Is 30P good for a workout video?

DPStewart

DPStewart

Veteran
Hi Gang,

I have a job coming up shooting a workout/exercise video but I have not done one of these before.

I'd say 24P is out because they will want a crisper, more fluid (realistic?) look, but I really hate the look of 60i video.

The basic descriptions always say something like "30P is not as filminc as 24P, but retains some of the non-video look etc..."

I don't think I'm going to get an opportunity to do test shoots, so I was wondering if anyone might have some suggestions for frame rates, shutter speeds, or whatever for this type of product.
It will be shot indoors on a stage.

...or is this just a job for HI-DEF MAN?

Thanks!
 
so what's the job for?
is it for TV, youtube or do they want it in dvd?

also do you know if you want it in 4:3 or in 16:9?
(just prevending you to make another thread about "Shooting Norm or Squeez for a workout vidoe?")
DPStewart said:
I'd say 24P is out because they will want a crisper, more fluid (realistic?) look, but I really hate the look of 60i video.
Click to expand...
if you already know this, why ask? looks like the only option is to shoot 30p:happy:

this is just me but I never shoot 30p. I always stick with 24p or 60i.
it's always an easy decision for me because if I want the filmic look I shoot 24p and if I want a cleaner/tv look I shoot 60i.
30p just doesn't really fit in any category for me....

anyway, either way you can't go wrong.
I'm sure no one will really care when they watch it. they just see what they see.:Drogar-Happy(DBG):
 
And why does Joshua hate 30p so much. I would think if you're going to end up on a DVD at 30fps, then 30p would look much better than the stutter you introduce with 24p !!!
 
You would never go to DVD as 30 fps if you have 24p material.

You may go to DVD as 60i, but you shouldn't. You should go to DVD as 24p.

But if you do go to DVD as 60i, you will introduce no "stutter" because of it. Unless your 24p was just shot poorly to begin with.
 
Yes go with 60i. Even though I hate it and you hate it, you can just de-interlace it in post. I personally use 30p quite a bit actually. I try to avoid shooting in interlaced but most of the time I am in 24pA. The only time I will use 60i is for news reports or shooting action sports like skating and biking. I used 30p for a documentary I shot last month and it looks the best I think because I did some test footage on my subject in 60i, 30p and 24p.
 
andythefilmer said:
Yes go with 60i. Even though I hate it and you hate it, you can just de-interlace it in post. I personally use 30p quite a bit actually. I try to avoid shooting in interlaced but most of the time I am in 24pA. The only time I will use 60i is for news reports or shooting action sports like skating and biking. I used 30p for a documentary I shot last month and it looks the best I think because I did some test footage on my subject in 60i, 30p and 24p.
Click to expand...
Thanks Mr. Junior...er...Senior member. :laugh:

I nearly always shoot 24P...so I actually don't have a lot of experience with the whole 60i vs. 30P thing.

I just guessed that there would be enough quick movement in a workout video (DVD) that 24P would show strobing/stuttering artifacts that the client would not dig.
I don't think they want the fast shutter/Private Ryan thing!

My beef with 60i is that it looks like "video" which I feel "can" look cheap.

I did a piece a while back for Special Olympics in 60i and I de-interlaced on export from Premier...I liked that result better that straight 60i, but was I wrong in feeling I lost some sharpness/resolution in the process?

QUESTION: Do you find there to be a difference in look between shooting 30P and shooting 60i and de-interlacing on export?
 
DPStewart said:
QUESTION: Do you find there to be a difference in look between shooting 30P and shooting 60i and de-interlacing on export?
Click to expand...

A huge difference, 30p will be far superior.

I guess I'm confused about who is running the show here. What is your client actually looking for? Is this for TV broadcast, DVD, or web?

24p/30p, either one will judder/stutter on fast movement FAR worse than 60i. 60i is great for sports/action. The TV nets that do use progressive for sports are using 720/60p, so even though it's progressive, it's 60 frames/second so you get fluid motion.

Hey, working with 60i sucks, I hate to work with it myself, but an exercise video for TV or DVD should probably be 60i, so gut it out.
 
Just thought I'd chime in. Not sure why 30p is seemingly so unpopular here. I have shot it many times for broadcast. I understand if you're looking to capture fast motion it may not be perfect. But, I've shot it on run and gun reality shows where you have little to no control over the lighting and it is a bit better. 24p is not good in low light. However, I think that 60i would look less professional for a work out video than 30p. 60i in a gym with potential bad lighting (unless you are lighting everything) can by ugly. Put some serious thought into lighting. That will make or break you.
 
JP, Tumbleweed, and Andy,

Thanks again for the input.

This is for DVD release.

The movement will be slower than a sporting event, but I might want to do relatively quick camera dollies and swings that would be just a little too fast for 24P.

It will be shot on a stage where I will have complete lighting control - so that's a plus.

I have requested your help because I need to minimize the last-minute decisions as best I can. I am going to try to do some test shoots, but I'm not sure how well I'll be able to simulate what the set and people will be like.
I am quite interested at this point in what the 30P look will be. Hopefully I can put some test comparison pieces up here real soon.

~Dane Paul
 
DPStewart said:
The movement will be slower than a sporting event, but I might want to do relatively quick camera dollies and swings that would be just a little too fast for 24P.
Click to expand...

See, that's the thing. Temporaly speaking, the difference between 30p and 24p is 20% more time samples. Usually, what's "bad" for 24p is going to be "bad" for 30p. The difference between 60i and 30p is 100% more time samples.
 
Joshua Provost said:
See, that's the thing. Temporaly speaking, the difference between 30p and 24p is 20% more time samples. Usually, what's "bad" for 24p is going to be "bad" for 30p. The difference between 60i and 30p is 100% more time samples.
Click to expand...

Thanks, that's a better way to frame it in my head.

So now the mystery is: is that small 20% increase enough to handle the motion we get?

I get to meet with the talent briefly next week and I'm going to rush a movement test on them and see what I get.

I'll be sure and post some 30p - 60i comparisons here as a resource.

~DPS
 
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