HVX200 National Spot - advice

M

Mulholland

New member
Hi,

Great forum - lots of great info. This is my first post so bear with me.

I am shooting a commercial for TV broadcast and we have decided to use the HVX200 because of the camera body size. I normally shoot 35mm film, so I have some questions.

- we are required to shoot in HD. Any reason not to shoot 1080 24p for TV?
- how is the mini-35 adapter?
- what shutter speed and settings give the most natural/smoothest looking feel?
- how are the low light performance and gain settings etc? some of the spot is at night.
- anything specific i should avoid or know before going in?

I know this is a lot of questions, so don't feel you have to answer all of them. i am just trying to get as much info as possible.

Cheers and thanks.
 
Use the search function on this site. You should be able to find the answer to all those questions and more.

HVX faq (to start off)
 
24P is not a good match for TV. You mention that you want the smoothest, natural image possible, so I would shoot 30P instead of 24P.

A shutter speed of 180 degrees is "normal", but for improved low-light performance, you could go higher, alot of people are using Barry's LOLIGHT scene file settings which use 230 degrees if I recall correctly. Of course, 24P would give you even better low-light performance because each frame gathers more light, but then you've got the issue of mixing cadences (unless you shoot 24P throughout).

If you use gain, keep it to a minimum, and stick with the B PRESS gamma curve, it is the least noisy.
 
Mulholland said:
Hi,

Great forum - lots of great info. This is my first post so bear with me.

I am shooting a commercial for TV broadcast and we have decided to use the HVX200 because of the camera body size. I normally shoot 35mm film, so I have some questions.

- we are required to shoot in HD. Any reason not to shoot 1080 24p for TV?
- how is the mini-35 adapter?
- what shutter speed and settings give the most natural/smoothest looking feel?
- how are the low light performance and gain settings etc? some of the spot is at night.
- anything specific i should avoid or know before going in?

I know this is a lot of questions, so don't feel you have to answer all of them. i am just trying to get as much info as possible.

Cheers and thanks.
Click to expand...

What are you shooting/ what is your budget?

I've shot portions of 6 spots that have aired nationally and we're all shot at 720pN/24p/30p/180 degree shutter.. It's all about personal taste. Never had a complaint.

1080 is interlaced. Hope that answers that question.

PS Technik is a great adapter.. But you will loose a lot of light, so be sure you have plenty of lights for your night shoot. Also, I would never use gain on this or any camera unless I was shooting a run and gun documentery.

good luck

Your best bet is to have someone that knows the camera on the job..
 
Why would anyone say that 24p is not a good match for TV? 90% of primetime shows are 24fps, the same goes for music videos and the such - same goes for national commercials - especially those that are targeted for theatrical. Every movie you see is also 24p... or 24 frames as NSTC...

I don't quite understand that comment -

Michael
 
Budget is good but time is a problem. Need speed and small camera size. People in cars is the subject matter. Low light, dusk, night and also bright day exterior. I'm trying to find the best combination of settings to get the most out of the camera. Noise needs to be low, sharpness and focus must be dead on.

Still leaning toward going with the hvx200 and 1080/24p unless someone can tell me a good reason not to. Storage and downloading are not a problem. Lots of P2 cards and people to wrangle the data. Mainly looking for a film like feel. Smooth and natural look and motion.
 
Mulholland,

You're getting some rickety information here. We shoot 24 frame (23.98) for SD and HD broadcast with the HVX in 720 24pN and 1080i 24p and 24pA regularly.

Barry's book and Adam Wilt's article will go a long way in helping you sort 2:3 and 2:3:3:2 (Advanced) pulldown and what's best for your project.

The HVX records 1080 24 and 30 frame progressively, though it resides in a 1080i field order.

e
 
Justin Marx said:
1080 is interlaced.
Click to expand...
The transport stream is interlaced, but the image from the camera is progressive.
MichaelP said:
Why would anyone say that 24p is not a good match for TV?
Click to expand...
If -- as he stated -- he wants the smoothest motion and this is for TV, then IMHO 30P is a better choice because it matches the NTSC TV broadcast standard. If you shoot 24P, you have to be much more aware of judder and control your panning and motion speeds. I'm not saying people don't shoot 24P for TV, but it should be done for a specific reason and not just because the camera is capable of it.
 
Mulholland said:
- we are required to shoot in HD. Any reason not to shoot 1080 24p for TV?
Click to expand...
No reason at all. It's ideal for that, especially since you said you regularly shoot 35mm film.

The only question is: how do you edit? If you edit on Avid, well, last time I looked at Avid it didn't have any way to edit a 1080/24P project *as* 24p, only as 60i. So if you're going with Avid you should choose 1080/24p. But if you're using any other editing system, definitely use 1080/24pA. FCP, Raylight, and EDIUS can all strip out the 2:3:3:2 pulldown so you can edit as a true 1080/24p project.

- how is the mini-35 adapter?
Click to expand...
Haven't used it on the HVX, but I used it on the DVX. Count on an overall ISO of around 40 when using that adapter.

- what shutter speed and settings give the most natural/smoothest looking feel?
Click to expand...
Smoothest looking filmlook? 1080/24p @ 180.0d shutter. You can minimize the strobing by using a slower shutter speed, but that makes it a tad blurrier too. If you want the "smoothest motion" possible, that'd be 720/60p but that would be "the video look", not "the film look".

For aiming towards a filmic look you can change the settings however you'd want, but I'd recommend starting with detail at 0 to -2, v-detail at 0, matrix at norm, gamma at cinelike-D, and master ped at -2 to -4. Adjust to taste from there; for a contrastier/lower-noise look substitute the B.Press or Cinelike-V gamma instead of cinelike-D.


- how are the low light performance and gain settings etc? some of the spot is at night.
Click to expand...
Raw camera is 320 ISO, gain is noisier than Monica Seles on the tennis court. Try to stick to 0dB, and make sure you've got enough light for adequate exposure and you'll get rich silky blacks. If you don't have enough light for exposure you're going to get some noise in your image.
 
The only adapter I would recommend in this scenario would be the Brevis which loses the least light but even then... going to be tough. Mini35 will need to be lit. In low light I would stay with cinelike V but dont hesitate to go with a 220 degree shutter angle, you gain about a stop that way and the motion still seems film like and natural.

If you HAVE to use gain, dont go over 6dB and make sure to boost the coring to help cover the noise. You are best to not use gain or keep it at +3dB MAX.

No reason at all not to use 1080/24P and I would suggest AVOIDING 30P in this case. If the commercial ever needs to be shown in a PAL country 30P to PAL is nasty...



ash =o)
 
I have used both the P&S and Movietube 35 adapters, from my experience I much prefer the Movietube.
The Movietube is very easy to set up, comes with a viewfinder, great handheld rig and great image.
I liked the image the P&S gave(seemed alittle bit sharper than Movietube) but its not that easy to set up, the camera set up seemed longer than the Movietube, and setting up for handheld is not friendly.
They are both very light hungry!
 
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