Hot Rod vs Vocas PL mount

M

metrospace

Active member
Ok, so I realize the whole PL adapter thing has been discussed and discussed here, but...

If choosing between the Vocas Pl adapter and the Hot Rod, which one would be better to use with a Red 17-50mm zoom, mounted on a Zacuto rail system (as well as an occasional Zeiss Super Speed, Red 18-85mm or Cooke 20-100mm, but mainly my 17-50mm)? Pros and cons of each in this set up?

Thanks
 
Have not seen the Vocas, but i own the Hot Rod and use the RED 17-50mm and 50-150mm and I love the Hot Rod adapter. It is top notch.
 
I've seen them both, and I have a Vocas. They're both excellent products and there's nothing wrong with either. But to me the Vocas is more flexible because it has the ability to dock/undock the camera to the rails system, without being "permanently" mounted to the rails. You can pull the AF100 out of the Vocas rig by your fingers, no need to go out getting allen wrenches and unbolting the whole rig. And I think that's the beauty of an AF100 -- it's a small, lightweight camera with multiple flexible lens mount options, so why trap it on rails all the time? What about when you want to pop it off of there to use your Lumix or Nikon lenses or whatever? Instant access is my favorite feature of the Vocas, and the additional benefits of it being less expensive and extremely well engineered and well built, are why it's probably my favorite PL adapter on the market.

Again -- not taking anything away from the Hot Rod at all. Just pointing out an additional capability the Vocas offers, which I find very handy and wouldn't do without.
 
I have not used the Vocas, but I have the Hot Rod PL mount. It is not permanently mounted to the rails and you don't need Allen wrenches to remove it. You can choose to use the lower PL support or not. I have my own support I can slide in or out of place as I choose. And the fit and finish of the Hot Rod PL mount is great. I have mounted a variety of lenses to it without a problem, including the Cooke 20-100 you mentioned.

Good Luck!

Dave
 
Has anyone compared either of these with the Letus PL mount? It seems to be the only one out there with adjustable back focus (vs. factory fixed, or shims). Is the back focus really necessary? Can anyone speak to the quality of the Letus?
 
Steve R said:
Has anyone compared either of these with the Letus PL mount? It seems to be the only one out there with adjustable back focus (vs. factory fixed, or shims). Is the back focus really necessary? Can anyone speak to the quality of the Letus?
Click to expand...

I have zero experience with the Letus PL mount. As to your question is back focus necessary... Adjusting a mount without knowing if your lenses are in spec is like chasing your tail. With PL mount lenses, collimation should be bench checked on each lens to make sure infinity focus is correct. The lenses are half of the equation, the mount is the other half. If your focus marks are off after your lenses have been collimated, then it's time to adjust the PL mount. If you are in a production with a 1st AC taping marks and pulling focus, or renting your gear then I would make sure everything is collimated properly. If you are working solo and pulling your own focus from a monitor rather than viewing witness marks against a tape, than it's not likely as big a deal if the lens marks are a little off.

All the Best!

Dave
 
The top-mount support of the Letus is interesting. If you don't use rails it might be a good choice, and the price is good. But i couldn't imagine using a long lens without rails. I prefer the Vocas or Hot Rod support. And it sounds like both of those can be used with or without their rail support.
 
Steve R said:
Has anyone compared either of these with the Letus PL mount? It seems to be the only one out there with adjustable back focus (vs. factory fixed, or shims). Is the back focus really necessary? Can anyone speak to the quality of the Letus?
Click to expand...
I have used a prerelease version of the Letus. To compare it against shipping products would be unfair, so ... until there's a shipping version (or, if it is shipping, until I get a chance to see the final finished version) I wouldn't attempt to compare them.

However, as said, yes, the Letus has adjustable "back focus". It is a blessing and a curse, depending on why you're adjusting it. Ideally, you should never be adjusting the mount distance. If you are constantly adjusting it, you're doing something wrong. The adapter should be positioned in exactly the right spot, and then stay there forever.

The Vocas comes pre-shimmed for the exact right distance. All my PL lenses work perfectly on it with focus marks exactly and precisely where they should be. I expect the Hot Rod comes the same way. And while it's not adjustable (easily), that's really how you want it to be -- you want it perfectly collimated and then to never ever change. If for some reason it was "off", you could "shim" the Vocas or the Hot Rod to return it to the precise distance. That adjustment is not easy, and there's a good argument to be made to say that it shouldn't be easy -- it should be something that is rarely if ever done.

For those who want to do it, the Letus does it, in the same way that it does for the Letus Ultimate (and, basically the same way the Red One does it). Micro-tiny threads inside, and you loosen the mount and rotate it so that it will go closer or further away, in fractions of a millimeter, and then you tighten it down again. You'd want to tighten it really, really tight though; slipping or accidental misalignment can really ruin your day (and all your shots).

The Letus has another unique aspect to it in that it can be supported, while still not using rails. It has a hook that lets it hang from the top handle, instead of being bolted onto a rails support. That aspect is pretty neat. I'd probably only use it for a lighter lens (sure wouldn't try a six-pound lens hanging from it, and definitely not a Red 18-85 or Cooke 18-100!) but for lightweight use it's pretty darn clever.

And, I'm not sur e on Letus pricing, but I think it's supposed to be substantially less expensive than the others. Certainly it's the least-expensive mount with user-adjustable backfocus; the only other one I know of is the new Ciecio7, and that's $1500.
 
Barry_Green said:
I'm not sur e on Letus pricing, but I think it's supposed to be substantially less expensive than the others.
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http://www.letusdirect.com/cart/ag-af100-gear/

I'm considering the Letus specifically because it doesn't need rails for moderate primes. Saw one at CineGear, & was surprised how secure the mount felt. There was a good sized prime attached, & I tried flexing the flange, but it would not move. Meanwhile my Olympus 14-35 can easily flex the AF100's flange.

Best,
Bern
 
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Bern Caughey said:
http://www.letusdirect.com/cart/ag-af100-gear/

I'm considering the Letus specifically because it doesn't need rails for moderate primes. Saw one at CineGear, & was surprised how secure the mount felt. There was a good sized prime attached, & I tried flexing the flange, but it would not move. Meanwhile my Olympus 14-35 can flex the AF100's flange pretty badly.
Click to expand...

Yeah, nice to have the option to mount the lens and a clamp-on matte box with no rails.
 
Barry_Green said:
I've seen them both, and I have a Vocas. They're both excellent products and there's nothing wrong with either. But to me the Vocas is more flexible because it has the ability to dock/undock the camera to the rails system, without being "permanently" mounted to the rails. You can pull the AF100 out of the Vocas rig by your fingers, no need to go out getting allen wrenches and unbolting the whole rig. And I think that's the beauty of an AF100 -- it's a small, lightweight camera with multiple flexible lens mount options, so why trap it on rails all the time? What about when you want to pop it off of there to use your Lumix or Nikon lenses or whatever? Instant access is my favorite feature of the Vocas, and the additional benefits of it being less expensive and extremely well engineered and well built, are why it's probably my favorite PL adapter on the market.

Again -- not taking anything away from the Hot Rod at all. Just pointing out an additional capability the Vocas offers, which I find very handy and wouldn't do without.
Click to expand...

Barry, you are confusing the Hot Rod PL with the Solid Camera brand bolt-on mount. The Hot Rod PL has always been click-in and 100% tool-less in operation, and can be used without the support since the system was invented in early 2009, before the GH1 was ever released.


In case anyone else is confused- the Hot Rod PL Tuner Kit Support Chassis mates to the original (and unique) mounting system of the Hot Rod PL which is not matched (or copied) by any other company. This allows the user to switch between lens mounts adapters withouts tools, and gives the user an entirely unobstructed front of camera, unlike the before mentioned Vocas. This is also true of the original Hot Rod "Central Support" which is designed for DSLR sized cameras.

When engaged properly, the Hot Rod Support Chassis is automatically aligned to exactly the correct height adjustment (which is of course the only place you ever want the PL mount supported). Mounting at any other height, which is possible with nearly all of my newfound competitors, begins to cause wear and/or damage to the original camera mount.

Repeated use of a PL mount support that is prone to misalignment (or that is actually misaligned without the users knowledge) will, especially over time, wear and/or bend the original camera mount. When this happens, should the user attempt to use a native mount lens or an un-supported adapter, the amount of image shift the user will experience when focusing or zooming a lens (or even just handling the camera) can be extreme!

Fortunately for Hot Rod Cameras, we've got 2 solid years of experience on anyone building PL to HDSLR mounts, and probably have clocked more hours doing stress tests and figuring out how to make major DSLR mounts fail.

As an aside, one competing brand's support (I'm not naming names) is woefully inadequate- at a design level. Undoubtedly this will be discovered at some point and be posted on-line by someone (probably sooner rather than later). I'm not going to point out the specific problem, as I don't want to give them any more help.

What people reading this might find interesting is that many of us who build originally-designed equipment (vs. the companies who's business model is based on churning out clones) are quite professional, friendly and talk frequently with one another. I receive the tip-off about nearly all of my PL mount competitors from other 3rd party manufacturers, resellers, and even the camera manufacturers. Outsiders might perceive these 3rd party manufacturers also as "competitors", but really that's not the case. A lot of us play nice together, it's unfortunate that there's also a fair number who do not.

What most of my new legitimate competitors will very shortly realize is that the market for PL mounts is far smaller than they think. Especially the market for a less expensive mount which generally features "deal-breakers" for professional users; the people most likely to be using PL mount glass in the first place.
 
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