Is the HPX500 getting too old to buy now?

nedcam

nedcam

Well-known member
I have been a freelance DP for thirty years and I need a new camera RIGHT AWAY, have zeroed in on the 500 but it seems that it has been out awhile and I’d be buying into an old model. I spoke with a Panasonic rep and despite the internet rumors there is no new model of it coming out. I ruled out the 300 (1/3”, skew and jello) and Chicago is becoming a P2 favored town, so I have ruled out the EX & XDCAM line. However, due to the economy, cheap competitors and the thought that XDCAM may win out in the end (seems popular on east coast) I do not want to commit to an expensive 2700 or 3700.

I like the HPX170 but need a shallower DOF and I don't want to mess around with adapters. I am mainly worried about technically knowledgeable clients not wanting the pixel shifting and I am also concerned about the viewfinder not being good enough for racking focus in a documentary situation. Otherwise it looks like a sweet camera. I have always bought the best camera when a change occurred but since HD I've just been renting, which loses me money. But there are now so many different format requests I can't have all the models.

My clients don't seem to care about AVC-intra. I'm not a fan of Firestores and such.

So, does anyone on this board know of any reason not to pull the trigger and get one? I specialize in corporate, Non-Fiction TV shows and docs. It seems the upper end clients like Nat Geo, Hist Channel, etc., they are still favoring tape and request the HDX900, but I want to go tapeless. Many of them are from out-of-town and they insist on a tape in their hand when heading for the airport. Some clients actually supply the camera, usually HDV, another reason I don’t want an expensive monthly payment for a 2700 or 3700.

Requests are still about 30% betacam (the recession has given SD a shot in the arm), perhaps 20% DV (just sold my very profitable 100A) and the rest are varying flavors of HD. Knowing that I need a real shoulder mount and 2/3” non CMOS, this HPX500 is my best bet correct? Especially for the corporate video client base? Before I lay my money down I just wanted to ask everyone if there is something I am not considering in terms of shoulder mount 2/3rd P2. If the HDX900 had several P2 slots that would be perfect!

Thanks,

Ned
www.nedmiller.com
 
Well, if you like the HDX900 and think it'd be perfect with P2, why not consider getting an HDX900, and adding a P2 Portable on the back? For the additional 5 grand, you get two P2 slots and AVC-Intra recording as well as DVCPRO-HD recording. You'd have tape for the tape-based clients, P2 DVCPRO-HD for those clients, and P2 AVC-Intra for the most-demanding clients. You'd be modern and future-proofed, with a full foot in the tape-based past.

And, heck, for SD clients, you could shoot SD to P2 as well, in DV, DVCPRO, or DVCPRO50.

Other than that, the HPX500 is the only affordable 2/3" game in town, and it's been given Silver status (for unlimited acquisition) by Discovery, so not too much to worry about there.
 
Thanks Barry. I will look into this. Wonder how much longer it will add to the back, with the radio receivers being there.
 
I ran accross a used sdx900 for $10k a few months ago, never thought about usng the P2 recorder for it with a avc-i board.
 
ned, if you are crafty about how you buy and finance an hpx500 package (panny has a few different deals), you can have very low monthly payments. (I'm assuming you already own sticks and audio/lighting) I have mine set up so that I only need to get 1 rental a month to cover payments. There has been 1 or 2 months where I didnt take it out, however there have been plenty of months with 10 or more days, so its a pretty easy buy.

On another note, you will definitely need to upgrade the VF. The one off the sdx900 is really your only option and can be found used for around 1k.
 
Ned,
I made the leap to the 500 about seven months ago and have not looked back. I also come from a betacam/DVCAM background and still shoot with my Sony camera from time to time. I was amazed at how easy the transition was and seeing that I had all the support equipment, I just purchased the camera, a HD wide angle lens and P2 cards (all on the used market without any issues).

I don't do much shooting for networks but my clients love the look, and most producers love the ease of the P2 work flow. My only fear was offloading and backing up the P2 footage - which has never failed me. I also shoot some projects in SD with good results and an easier edit flow thanks to the P2.

I'm sure you know the pros and cons of the camera but the images I've gotten (mostly interviews and b-roll at 720p) have been very good. This by no means will be my last camera purchase but for now, I couldn't beat the price for this camera and I love the look and feel of the larger cameras. If you decide to pull the trigger, my only advice would be to buy a true HD lens so when you replace the camera you can use the lens!

Hope this helps!

Scott in Chicago
 
I bought a used HVX/Canon "J" lens a few weeks ago and am using it to shoot a feature. A few observations:

1) There is no need for an adaptor. With it's low light capabilities, simply using the ND filters and a low f stop results in all the shallow depth of field you can handle (at least for my purposes). Focus of course is critical when doing this.
The histogram focus assist has been a huge help.

2) Don't expect amazing sharpness, at least with an SD lens. It's comparable to the HVX. But it looks extremely filmic and has noticeably better dynamic range.

3) The big shoulder mount rig enables you to get much smoother shots than any of the lightweights when off the tripod.

4) Being able to put 4 sound sources on independent channels can be a huge asset.

5) Overall, it was a good choice for my purpose. It enables me to shoot with much less lighting than my HVX, which would require me to light obscure corners of the room to eliminate noise. I still use the HVX for crane shots (my jib tripod nearly collapsed when I put the 500 on it) and situations where the
HPX is just too big.
 
I bought my HPX in June and love it. Barry has a great idea though for those who still are sketchy about trusting hard drives or digital workflows, and NY Lion is right: rent the cam out once a month and it pays for itself with the Panny lease deal going on.

I stuck with the original viewfinder for doc work and haven't had any issues. With some used SD glass on the front, no one has called me out for not using an HD lens yet. I'll admit that I'm already looking ahead for full HD image sensors, etc., but that's just natural progression. For the price, the 500 is great. We're mixing footage now in a post house with an EX3, shot at 1080 p. The CC guy said mix away, he's done several docs and shorts with both cameras and they adapt well to the big screen.
 
yeah, just a warning on the SD lens... I own a canon j15x8 sx12. nice lens, but definitely has CA issues. for instance, if you are shooting someone against a a blown out background you will definitely get that purple fringing. clients havent noticed it, but i do.

My solution is to rent an HD lens for my big jobs and greenscreen work and use the SD lens for the run of the mill stuff, ENG etc. Rental houses here in SF usually have a card rate of $150 for a kit HD lens, so if you can talk em down, its even easier on the wallet and when you get someone shelling out $600 for you cam package as opposed to 400, you rent the nice lens.

The way i figure it, once the body, VF and monitor are paid off (almost there!), ill get an HD lens.
 
I'm the guy that posted original thought:

Re: Barry's Idea - Got the quote for a HDX900 and a P2 back: Low forties! So even if I did want to spend that much it doesn't help because of the fear that XDCAM is gaining in popularity, judging by the calls. Seems more of my non-fiction TV show clients are requesting it, they are 95% out-of-towners and there's no time for media dumps, and they are too cheap to hire P2 wranglers. So I guess that leaves me with a 500 as an interim camera for a couple of years since it's the only 2/3" in that price range. I am being loaned a 300 for this weekend as a test but everyone wants the background out of focus and I don't have the time to mess with DoF adapters. I will rent 2700s, F900s and HDX 900s for the high end jobs and the 500 will suffice for perhaps 60% of my work. I wish there was a DOCKABLE camera where I could put anything on the back! Thanks everyone for your input.
 
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If you have a tape based camera for "trading stock" consider the trade up deal to the AG-HPX 3700. It's an awesome camera. The deal is really good. If you can afford that, It's the way to go. I traded a camera, sold a 500 and went for the deal. There is also a deal for the 2700 VariCam.
 
Or you can keep your old camera and buy two or 3 300's for the same price as the 3700 after the trade in. Don't forget the 300's would be complete with lens and viewfinder while the 3700 would still need a lens and viewfinder etc. I still might do the trade in but ....
 
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1/3" cmos Vs 2/3" ccd....

I'd go down the 2/3" path, and get all the other bells and whistles the 2700/3700 has over the 300, of course as long as that's what fit the given budget and need for a camera....
 
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