Hvx Pal V Ntsc

P

Portergold

Member
OK I admit it I am too lazy/busy to check previous posts on this forum about the differences between the two but I have a good excuse. At this moment in time Australia has a massive shortage on HVX 202's, so much so that I can find only one dealer who actually has one in stock so my question is this, what are the differences between the PAL version of the HVX and the NTSC? I can buy a NTSC version for over 2K cheaper with the added advantage of 60FPS compared to the PAL option of only 50fps, are there any other things I need to look out for to justify the extra expense of buying in Australia?

BTW 8 Gig P2 cards are as rare as rocking horse poo at the moment is this the norm in the US as well? (my dealer can't supply a bloomin 8 gig p2 card until end of July:crybaby: !!!)

JP.
 
Hello from another aussie. I definately agree with you on the excessive cost of products in aus, I myself purchased a NTSC cam from the states along with much of my other equipment. Be aware that you may (probably will) have to pay import tax (10% GST + 4.5% import tax if I recall correctly) so that will bump the price up a fair bit. You will have to pay import tax on anything more that a grand (don't quote me though).

I'm not sure what rebates are on at the moment with the cam but I'm pretty sure with the aussie deal you weren't getting the HVX book with it. Maybe you'll be able to get a 16gb card with the rebate soon?

Ian
 
Last time I checked about buying a Digital Video Camera from Expandore in Singapore (This was about 2-3 years ago admittedly) Customs told me that Digital Video Cameras were exempt from import duties. I'm not sure if this still stands, but I heard this straight from Customs. . . .

Also, when I was talking to my local authorised Panny dealer about buying a HVX, I had a brief chat to him about the option of importing a PAL model from Singapore and he gave me the low-down on what it's like to get a non-aussie bought HVX serviced at the Australian service centres. Basically, they give you unfair treatment. Their ideology is, if you aren't supporting Panasonic Australia, why should they support you. Your camera goes to the end of the line, and they don't work on it if there is a local customer in front of you. At the start of each week, your camera goes to the back of the line again.

I don't know about you, but this story alone has scared me off buying internationally. If something goes wrong with my camera, I need it fixed ASAP, I can't wait for a ridiculous amount of time. I'm a CPS member at the moment with Canon and that 5 day turn-around with a loan camera supplied has saved my butt a couple of times.

It may be worth asking your local dealer about servicing issues, or calling Panasonic direct before you make your decision.
 
I find the AU$2000 extra price difference over US prices to be a hard thing to swallow, not to mention the huge expense on peripherals. However I could put up with the price difference if they could at least supply me with a camera, and then even if I got a camera there is the added hassle of trying to procure a P2 card so I can use the bloomin thing!! AU$8500 plus AU$1000 for an 8gig card is a fair chunk of change to plonk down on the table just so Panasonic Australia can feel all warm and fuzzy! To top it all off I have just been informed I cannot even buy out of state, so that only leaves me with Queensland dealers to choose from.

The Canon XHA1 is starting to look more and more attractive at AU$5900.

JP
 
Portergold said:
I find the AU$2000 extra price difference over US prices to be a hard thing to swallow, not to mention the huge expense on peripherals. However I could put up with the price difference if they could at least supply me with a camera,.....
JP
Click to expand...
I ordered my cam at the end of March here in Melbourne...am still waiting as apparently an earthquake in Japan caused significant destruction to semi conductors or something...was told I could get it around end of May....

Will be interesting to see whether it comes...HVX202 is becoming somewhat of a mythical creature...
 
Good luck Mavoz, I was told mid to end of July!!! By then the new Sony Cam might be available as well, but knowing Sony it will be as dear a poison.

JP
 
Don't worry. The new Sony cam will be introduced @ IBC in September. You won't be able to buy it until early '08. Be then we will hopefully have 32GB Cards

Peter
 
Pros for NTSC

24P to match film FPS perfectly against PAL shooting at 25FPS. PAL for film would be shot 25fps and then slowing audio down by 4% and frame printing on a 24fps time base. Your film is then 4% longer, although this is standard practice in PAL countries.

720 24PN is around 40Mbits per second compared to 720 25PN which is 50Mbits [10 minutes NTSC on a 4gb card compared to 8 minutes PAL, both in 720PN]

60FPS gives you a greater slow down effect compared to 50FPS, BUT ONLY WHEN BOTH ARE PLAYED BACK at 24P. The effect at their respective frame rates would however result in the same effect [ie. 60 FPS played back at 30 is twice as slow as 30FPS; the same applies to 50FPS played back at 25FPS being twice as slow as 25FPS].



Cons for NTSC
24p or 30P has to be converted back to 25P if you are in 50Hz 25P PAL land [if you need to deliver PAL]

Lower image quality per frame compared to PAL due to the higer frame rate per second. Example - 1080p is NTSC is stored as 1280x1080 whereas 1080P in PAL is 1440x1080. The result is an image that is blown up horizontally by almost a 3rd in NTSC compared to an images that is less blown up horizontally as its almost a quarter.

Widescreen anamorphic has been doing this for years anyway, but we are talking HD so would you see the difference in quality... its up to you to decide...



For me its resolution and also being compatible with the country I am in - 50hz PAL land.


Majormorgan
 
Last edited:
Yeah i mean the difference between film at 24 and 25 i just can't believe is really that tangible, especially since 99% of british films are shot at 25frames.

People get this idea that film is only shot at 24 but no...
 
So let me ask a question that might have the simplest, most obvious answer thus showing my stupidity....
if with the frame rate hack you can shoot 25p with a NTSC version HVX....what's keeping anyone (and me) from using the NTSC HVX in PAL land? I can easily import into a PAL sequence in FCP....no? I will almost likely never use the HVX in standard def as I will use it for mixing footage with S16 and 35 thus shooting in either 720 or 1080 (using as a B camera).

(I just shot some sailboat racing for a bank commercial with the HVX and mixed the material with S16. the HVX stuff looks really nice. just the weather sucked and there was no wind to speak of.)


regards everyone,
Eric


majormorgan said:
Pros for NTSC

24P to match film FPS perfectly against PAL shooting at 25FPS. PAL for film would be shot 25fps and then slowing audio down by 4% and frame printing on a 24fps time base. Your film is then 4% longer, although this is standard practice in PAL countries.

720 24PN is around 40Mbits per second compared to 720 25PN which is 50Mbits [10 minutes NTSC on a 4gb card compared to 8 minutes PAL, both in 720PN]

60FPS gives you a greater slow down effect compared to 50FPS, BUT ONLY WHEN BOTH ARE PLAYED BACK at 24P. The effect at their respective frame rates would however result in the same effect [ie. 60 FPS played back at 30 is twice as slow as 30FPS; the same applies to 50FPS played back at 25FPS being twice as slow as 25FPS].



Cons for NTSC
24p or 30P has to be converted back to 25P if you are in 50Hz 25P PAL land [if you need to deliver PAL]

Lower image quality per frame compared to PAL due to the higer frame rate per second. Example - 1080p is NTSC is stored as 1280x1080 whereas 1080P in PAL is 1440x1080. The result is an image that is blown up horizontally by almost a 3rd in NTSC compared to an images that is less blown up horizontally as its almost a quarter.

Widescreen anamorphic has been doing this for years anyway, but we are talking HD so would you see the difference in quality... its up to you to decide...



For me its resolution and also being compatible with the country I am in - 50hz PAL land.


Majormorgan
Click to expand...
 
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