 1/24 of a single second.
 
so that's what 24 hundreths of 1/24 of 1/3600 of an hour?

(I stopped taking mathematics classes first semester of freshman year of college and i lose more and more of my grasp on numbers as time goes by.)
 
Thanks guys. So, bottom line, there is nothing to worry about for a film out. Good 2 know :)
john
 
The difference is roughly 1 full frame per 41.6667 seconds, which adds up to a difference of roughly 3.5 seconds per hour.

So, for a 120 minute feature you're looking at a difference of roughly 7 seconds in running time. So yes, there are audio issues that need to be taken into account when figuring out your post workflow.

BUT, these are things that are easily dealt with in a myriad of ways.
It's nothing to worry about, as you said...but it is something to be aware of.

Best thing to do, if you're planning on a filmout, pick your lab early and be in contact with them from the start.
That's the best way to alleviate any problems.
 
No worries at all. In fact if you've seen 28 days later then you already know what a SD 24fps film out might look like.
 
The Machinist said:
No worries at all. In fact if you've seen 28 days later then you already know what a SD 24fps film out might look like.
Click to expand...

That's sort of a bad example, given that it was shot on the XL1s which is incapable of 24P recording

:)

How about "Once Upon a Time in Mexico" or "November"
 
No worries at all. In fact if you've seen 28 days later then you already know what a SD 24fps film out might look like.

It's nothing to worry about, as you said...but it is something to be aware of.
Click to expand...

A wise sentiment.
 
I dropped the ball on that one.

Way to slam dunk it though Luis.

By the way November is a pretty good flick. Shot on multiple DVXs if i'm not mistaken?
 
The Machinist said:
November is a pretty good flick. Shot on multiple DVXs if i'm not mistaken?
Click to expand...

Yeah, I just saw it myself a little while back on the big screen.
I had no idea what to expect, and was pleasently surprised.
It looked good too. And yeah, it was shot with the DVX.
 
Thanks again Machinist/Luis...

As to the issue of which house to do the transfer, any ideas there? I've used Matchframe and fotokem before, but that was film only...
 
Duart, Laser Pacific, and DVFilm are a few.

By the way JDV, just noticed you're in Ypsilanti.
I grew up in Ann Arbor - glad to see other 'Michiganders' on here.
:)

I've never done a 35mm blowup myself, though I've prepped projects for it (it's always been handled by someone else). Your best bet is to try to find someone with experience taking a project all the way through a filmout.
 
Just read through this post quickly so forgive me if someone mentioned it... there is a real 24.000 fps rate for the Sony CineAlta, and a 23.976. I ought to know, as my first digitizing session ever they screwed up and used it. :)

Also FYI most features shot with CineAlta use 23.976.

Regards,

Jim Arthurs
 
Jim Arthurs said:
Also FYI most features shot with CineAlta use 23.976.

Regards,

Jim Arthurs
Click to expand...

Jim - why is that so? Is there a reason why it's not just an actual one for one 24 frames per second?

Luis - Hey, Ann Arbor huh? Drop me a line if you're ever in town....We'll do lunch. thanks again 4 the help...
John
 
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