Is it worth considering trading the FS700 for the F5?

P

pythonman

Well-known member
Hi,

In my situation, where I haven't yet purchased a 7Q recorder (I have been holding out for a compressed 4K format), with the recent hack to enable XAVC 4K on the F5, I'm just considering (not too seriously, but just throwing the question out there) whether it would be worth selling my FS700 for the F5?

My current FS700 kit includes shoulder rig, Kinotehnik viewfinder, both metabones adapters, 6 lenses (powered Sony zoom, the rest being Canon lenses) and many batteries. I shoot and edit low(ish) budget corporate videos.

I realise the hack is not an official Sony solution, and may have some unrealised pitfalls, and of course I'd have to invest in different batteries and lens adapter for my Canon lenses. But I love the form factor of the F5 (e.g. position of the viewfinder for shoulder-mount use) and compressed 4K is a perfect solution for me, who will use the 4K for shots needing stabilisation and multiple focal-length crop options during interviews.

I figured it would not cost too much more (in the grand scheme of things) selling the FS700 (and associated gear) and buying a F5, than it would be buying a 7Q for my FS700. I realise a lot of you guys have different circumstances to me and the 4K2HD solution on the 7Q is a big benefit to you, but to me I'd really only be buying it for the 4K. Plus it will be far easier for me to shoot using just the camcorder itself (the F5), with no bulky bolt-ons.

Just amusing myself with the idea. What do you guys think?
 
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I posted a similar question on the F5 forum and was told by a very knowledgable and trusted F55 user that the internal 4K (non R5) on the F5 / F55 suffers from visible compression from the XAVC codec and that the 7Q 4K is cleaner than the internal 4K on the F cameras. I have a feeling the 4K compressed on the 7Q will be cleaner than the internal 4K on the F cameras because Pro-Res is a great codec.

With an R5 module, that all changes in favor of the F5 obviously.

F5 is still better in a lot of ways, but one big advantage of the 7Q is that it's Pro-Res, a proven industry standard that is much preferred over XAVC, which is why Sony is adding Pro-Res to the F cameras.

If the F5 shot internal 4K Pro-Res, it would probably clean up the compression and be quite a bit better. Until then, not sure if it's the superior 4K solution, especially without official Sony support.
 
waiting IBC and Photokina might be a good idea. ;)

I have some Pros for the F5 or sth similar:
10bit XAVC is a deal breaker. Out of the camera high quality ready for editing. Way better form factor.
These are also Cons to the FS700/7Q combo.:
There is no ready to use recording except AVCHD. 7Q REC709 is not usable. 7Q RC709 (800%) and sLog2
always need tweaking. I really hate these small buttons at the left side.
Don't ask me how often I touched AutoWB / AutoIris /AutoGain.. when I took the camera of the tripod
or while handheld shooting. Yes, there is a lock button but it locks also aperture adjustments on
electronic lenses.
FS700 plus 7Q is quite a chunk.

I dont know wether I would go for a FS700 today. As many of us
I started with the FS700 in 2012 and the 7Q kept it in the game.
12.000k net plus viewfinder plus expensive media for a F5 at one time would have
been always out oft budget.
 
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If the 700 is holding you back then the short answer is yes, get rid of it. Although you might want to look at the epic too.
 
I think Sony will come out with a new camera to replace the fs series. Out of the box it will be a step up and have the specs we all desire but I also believe it won't match the fs700 Odyssey 7q combo. Yes, we'll get better low light, 10 bit out of the gate maybe some better ergonomics etc. But anything new, remotely close to 240 fps, 120 fps RAW at 12 bit, xvac will kill the fs700, F5 and possibly their flagships f55/65. Sony won't do that, we've witnessed this week and have now seen how Sony protects its high end line. My humble opinion is even if Sony comes out with an updated fs line we won't see a formidable fs series competitor until the f5/55 line is extinguished and a new breed of Cinealtas emerge. We're still almost a year before anything hits the market anyway. Look at Red, yes the dragon is better (on paper) but in terms of making the original Epic obsolete isnt happening. That's what I see and believe any replacement won't be worth replacing until something completely new hits the market. Kinda like how CMOS technology came about in the mid 90's. As long as its the same type of technology we won't see any vast improvements until a new breed of technology take its place. Keep in mind too (speaking from a producer) we don't use the latest greatest camera, unless it's a specialty camera HFR or heavy VFX. Up until a few months ago I was getting calls for the f3. Now it's the f5/55. They been out now almost 2 years and is just starting to gain serious traction. Don't get me wrong I love technology I just don't see anything coming out replacing what's already been released. At least not this cycle or the one about to come. Thanks
 
the f5 with a hack suddenly became a contender...I suspect there will be a sony legal firmware update legalizing the internal 4k and enabling clip review of 4k which it doesn't do now with the hack...when that happens I also suspect there will be 4k pro res option enabled...now then it will be worth considering the update and the selling of the sony fs-700
 
"September is going to be very surprising time", that's i've heard from them. can't tell who but you can guess if you know what i've done for them, testing their camera before releasing. :)

they are Japanese manufacturer, and InterBEE, the biggest exhibition in Japan will be held on November so IBC and Photokina is good time for sneak peek.
 
great thread guys! I put another guess in the round: we might get a successor but not with global shutter nor with internal 10bit either. And we will complain about the price so the most of us will stay with FS700/7Q :laugh:
 
Clermond said:
great thread guys! I put another guess in the round: we might get a successor but not with global shutter nor with internal 10bit either. And we will complain about the price so the most of us will stay with FS700/7Q :laugh:
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My situation is that i was sort of about to buy the 7Q, I just sold my EA50 but right now I would only be able to afford the 7Q and one drive, not the FS700 recording option. If the new camera is interesting and I could afford it by selling the FS700 (and the money I have from the EA50) it would sort of make more sense than going with the 7Q (which is also slightly overkill for what I need).
 
I love the F series camera with the R5 module. Without it though, XAVC is far less desirable than Pro-Res. When 4K Pro-Res is available for the F5 which is very possible, I might be getting one.
 
I honestly don't see the point in the F5 (over the FS700) other than the ergonomics, but that's not to say that the F5 has amazing ergonomics, just that the FS700 is terrible. It's possibly the most awkward camera I have ever used.

I toyed over the F5, FS7Q and the Epic for about 6 months and really couldn't make up my mind on which one to buy. In the end, based on the specs promised from CD, the FS7Q beats the Epic and the F5 IMO. Assuming they come through on everything they promised;

In both ProRes and raw, you can achieve 4k up to 60fps and 2k up to 120fps and in raw only, you shoot up to 240fps. All in Full frame (speed booster) with no cropping (line skipping instead).

Each camera obviously has it's pros and cons, but I don't see any reason to buy the F5 over the FS7Q apart from the OLPF and TBH, I struggle to see a reason to buy an Epic over those specs too.

Just my opinion of course :)
 
Prendi said:
Oh, and if you can hold out for the 6K Kinefinity, I'd go for that. Specs look amazing!
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Been giving the Kinimini and Kinemax a real good look lately. The performance of the kinemini in that 12 camera shoot out video was quite impressive. Built in Cineform recording is a massive win also. I just wish more people had this camera in their hands to be able to share their tests with us. More importantly, being a new and relatively unknown company, I'd like a better idea about Kinefinity's ability to support the cameras into the future.

All that aside, they definitely have my attention.
 
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