I REALLY need your advice on a purchase for an upcoming project...

M

Mabou

Active member
Hi all, I am in dire need of some great advice.

I realize that $6k is a paltry amount, but I have a new client that needs a product promotional video and the quality of the footage has to be incredible, especially in the jet-black shadow areas of the video (which is a major component of the creative direction of the piece). I have been researching the options for days (literally) and have yet to find the right solution. Every camera has strengths and shortcomings, and there are many tricks to tweak an image.

So my options (as I see it at this point) are....
1) I buy gear (external recorder) for my existing camera(s);
2) I need to do some whacky workflow (camera settings that work best for cleaning footage in post) that produces superb results;
3) I buy a piece of post gear or software,
4) or the answer could be that I buy a new camera.
Or a combination of the above.

I need to be creative with the purchase to get a camera/recorder that gives me 1080P, shoots pristinely clean video in the shadow areas, has no problems with moire (since I am shooting a refrigerator sized product that has many horizontal and diagonal details).

The creative concept for the video is this...
(Note that a camera that is on a motorized slider and shooting close-ups of Pieces and parts of the product),
the video will reveal the product through a series of closeups that consist of a completely black (no light) setting, as a light passes over an area of the product, that area briefly reveals in the light then as the light continues flying by (the light itself is not in the frame), the frame goes back to completely black. Repeat over and over again. So the Black Shadows (and gradients of shadow) need to be incredibly clean, and the video that is captured of the product needs to be crisp and detailed to show the fine texture of the product surfaces.

I own a Panasonic HVX 200 and a Canon 5D Mk II, I also have a variety of Canon L series still lenses.

I have looked at the Panasonic AF100, the Sony FS 100, the Canon 5D Mark III, and from an overwhelming amount of positive reviews, the Panasonic GH2.
I discovered that the 5DMkII and MKIII doesn't have clean HDMI out (which is really disappointing), so those are probably out.
Do you have any suggestions as to what camera and/or external recorder I can buy on this small budget that will give me the most quality at a reasonable price?

Thanks so much, I look forward to hearing your opinions.
Matt

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Do you HAVE to buy, or could you rent? If it's a one or two day shoot you could rent an amazing camera for a couple days and have quite a chunk of that 6K to put in your pocket.
 
This is the perfect situation to rent in. Depending on what your comfortable with, something like a Panasonic 2700 would give you all you need and more. If I was given these specs that would be my go to right off the bat. No one talks about the Varicam anymore which is a shame, because it is one hell of a camera and beats the pants off all the ones you have listed and probably anything up through Alexa/EPIC range of cameras. And even if you are in love with 35mm DoF, the 2/3" chips shouldn't even factor in because it sounds like 90% of your frame is going to be dark anyway.
 
Hi William and Gonzo,
Thanks for the replies.
I had considered renting, but unfortunately I have been working (successfully) in a technology vacuum. On my higher end shoots, I rent and hire a DP. I don't have enough experience with other cameras to come in cold for a rental and be confident that I can pull off a great shoot. I really need to play/experiment with the new camera and/or external recorder before the shoot. Also, this won't just be for this one project, I want to improve the overall quality of what I'm able to produce. On my last shoot (a cooking series) I ran into the dreaded moire of the Canon 5D Mark II for the first time. It stopped me in my tracks for feeling confident about using that camera on important projects.
Matt
 
Hmmm.... Just looked at the specs for the Panny 2700. Very impressive camera. But it immediately made me realize that all of the support equipment I own (jib, tripod, rig, matte box, etc) are all for smaller format cameras. Anyone got $100,000 that I can borrow? :-)
Matt
 
Do be honest it's not necessarily the camera, but the experience of the operator & crew.
You can get noise in the shadow detail with very expensive cameras as well if you don't know how to shoot and light the shot.

If I were you I would be testing how to pull the shot off with the gear you have access to.

All the Best!

Dave
 
Hi David,
True what you say about experience. But there is a massive difference between camera sensors, codecs, and workflow that affect the cleanliness of a shot. Especially in the most problematic area of shadow rendering. The 5D MKII for example, renders shadow/black areas as garbage. Partially the sensor, partially the codec, and partially the captured luminance and color space range. Another twist is that Adobe Premier does a better job at holding the quality of the shadow areas than FCPX because the 5D sees the full luminance spectrum (0-255) while FCPX only sees a smaller range (16 to something).

I am looking for a camera/external recorder that gives me the best quality possible in this price range. I know that I won't get the same quality as the higher end cameras, but there are some surprising technology advances with some of the pro-sumer cameras these days. The problem is, the matrix of options is a bit overwhelming and there are sneaky caveats in each option with only the voices of first-hand experience can being to light.
Matt
 
Of course David, that's the most important part.

I was reading this as a one off, if you need something for the future I'm sorry but I can't help you much there! I will hazard a guess that anything that is a proper video camera is going to actually work for you rather then a DSLR which seems to consistently work against you. I'll say, look into a program called Neat Video. It's only $100 and seriously works magic. It's fantastic and a tool I think everyone should have in their bag.
 
if noise in the shadows is what bothers you most, and you're not shooting scenes with lots of latitude, overexposing and then crushing the shadows should do the trick - try it on your 5D2, and if it works consider the 5D3 as a very similar aliasing/moire-free alternative with more detail and cleaner high-ISO
 
fs100 sounds about right for this. Very sensitive sensor since you want clean shadows. what's the prob with that cam?
 
If you can handle the workflow, rent a RED/Epic/Scarlet and operator/DP for this. Look at the blacks in the new Prometheus trailer... ask your client if that's what they're looking for. If yes, go for it!
 
why not use lighting creatively and dynamically at the lowest iso's possible. look at different lighting technologies such as LED vs tungsten. do some tests with your 5d. . these people are dreaming if they think they will get McLaren or Ferrari style production quality on a product promotion video costing 6k. however with the right approach you will get close. try using filters in Photoshop if needs be? these are a lot stronger than those in video editing software. granted there is a 500 frame limit. but thats still 20 seconds of footage per import. paying for a new camera/hiring a better camera, hiring a studio space, lighting, and all the rest will mean you will earn nothing from the job.
 
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