Is the D5300 a significant upgrade from the T3i?

My point is that people use their cameras differently, and should choose after how they like to work and what is most important to them. It can help to get tips from someone else but in the end its you that gonna handle the camera. I love using the histogram when I shoot run and gun documentary and get tired in the head its easy to know where you are on exposure, especially with flaat profiles where it can be hard to judge from the lcd.

That said, when it comes to dslr its gonna take alot of extra accessories to get it working like a video-camera, and if you can save up on the camera-cost you can put more money into those things which will last longer than the camera anyway. I just bought a really nice handheld rig with followfocus from Swedish Chameleon (SC3: Large), and its damn expensive so Im thinking about selling the D800 and buy a d5300 or d3300 instead. Then I can buy a Samyang 35 1.4 and the rig and still pocket a few hundred for a hdmi-monitor with histogram and peaking.

What you cannot do is buy a camera with bad IQ and later fix that.
 
I think that we have established that the D5300 is the only way that one can go. Otherwise, it is absolutely irresponsible and does the general community a total disservice.

I, for one, am relieved that this has been settled.
 
Samuel H said:
I aggree with all of that, except: ML is great! it is the only thing I miss now that I no longer shoot on a Canon
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Agreed, ML is the only reason I still keep one in my gear bag (well, that and to change aperture on EOS lenses before putting on an adapter).
No one said you NEED it to produce great work, but it makes things much easier.

In particular, I would like to stress the freedom that you get if you buy lenses that will work on any camera, not just the one you have today. For me, that meant vintage Leica-R. It also means that I see L or G glass more as an expense than as an investment. It does keep a nice resale value, but eventually you're going to sell it, it's not glass for life.
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One of the downsides of shooting Nikon actually is the lens limitations for me. I work a lot with EOS shooters and my personal collection has a lot of excellent EOS and FD lenses, as well as the Nikkor ones here and there. When shooting micro 4/3, I like that I can easily adapt anything, even rent real cinema glass.

If the Nikons were so much better than the Panasonics, I'd sell my collection and stick with the Nikkors. But it isnt. They go head to head in IQ with other options on the market with pros and cons (although I'd argue NOT counting Canon). If you have invested in a lot of EOS or other glass that isnt compatible, well, thats something to think about.
 
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Nikons a better that M4/3 Panasonics, in terms of noise, latitude.. not as good in terms of resolution.. I find Nikon optics to be a little better overall (compared to Canon) Strangely enough Canon C100 easier to match with Nikon DSLRs and Panasonics than any Canon DSLR( that are worse in terms of resolution and latitude, compared with the Nikons)
I ended up to have: C100 for serious XLR sound work, for run/gun DSLRs, D800e(with mosaic filter), D5200, D5300, and Panasonic GX7(which is the best at the moment for M4/3 imo)
PS sold 5dmk3, not using ML too much, to me it's a waste of time.. C100, D800e give similar of better quality without long raw workflow, unpredictable results.
also have Sony RX 100 II for the pocket!
 
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Being able to use basically any lens is a big pro for mirrorless systems. It's a pity that Nikon's mirrorless is such a shameful joke. For me, they have the best DSLR image quailty right now, outside of the 5D3+RAW; if I could get it in mirrorlsss mount and put a speedbooster in front of that D5300 sensor, it would be a no-brainer.

So, I'd say we have reasons to go with basically any system:
* Canon: my lenses are Canon, I'm used to the UI, aliasing/moire don't bother me, it's still making me money
* 5D3+RAW: I want the best possible image quality, no matter how painful the workflow is; I also want a big sensor, and I have $3500 for a camera and a big memory card
* BMC: I want the best possible image quality, no matter how painful the workflow is, or how weird the camera shape; I can live with a small sensor, and with some aliasing/moire
* Panasonic: I care more about sharpness than about anything else, and I like how a mirrorless mount allows me to use basically any lens
* Nikon: I care more about image quality than about anything else, and I think DR is more important than sharpness; I can live with an APS-C sensor and F mount
* Sony NEX: I want a cheap camera with FF-equivalent sensor (when used with a speedbooster) or that can mount basically any lens (when used with standard adapter), that's good but not the best in every front (DR, sharpness, aliasing/moire)
 
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"I think that we have established that the D5300 is the only way that one can go. Otherwise, it is absolutely irresponsible and does the general community a total disservice.

I, for one, am relieved that this has been settled."


Its not that simple, and if the choice of camera is important to you, you have to get down to details. Ofcourse people will be biased towards their favorite brand or what they use, just make sure to think of that when you read what other people say and single out the facts. To just end the discussion is giving up on internet-based-community-style-debate, which in spite of all its downsides has helped me alot in this complicated venture of filmmaking.
 
Thread sounds a little bit like a Dpreview thread (yikes). I'd have to say I'm a Nikon fan boy, however I think there is really only one way to decided if a tool is the right one for you. Either rent it or buy it (even if you sell it for $100 less at least you will know for sure that it is right for you). Lots of things determine if a camera is the "right one for you". I have a mix of cameras (I just a hobbyist who used to do commercial stuff), and each has it strengths and weaknesses. As the Zacuto great camera shoot out finally concluded, now days it's not the equipment but the videographer that makes the difference.
 
Samuel H said:
Being able to use basically any lens is a big pro for mirrorless systems. It's a pity that Nikon's mirrorless is such a shameful joke. For me, they have the best DSLR image quailty right now, outside of the 5D3+RAW; if I could get it in mirrorlsss mount and put a speedbooster in front of that D5300 sensor, it would be a no-brainer.

So, I'd say we have reasons to go with basically any system:
* Canon: my lenses are Canon, I'm used to the UI, aliasing/moire don't bother me, it's still making me money
* 5D3+RAW: I want the best possible image quality, no matter how painful the workflow is; I also want a big sensor, and I have $3500 for a camera and a big memory card
* BMC: I want the best possible image quality, no matter how painful the workflow is, or how weird the camera shape; I can live with a small sensor, and with some aliasing/moire
* Panasonic: I care more about sharpness than about anything else, and I like how a mirrorless mount allows me to use basically any lens
* Nikon: I care more about image quality than about anything else, and I think DR is more important than sharpness; I can live with an APS-C sensor and F mount
* Sony NEX: I want a cheap camera with FF-equivalent sensor (when used with a speedbooster) or that can mount basically any lens (when used with standard adapter), that's good but not the best in every front (DR, sharpness, aliasing/moire)
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Re: nikon vs gh3. (d5200/5300 to be exact)

I'd argue that the image quality isn't as good with the Nikon due to lack of resolution as compared to GH3. At least in all the sample videos I watch. gh3 seems to pop better. Of course a lot more people use the gh3, it seems, for video. So more professional results from it.

Can any of you point to any really impressive looking d5300/200 videos? I just usually browse vimeo.

I'd like to go with Nikon, but keep being more impressed with gh3 footage.
 
As I said, if resolution is your main guide to gauge image quality, you're likely to find the Panasonics a better option. If, like me, you are much more DR-obsessed than resolution-obsessed, the GH3 is not an option.

Now, a nice clip shot on these Nikons... I use a NEX, so I can't post anything shot by me. How about this? (as you'll see, I'm easily impressed by images showing great DR)
 
stokstad said:
Its not that simple, and if the choice of camera is important to you, you have to get down to details. Ofcourse people will be biased towards their favorite brand or what they use, just make sure to think of that when you read what other people say and single out the facts. To just end the discussion is giving up on internet-based-community-style-debate, which in spite of all its downsides has helped me alot in this complicated venture of filmmaking.
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Sorry stokstad, I was being sarcastic. I actually made a point earlier about figuring out the proper camera for oneself. Some work easier, some feel better, some provide results that work better than others depending on your requirements or desires.

Personally, I have been a long-time Nikon fan and have a D5200 myself. For stills I just love Nikon color. I've never been able to pull the same color from any Canon that I have tried (but I haven't used a 5D3). I am "trying" Canon for video because I feel that I owe it to myself to at least TRY ML and see if it is something that I find useful or not. I like the tools that it provides for shooting video but I am less concerned about photo features.

Something tells me I will decide to stick with Nikon but like I said, I owe it to myself to try something else just to see.
 
Samuel H said:
As I said, if resolution is your main guide to gauge image quality, you're likely to find the Panasonics a better option. If, like me, you are much more DR-obsessed than resolution-obsessed, the GH3 is not an option.

Now, a nice clip shot on these Nikons... I use a NEX, so I can't post anything shot by me. How about this? (as you'll see, I'm easily impressed by images showing great DR)
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Any opinions on what I ought to pickup for shooting landscapes this spring? Storms and cloudscapes along with some in-car people shooting and interviews.

Already have nikon d800, but want that for stills.

I thought about black magic, but for the volume I want to record, seems a real pain.

Have been gravitating towards GH3 because of video options along with really beautiful clarity in video. Dynamic range doesn't seem much worse than most of the dslrs I've seen -- better mostly.

I'd go with the d5300 if I felt it was good enough -- makes more sense given my stable of nikon gear. (although all I need is an adapter for the gh3)

Of course then there is the whole 4k thing this spring... but I don't know if it'll be out and useable enough for what I need. No idea if the gh4 will verify in time to consider. (I'd like to have my setup picked out before april)
 
Personally I'd go with the D5300, especially if you're already carrying gear for the D800 (which BTW is a very good option too, don't know why you don't consider using it for both video and stills).

If you think the GH3 has enough DR for you, it's also a very solid option. More aliasing/moire than the D5200/D5300, about as much as with your current D800. But also more detail.
 
DerekPW said:
Re: nikon vs gh3. (d5200/5300 to be exact)

I'd argue that the image quality isn't as good with the Nikon due to lack of resolution as compared to GH3. At least in all the sample videos I watch. gh3 seems to pop better. Of course a lot more people use the gh3, it seems, for video. So more professional results from it.

Can any of you point to any really impressive looking d5300/200 videos? I just usually browse vimeo.

I'd like to go with Nikon, but keep being more impressed with gh3 footage.
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I found another great example of very nice Nikon footage, and this time it's not just a test, but a finished product:
https://vimeo.com/73376397
https://vimeo.com/85256012
 
Personally I'm a Canon shooter now. I've owned a Nikon D7000 and a GH1 and GH2. Among so many other dedicated photo and video cameras in the past. My reasons for going with Canon were not overall image quality but the system in general. I know the Canon cameras will get better with video quality in time. They have to. Competition will eventually force them to. Then we will reach a point of diminishing returns where all the cameras produce great images and all that wil matter will be the glass and what you do with the combination. So the long term investment is glass. Which for me is used for both stills and video.

The way I look at it, Canon is the most versatile. Not only do they offer both their EF/EF-S lenses but also cinema lenses. Plus you can adapt Nikkors to Canon cameras if you want. With the Canon glass I can change aperture and do autofocus when shooting stills. I can also move from their consumer DSLR line to their pro DSLR line and even their C series with the same lenses. I even have a choice of taking those lenses to a BMCC or a BM4K camera and potentially other future BM cameras, both of which have EF mounts. Same is true with the RED cameras which offer an EF mount option.

On the lower end the 60D/70D are slgithly better built cameras with flip out LCD screens which are ideal for video. The only Nikon to offer that is the 5200/5300 models which offer great images but are more consumer grade built quality. Moving up to a better built D7100 you lose that flip out screen. Sadly you do on the higher end Canon cameras as well. But at least you can move into dedicated cinema cameras beyond that made by Canon or otherwise. Nikon seems to show little interest in video. They have no dedicated video cameras and even opted out of a video function on their new Df. So unless they radically change their philosophy investment in newer Nikon glass is limited only to their DSLR line.

So while older Nikon glass is a good investment if all you ever shoot is video. For me I need AF for stills as well. The Canon just makes more sense all around from a total system perspective, even if the lower end DSLRs are struggling with outdated video modes currently. Like I said, that's bound to get better in time or I'm bound to make more money and move up to a C series camera. Either way, the Canon glass will work.

So I'm personally betting on the long term. I spent the last 15 years jumping from one camera system to another and have nothing to show for it now. Had I just stuck with Canon back in 1998 when I started I'd have an arsenal of Canon glass right now and not feel like I'm starting from stratch.

There is sometimes to be said to consistency and learning your gear versus jumping from system to system chasing incremental improvements at a time when the technology is still relatively new and evolving. My bet is that in 5 years or so all these manufactures wil be able to produce amazing 1080p from even their lower end models. Either through downsampling of 4K to 1080p or better codecs, sensors or a combination of all of the above.
 
Soon Nikon will announce the new D4S which is supposed to have "improved video". I think that will indicate where Nikon is going, either they stay in the kind of casual approach or they will make some kind of new move.
 
* you're mean
* even if the D5300 is free of aliasing/moire and it doesn't show up in the pictures, I get little panic attacks whenever those fabrics come onscreen; Canon, what have you done to me?!!!
 
roxics said:
... The only Nikon to offer that is the 5200/5300 models which offer great images but are more consumer grade built quality. Moving up to a better built D7100 you lose that flip out screen. ...
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I have to say that I love the consumer build quality of my D5200. I don't need a camera to be built like a tank if I'm only going to be using it for a maximum of five years. And I really appreciate the light weight and small size. It makes camera support and looking unobtrusive very easy. I've never felt the like D5200 was going to break. Now no aperture control in Live View does blow.
 
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