HPX3700 vs. HPX2700

J

Jacquesstar

Member
My buddy has an HPX3700 P2 Varicam.

He is considering selling it, since he mostly does motion graphics and never uses it. It's only been used a few times, it's in like new condition, and I could get a really good deal on it and a Fuji HD lens. Plus, he has the PS/Teknik adapter and a nice set of Zeiss Primes.

I am going to do a lot of two camera shoots this Spring, and I need matching P2 cameras that I can pair up using scene files. It seems like a wise buy, since along with my HPX370 P2 camera, I could be covering all formats and frame rates for a variety of clients.

I would be using this gear to shoot horseback riding, interviews, documentaries, nature, corporate films, some TV commercials, and the occasional sport event. Any reason why I should consider otherwise and buy a used HPX2700 instead? I know that the 3700 only goes up to 30 frames, but my HPX370 can shoot up to 60 frames, so I would be covered for those slo-mo shots (which I rarely do), and I could use the 3700 for everything else.

I also watched this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtRs7WQ2PBA

I am also involved in creating and delivering content to Nat Geo, much of which has been previously done on HDV. We are now using a combination of DSLRs and the Canon XF305 4:2:2 camera, but I would like to start using a 2/3 inch chip camera for the Nat Geo program production due to the better audio recording capabilities as opposed to a DSLR, where a double system is necessary for good audio, and the easier run and gun operation of the 3700 as opposed to the DSLR. The 305 provides master quality recording, but I need bigger chips due to the low-light shooting situations that we often encounter when on location. Is the 3700 currently used for any Nat Geo programming? I also do some work for the crew booking agencies with my current gear, and I would like to add a top-end camera like the Varicam to my arsenal. I could get a screamin deal on this cam from my buddy. So would owning a 3700 be a wise choice for me? Or should I look at a 2700?

I read that the 3700 is the "gold standard" for Discovery and Nat Geo programming.

And as always, your input is appreciated on this issue!
 
If the price is right I would go for the 3700 as it has true 1080 2.2meg chips and is a superb camera. Ok the 2700 has varicam up to 60fps but it is 720p anyway and the chipset is only 1meg per chip with max 1280x720 resolution.

Your 370 will cover your varicam needs anyway as you know and I personally now only use the 370 and the 3700 as they match pretty well, the 3700 is also a more current spec camera and also had 4:4:4 output to record to an external device.

I would also think that the XF305 would be more suited to matching the 370 and 3700 as all the shooting you do will be in the same resolution apart from variable frame rates which as you say you are like me you only use a few times a year.

Hope this helps.
 
Gary's comments are spot on, I would only add that the 2700 does a nice job of upscaling to 1080, and that both cameras need some TLC in dialing in a look.
A few hours with a Chroma duMonde chart will serve you well in this area. In fact, if you're experienced with Panasonic's menu structure you should be able to perform this in about 15 minutes (and of course, if you have scene file saved, it will only take a few seconds).

Let us know if you pass on the deal!

BTW, you mentioned low light capabilities, my rating on the camera with 180º shutter is about 320 iso.

Cheers.
 
I'd vote for hpx3100 - more sensitive, new is priced the cheaper than used 3700, less noise, true hd, 3ccd, WAY lighter comparing to 3700.
 
I have to agree with Tomas to a certain point, the 3100 has the same body as the 370 and if it works out cheaper new than a 3700 it also buys you five years warranty!

I would possibly hang fire as there is rumoured to be a new HPX500/370 replacement coming out this year but we shall see!
 
That's cool, but I am still going to go with this 3700. There will always be something new coming out, but I'm okay with that. HPX3100 is nice, but too close to my HPX370. I want to have Panasonics top of the line flagship camera instead. This is much like the F900R, but tapeless, which is great. I like variable frame rates, (which the 3100 does not have) and I definitely will use the 4:4:4 output. Plus, my buddy has a nice set of Zeiss primes to go with it. Won't be anything I can't shoot for a client with a 3700 and my HPX370.
 
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HPX3700 is a fantastic camera, albeit limited in off-speed and resolution options, but you know that. It IS a power pig, so keep that in mind. I've been seeing HPX2700's for $14K lately, so that's a great cam. for the money. If you can get into a 3700 for under $20K, that's a great deal.(Not including lens.)

The 3100 has lower power consumption, but no off-speed, only two card slots. When shooting docs, five card slots is great! 3700 is wonderful for green screen.

ISO on a 3700 or 2700 is very much dependent upon frame rate, shutter and gamma. Film-Rec at 600% will be less sensitive than HD Gamma.
 
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KINOKS said:
Really? Where did this rumour come from?:)
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It's only been around forever. Well it's not really so much a rumor, as it is the camera that everyone wants so badly, it just has to be around the corner or there will be torches and pitchforks.
 
Kolor-Pikker said:
It's only been around forever. Well it's not really so much a rumor, as it is the camera that everyone wants so badly, it just has to be around the corner or there will be torches and pitchforks.
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Torches and pitchforks :):)

Yeah, I've been writing passive-aggressive posts on different forums about a 500 upgrade for about a year now to. But I just thought that there is something new that I haven't already heard of...

If Panny doesn't come out with a new shoulder mount P2 camera within the price range of the Sony 350 or if they don't release a P2 camera with a S35 chip in the next year I'm switching camp.
 
I await a P2 camera with AVC Intra 100 and an S35 chip too, ENG style with a nice std lens at around £10k would be good too!
 
I feel the same way and I'd really want to stick with P2 media since that's what I'm already using and am used to. If Panny offered the 3100 as a complete kit and not body only, then we'd be talking.
 
Kolor-Pikker said:
I feel the same way and I'd really want to stick with P2 media since that's what I'm already using and am used to. If Panny offered the 3100 as a complete kit and not body only, then we'd be talking.
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+1

But it is a far stretch though... A 3100 with a CMOS sensor and a kit lens for 16k-17k and at-least 720 50p. That's what I'm waiting for. Or a S35 chip camcorder (not in a ENG body!) with P2, AVCintra and with a good picture (not like AF100 that fails in picture quality if you ask me)...
 
I think if I were after a non ENG style camera the canon C300 would be my choice rather than stick with P2 but we shall see what panny bring out this year.
 
I would wait until NAB 2012. You'll see some new cameras from everyone.

But, if you want to see something really just great, google the new Nikon D4. Holy Cow! Audio monitoring, much, much better video than the Canon 5D. HDMI uncompressed recording output. I'm dusting off my old Nikkor lenses. I might sell my HPX500. Also going to buy the new Panasonic 3D cam.
 
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KINOKS said:
Torches and pitchforks :):)

If Panny doesn't come out with a new shoulder mount P2 camera within the price range of the Sony 350 or if they don't release a P2 camera with a S35 chip in the next year I'm switching camp.
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I already switched camp - my beloved 2700 is gone, as is my MXF4mac not-inexpensive P2 workflow. To be fair the C300 is a better fit for what I do, and my back is already thanking me. But for an ENG-style form factor camera no complaints with the 2700. Bulletproof.
 
jw2700 said:
I already switched camp - my beloved 2700 is gone, as is my MXF4mac not-inexpensive P2 workflow. To be fair the C300 is a better fit for what I do, and my back is already thanking me. But for an ENG-style form factor camera no complaints with the 2700. Bulletproof.
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So you opted for a C300? That's a whole different beast compared to the ENG 2700. I wonder...what's to become of the 2/3 format in the future?
 
KINOKS said:
So you opted for a C300? That's a whole different beast compared to the ENG 2700. I wonder...what's to become of the 2/3 format in the future?
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I wouldn't worry too much about 2/3", looking at it from the side of practicality. A typical ENG lens can have an extreme zoom range equivalent to about 32~550mm (in 35mm FoV terms) and still maintain a constant aperture. And then there's size and weight - a portable lens shouldn't weight more than about 2kg, but if you wanted the same functionality and feature set as 2/3" lenses on a larger sensor, size would increase considerably.

The thing I keep thinking about on the subject of the C300 is the 8-bit codec. If you're shooting with a precooked look in camera, its not of much concern, but why add a Log gamma? Assuming the gamma curve in Canon Log is completely linear as in a stills camera, you'd be compressing potentially 12+ stops of dynamic range (however much the C300 can handle) into a codec that can only hold 8 real stops of DR.
 
Kolor-Pikker said:
If you're shooting with a precooked look in camera, its not of much concern, but why add a Log gamma? Assuming the gamma curve in Canon Log is completely linear as in a stills camera, you'd be compressing potentially 12+ stops of dynamic range (however much the C300 can handle) into a codec that can only hold 8 real stops of DR.
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This has been discussed alot. 10 bit would have been great, I agree. But judging from the videos that are popping up on the net that were shot with S-LOG there seems to be no problem.
 
I suppose there shouldn't be any problems, assuming you want a low-contrast look. Things like noise and compression tend to dither video anyway...
 
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