FS7: If you had to do it again, how would you do it, because we're going to do it...

W

walnutcrunch

Well-known member
Now that we've seen what cameras are on the horizon it looks like we're going to go ahead and purchase the FS7. We were evaluating the DVX200 against it (hoping to save money) but really the FS7 was much better for us. We're coming from an old launch AF100 and a stable of Nikon d800's. We have great nikon glass across the range and mostly do run and gun and wildlife.

So given that background and your experience, what would you do if you were buying an FS7 again?

We're tempted to get the kit lens with it plus an adapter for the nikon glass. Sort of leaning to the kit version, because for run and gun, some of the automated features would come in handy. When things get crazy, snapping in to some auto can be life saving.

So really our big choice is kit lens or not. Other choices are what we should add for shoulder usability.
 
FS7 is the best camera in it's category, especially for doc use. It's light, batteries run forever. It has Full Frame Vista Vision look (Speed Booster), Regular 35mm and 2x punch in which is super useful. BertLUT Arri Look gives it a very nice look.

I just got a Scarlet-W, but that's different uses. I'm keeping both cameras and I would buy the FS7 again without hesitation.

I would say Ursa 4.6K as it has a great look, but seems like a lot of problems to say the least.

The kit lens does not seem to be a hit. Many complaints about it.
 
Interesting about the lens. I thought it was pretty good quality.
I know it's not an entirely appropriate comparison but when we got the AF100 we purchased some of the panasonic lenses because they were supposed to be not bad and the electronic control seemed like a good thing...we've only used those lenses a couple of times. The difference between nikon glass and panasonic made it look like we were shooting with a different camera.
 
walnutcrunch said:
Interesting about the lens. I thought it was pretty good quality.
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The lens does have excellent picture quality, but it does have some shortcomings. First, it's only 28mm on the wide end, and that is not nearly wide enough for serious handheld work. So not a good run & gun lens. Second, the lens is only f/4 so not exactly an ideal lens for interviews or other shots where maximum shallow depth of field is desired. If neither of those shortcomings matter to you, get the lens. It is a nice lens for the price.
 
Doug Jensen said:
The lens does have excellent picture quality, but it does have some shortcomings. First, it's only 28mm on the wide end, and that is not nearly wide enough for serious handheld work. So not a good run & gun lens. Second, the lens is only f/4 so not exactly an ideal lens for interviews or other shots where maximum shallow depth of field is desired. If neither of those shortcomings matter to you, get the lens. It is a nice lens for the price.
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+1

I bought the 28-135 just to see if I'd ever really use it and I didn't, so I sold it.

Most used lens is the 24-70 2.8 II w/SB Ultra. Second would probably be the 100mm 2.8L IS Macro, which I absolutely love and the Sigma 18-35 next. For run 'n gun docu-style madness, the 24-105 w/SB does a better job than the Sony IMO. Wider, faster and IS for 1/3 the price.
 
To me the Canon 24-105 with speedbooster is a great combination for events and things like that. For corporate stuff I found my set of Canon lenses to work great and I have no need for anything else. As always make it as simple as possible.
 
I have the 28-135mm lens and Nikon glass (Zeiss & Nikkor). I love having the option of using both, the flexibility of using a par focal zoom lens on the Sony is handy (albeit not very wide) and when I want shallow DOF, i'll throw on the Zeiss. Sometimes I use the speedbooster, other times i'll use the MTF Nikon > E-mount adapter.

It's all about having options and with the FS7, that's exactly what I have. :-)
 
It seems the lens is a hard call. At slightly wider i think it would be a no-brainer. But then again, that balances against difficult focus that the Sony lens could automate over our nikons.
 
walnutcrunch said:
Now that we've seen what cameras are on the horizon it looks like we're going to go ahead and purchase the FS7. We were evaluating the DVX200 against it (hoping to save money) but really the FS7 was much better for us. We're coming from an old launch AF100 and a stable of Nikon d800's. We have great nikon glass across the range and mostly do run and gun and wildlife.

So given that background and your experience, what would you do if you were buying an FS7 again?

We're tempted to get the kit lens with it plus an adapter for the nikon glass. Sort of leaning to the kit version, because for run and gun, some of the automated features would come in handy. When things get crazy, snapping in to some auto can be life saving.

So really our big choice is kit lens or not. Other choices are what we should add for shoulder usability.
Click to expand...

I have found the kit lens unusable for run'n'gun work. While it is a 28mm lens on the wide side it is designed for a full sensor chip so your effective FOV is more like 42mm when you use the 1.5 x MM formula. And it's slow at f4, which helps for exteriors but somewhat debilitating on interiors. And even though it does have a wide barrel focus rotation, it is still a fly by wire so fast racks are frustrating.
For my money the Sony SELP 18-105 may serve you better. It too is fly by wire and literally impossible to ride focus but as a run'n'gun lens in auto mode, can be an asset. It is also an F4. With the 1.5 formula your effecitve FOV is 27mm on the wide end which is respectable.
The SELP is $600 and the kit lens is $2600. Just not worth the money IMO.
I too came into the shallow focus arena from the Nikon D800 so I have a pretty nice assortment of Nikon glass, which serves me well. There is that gap from the 24mm-70mm and the 70mm-200mm which is not being served, though I did get a Nikon 24-120, which is sweet but for some reason the focus and zoom barrel and totally reversed from the other lenses and it's almost impossible for me to use on the FS7. It now resides on the D800 where it is happy.
I use the Metabones Speeebooster for the Nikons and once I got the back focus adjusted, couldn't be happier. My FOV remains in tact and the added speed makes my lenses pretty true to their stop.
 
I've owned the kit lens for about one year now, It's been on my fs7 less than 10 times. I don't like the electronic internals of it much.

When, if ever, it gets used.... it goes on the a7s I have for a b camera.

I want to sell it, so I'll be happy to sell you mine for less than the cost of a new one, OP!


It's a nice lens, I just also have a set of canon zooms (24-105 and 70-200, both f4 used with speed booster) and a tokina 11-16 i use with the non optical metabones for the super wide shots. Nice little combo, it isn't perfect though...


Lenses are the last piece of the fs7 puzzle.
 
allenfacemire said:
I have found the kit lens unusable for run'n'gun work. While it is a 28mm lens on the wide side it is designed for a full sensor chip so your effective FOV is more like 42mm when you use the 1.5 x MM formula. And it's slow at f4, which helps for exteriors but somewhat debilitating on interiors. And even though it does have a wide barrel focus rotation, it is still a fly by wire so fast racks are frustrating.
For my money the Sony SELP 18-105 may serve you better. It too is fly by wire and literally impossible to ride focus but as a run'n'gun lens in auto mode, can be an asset. It is also an F4. With the 1.5 formula your effecitve FOV is 27mm on the wide end which is respectable.
The SELP is $600 and the kit lens is $2600. Just not worth the money IMO.
I too came into the shallow focus arena from the Nikon D800 so I have a pretty nice assortment of Nikon glass, which serves me well. There is that gap from the 24mm-70mm and the 70mm-200mm which is not being served, though I did get a Nikon 24-120, which is sweet but for some reason the focus and zoom barrel and totally reversed from the other lenses and it's almost impossible for me to use on the FS7. It now resides on the D800 where it is happy.
I use the Metabones Speeebooster for the Nikons and once I got the back focus adjusted, couldn't be happier. My FOV remains in tact and the added speed makes my lenses pretty true to their stop.
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This sounds like some seriously good advice. Taking a look at that 18-105. Interesting that you are in the same nikon lensing situation we are.
 
Wes. said:
I've owned the kit lens for about one year now, It's been on my fs7 less than 10 times. I don't like the electronic internals of it much.

When, if ever, it gets used.... it goes on the a7s I have for a b camera.

I want to sell it, so I'll be happy to sell you mine for less than the cost of a new one, OP!


It's a nice lens, I just also have a set of canon zooms (24-105 and 70-200, both f4 used with speed booster) and a tokina 11-16 i use with the non optical metabones for the super wide shots. Nice little combo, it isn't perfect though...


Lenses are the last piece of the fs7 puzzle.
Click to expand...

It seems run and gun lensing certainly is the problem. We do a lot of work on boats, scrambly outdoor areas and spots that are just a complete overall challenge for shooting. No wide side on kit lens was a negative, but having some auto and stabilization was on the positive.
 
I went for the 16-70z and it's quite okay for r&g. It has stabilization and AF. AF is quite slow but I guess it's a FS7 and not a lens matter. I could be longer than 70 but you can't have everything. I use it also for photo on a a6000/a6300 and it's great for the price. I heard the manufacturing quality should be spread and some people complained about soft and not so sharp images. I cannot confirm this, mine is excellent. PM me if you want a image sample
 
First off I'd recommend jailbreaking the FS7 grip so you can gain access to adult handheld options.

Sony patterned the FS7 smartgrip on the Cinegrips I unveiled with Juan Martinez at NAB 2012. Sony failed to incorporate a critical part of Cinegrip design - an extension arm that permitted rotation of the wrist and (meaningful) extension of the elbow. They then crippled things further by epoxying the grip to the extension arm, which made their mistake 'built in' preventing us from choosing from the array of rosette based handholding options.

So the FS7 is flawed for handholding which is well documented in the field. Ben Giles figured out how to fix the problem originally and shared it in a DVX thread.
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?336318-Alternative-to-using-the-grip&highlight=handgrip

Based on his jailbreak I made his method available commercially but wanted to create a version with a male ratcheting stud which was eluding me for awhile. It's all documented here. Along with my stupid early ideas.
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthrea...RRI-Standard-now-available&highlight=handgrip

Now just a couple weeks later they are in the field in the US, Berlin, London and Canada. (talk about demonstrating the value of a highly active web forum!)

You can pick up what I call the Sony Crony as DIY part or a full service retrofit performed at our Camera design shop in New Orleans. Here's the deal...

Sony does epoxy the 4 screws that attach the grip to the extension arm. Some shooters can get it apart, some can't. I charge $50 additional to perform the retrofit- send your grip and I turn it right around in a day or two. If you want to try separating the grip yourself - use a new #0 phillips screw driver. If you strip a scew- stop and send the grip to me. I charge $25 each for stripped screws numbers 2-4. Get it? If you strip one stop, send the grip in and I'll remove it gratis. But it's a pain to do, so only one free. Darwin charge levied for repeating the same activity!

For a quick purchase I set up a Shop on the Facebook link below. The male Crony is DIY $125/Full service $175. The female Crony is less. I also can add a rosette to the Sony Extension arm.
Or I'll email a Paypal invoice if that's easier.

I dont just make these things, I'm begging you to use them. I do this as a side business because I'm a shooter. I call this a silver bullet fix but it's worth it's weight in gold ;-) really.

IMG_5295.jpg .jpg IMG_5209.jpg
 
Osslund said:
To me the Canon 24-105 with speedbooster is a great combination for events and things like that. For corporate stuff I found my set of Canon lenses to work great and I have no need for anything else. As always make it as simple as possible.
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For a low-ish price (vs. something like the Fujinons), this is the best R/G combo going. For R/G, the Canon 24-105 f4 which becomes a 17-75 f2.8 is so great as f2.8 is key.

This is why IMO, the FS7 is the ultimate R/G camera. Speed Booster, Super 35mm and the 2x Crop (so useful) makes it the most versatile R/G camera around - neither C300 Mark II (which also lacks 60fps 4K) or F5 (no Speed Booster) can match this. It's like you have 3 lens choices for every lens. Incredible and super, super useful.

The arm is horrible IMO. My handle slips all the time so it's useless. I just attached a 15mm rod to my 501 PLong Manfrotto quick release and use a Rod and a Red Rock handle set in the middle of the rods. It's way lighter and more balanced than the Sony Handle so no need for any rig. I put a 1/2" inch skateboard riser between the camera and the Manfrotto plate and it's a perfect 85mm between rods and center of the lens.
 
Lenilenapi said:
If your handle is slipping you should contact Sony and get a replacement
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I'm past my warranty. Plus, I hated the arm so much I don't even want to use it anyways. It's pretty terrible in many ways - heavy, off balance, hard to put onto tripod. I'm way happier with just a 15mm rod and handgrip.
 
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