HVX look like 16mm ?

Jacquot said:
I guess that's my (redundant and now getting pretty tedious) point. Let's maybe drop this constant comparison and instead say "wow, that's fantastic video" or "wow, that's fantastic film." In the end, it makes video always seem like it's in the shadow of a bigger brother who, in reality, doesn't exist.
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Jacquot, I'm not sure you're really getting the point of the people aiming for a "film look". Speaking for myself, I love the typical "look" of film. And I loathe the typical "look" of video, when it is used in narrative works. In my perception, film most definitely is the "bigger brother" in whose shadow video lives. But film is more expensive and more difficult to work with, and that is the reason for being overjoyed when the HVX (or another camera) is able to produce images that come very close (and sometimes very, very close) to emulating the look of film. Yes, it's video, but it's video that looks a heckuva lot like film. And if that's what an artist is striving for, within his or her means, THAT is the point.
 
KMR said:
Jacquot, I'm not sure you're really getting the point of the people aiming for a "film look". Speaking for myself, I love the typical "look" of film. And I loathe the typical "look" of video, when it is used in narrative works. In my perception, film most definitely is the "bigger brother" in whose shadow video lives. But film is more expensive and more difficult to work with, and that is the reason for being overjoyed when the HVX (or another camera) is able to produce images that come very close (and sometimes very, very close) to emulating the look of film. Yes, it's video, but it's video that looks a heckuva lot like film. And if that's what an artist is striving for, within his or her means, THAT is the point.
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I do get the point. I really don't mean to belabor this issue, sorry. And I'm just being abstract, but film is film and video is video. The HVX is a very good video camera for the price. But film is still film, that's all. And video is video, that's all. Two ABSOLUTELY DIFFERENT mediums. Painting is painting, yes, but acrylic is acrylic, and oil is oil. Oil is more expense and more difficult to use than acrylic. Acrylic has more "contrast" and a different gamut than oil. The pigments in oil are so varied. Yes, it's all "painting" but different media.

If an "artist" is striving for film than they should use film. Oil painters are oil painters and acrylic painters are acrylic painters, both making a painting but with different media (and that's not even bringing in the substrate to play.) Neither try to be one or the other, nor do users of acrylic view oil as an example of something to emulate.

Anyway enough of this diatribe of mine. I know it's getting boring. :-Dum(DBG): For the record, I used to own a HVX. Now I have a Canon HV20, a small Panasonic 3CCD, and an old Sony 950. I also have a Super 16mm camera and some prime lenses. They're all wonderful tools. And the products that they produce are different. And that's what's great about them.

(If one has never used film, then there's quite a bit more to it than resolution, which seems to be the **big thing** in everyone's mind. There's the ergonomics of a balanced shoulder mount camera, the slow and calculated way of working, the purr (hopefully :happy:) of the motor and film running thru the mag, the film stocks to choose from and to manipulate, the grain, the threading of the mag, the tactile feel of the camera, etc.. And then there's the super convenience, inexpensive, easily acquired cameras and cost savings of video which makes it so very, very desirable. Although, as you know, high-end video production can be as expensive as film production.)

Okay, I'll shut up now....:smile:
 
Yes, oil is oil and acrylic is acrylic. But if the basic paint set for oils cost $1,000 and the basic paint set for acrylics cost $8, you can bet that there'd be lots of aspiring painters asking how to get their acrylics to look like oil. :thumbsup:

Point is, people who could afford film and want the film look should shoot film. People who can't afford film, and want the film look, are going to try other ways to get it. And it's not impossible, the HVX can be made to look extremely filmlike, so there's nothing wrong with the discussion.
 
Barry_Green said:
Yes, oil is oil and acrylic is acrylic. But if the basic paint set for oils cost $1,000 and the basic paint set for acrylics cost $8, you can bet that there'd be lots of aspiring painters asking how to get their acrylics to look like oil. :thumbsup:


Actually Barry, that is the case. A 45 ml tube of Lascaux cadmium red acrylic is 11.97USD while a 35 ml tube of Schminke Mussini cadmium red oil is 35.96USD.

(I got my MFA in photo/film and also painted while in school ...:happy:)

Oil paint gives depth of color and richness that is unsurpassed by any other medium but is inherently more difficult to work with... and expensive. But the majority of painters using acrylic know the medium and aren't trying to emulate something else (i.e., oil) They use acrylic not because they are wanting to use oil but can't afford it nor have the patience for it, but they use acrylic because of its own inherent qualities (gamut, etc..)

An interesting analogy perhaps (?).....

But look, of course I realize that if one is doing commercial work and/or needs to work under tight budgetary constraints, that video makes all the sense in the world. Or simply wants to do a lot of work instead of only one or two short films a year becasue of costs. But why always this comparing video to film? I just feel it's unnecessary. The original OP's question was "HVX look like 16mm film."

Who knows, someday in the future, as film fades from the horizon, we might be saying "Eeww, that looks just like film. It looks like cr*p compared to HD video." :Drogar-Happy(DBG):
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Because an overwhelming percentage of users want to make something that looks like a movie. Video doesn't. They can't afford film, so they're looking for the solution. It's simple, really. :)
 
Sensor size shold be a concern unless you're using a 35mm adapter.
16mm film is almost exactly the same diagonal as a 1/2" sesor.
Super 16mm gives you a little more diagonal but less than 2/3".
I've been told quite a lot that the footage I shoot on the HVX looks like 16mm, but I'm always shooting with a wide open aperture.
 
ProfessorU said:
Sensor size shold be a concern unless you're using a 35mm adapter.
16mm film is almost exactly the same diagonal as a 1/2" sesor.
Super 16mm gives you a little more diagonal but less than 2/3".
I've been told quite a lot that the footage I shoot on the HVX looks like 16mm, but I'm always shooting with a wide open aperture.
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No, actually. A 1/2" sensor is only slightly larger than Super8. the Super16 frame is also larger than a 2/3" sensor.
 
Postmaster said:
Have you ever tried vice versa?

If you play a tape or a DVD of a 35mm film a bit faster (and I live in a PAL country - so let´s say 35 instead of the 25 frames per second) all the 35mm magic is gone and it looks exactly like shot on a cheap homevideo camera.

Frank
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I know what you mean,
I've watched snowboard footage that was shot on 16mm at like 48 fps (probably telecined at 25fps) and sped up(in post), and as soon as it's sped up it loses the motion rendering that makes film look like film.... but instead it looked like a vx1000, minus dof and dynamic range.
 
Ran across this old form and thought I would put my two cent in. I shot with the HVX200a using the Redrock gear and Nikon Lens. I have had two friends that have had block buster films released and they thought what I did look like film so I now ask the question to my fellow dvxuser group does this look like film or video? As Barry said in the past, the camera (HVX) in the right hands make a huge differences.

Here are two clips from 'Night Forest' and one clip from ‘Prologue’ The clip from prologue is the last clip.

Oh one more thing - this is just raw footage from the camera with no color correction, or real editing. I threw in some music just to give it a nice feel. We haven't started the major editing.

http://coolpeoplestudio.com/films/sneaking up.mp4

http://coolpeoplestudio.com/films/don't worry.mp4

http://coolpeoplestudio.com/films/different.mp4
 
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