Help with wirless microphone system?!

[ThreeD]

We recently bought the Canon HV20 and we're looking for a wireless microphone system to use along with the camera.

We will be interviewing people, doing some presentations etc and we will at some point use several microphones at the same time. From this point on we're lost. We've looked at some AKG wireless systems, to be more specific the AKG WMS40 Pro Sports and it seems to do what we're looking for.

We've also read a lot of good things about Sennheiser, but if we're publishing on the web, do we really need top notch microphone quality?

These microphone systems can be hooked up to the external audio plug on the HV20 right? We may need a 6.3mm to 3.5 mm jack converter?

Could someone please explain with a few words what the channels and frequencies are all about? Does one channel only allow you to use one microphone?

If anyone has any other suggestions for great wireless microphone systems, please let us know. What about Audio Technica? Sennheiser?

Thanks all

 

[x002657]

My 2 cents (in 1967 dollars)

My 2 cents (in 1967 dollars)

Not to be disrespectful, but the questions you pose indicate a strong need to do some reading before posing such a broad question. Despite that, here's my 2 cents. (It's not meant to be offensive, though it may read as if it is; just remember that "one size does not fit all").

We recently bought the Canon HV20 and we're looking for a wireless microphone system to use along with the camera.

Good for you. May you never lose your focus.

We will be interviewing people, doing some presentations etc and we will at some point use several microphones at the same time. From this point on we're lost. We've looked at some AKG wireless systems, to be more specific the AKG WMS40 Pro Sports and it seems to do what we're looking for.

You can probably expect a variety of replies about this; for interviews, some folks prefer to not run the risk of interference that you can encounter with wireless sytems and recommend wired mics whenever possible for interviews; others prefer the freedom of mobility that wireless offers. IMO, you really need to assess your needs and the situations you'll most frequently encounter.

We've also read a lot of good things about Sennheiser, but if we're publishing on the web, do we really need top notch microphone quality?

Without a doubt, Sennheiser's are highly rated and very popular among folks here. I myself lean towards A-T, but I make no bones about not being an audio engineer...heck not even what I'd label an audio technician. (So take my comments with a grain of salt, but A-T works for me).

Also, do you ever expect to produce anything for other-than-web use? If so, do you want to make another investment in mics at that time? (Every time I consider buying a new mic and get tempted by a lower price or lesser grade, I remind myself of the cliche that "audio is half the picture". Generally, web video is lowered res anyway...do you want to do the same to your audio?

These microphone systems can be hooked up to the external audio plug on the HV20 right? We may need a 6.3mm to 3.5 mm jack converter?

Unfortunately, Im not familiar w/this cam. My cam (an HVX) can accept 2 XLR feeds. Sometimes I use only 1, sometimes both, sometimes straight-in, other times through a mixer...depends on the job/shoot.

Could someone please explain with a few words what the channels and frequencies are all about? Does one channel only allow you to use one microphone?

This is where you should do some reading on your own. It could easily take a lengthy post to convey enough useful info on these subjects.

If anyone has any other suggestions for great wireless microphone systems, please let us know. What about Audio Technica? Sennheiser?

I have an A-T 1800 system. Got it only very recently, and have only used it on one full-day shoot. Thus far, I've been happy with it, but sitll learning how to make best use of some of the features.

Thanks all

You're welcome. (Though I suspect I've provided little useful help towards your dilemma).

Good luck, but, really, you should do some reading on your own to get a better grip on what you need, and the advantages/disadvantages of using either wired or wireless in your situation.

x

 

[ThreeD]

thanks for your reply x002657 I understand that you're saying we should do some reading before we post this kind of thread, and believe me - we have been doing plenty of reading. We've tried to Google for audio 101, frequencies and channels, wikipedia and we couldn't find any useful website with the right information.

We're complete newbies when it comes to audio. I have a couple of audio magazines here, but they don't tell us a whole lot. If you have a website link where I can do some reading I'd appreciate it.

What exactly did you mean with the "May you never loose your focus?" comment? hehe we're always going to use a tripod if you're referring to the camera stability.

Would we have a problem with interference on wireless mics if we buy a receiver with multiple frequencies? From the reading I have done I understand that changing the frequencies will reduce interference.

For our type of filming, interviews and presentations wires only seem like an extra hassle, so wireless is probably a better alternative for us. Again, we're audio newbies so we really have no clue how much interference we're talking about here.

Thanks again for your reply x00, appreciate your feedback.

 

[ptalsky]

Okay, first, to echo what x002657 said, I don't mean to sound rude, but your questions for the most part have been addressed many times in this forum. Before searching on Google, etc., I strongly recommend you use the search option above.

That being said, I'll give you the quick and dirty summary of what you will find:

First, wireless should always be your last choice. Even when you purchase the best wireless sets. Now, as you push into larger projects, quite often you will find that you use a boom as primary audio, but wire up all the actors anyway and record each microphone on an individual track on an external recorder.

Second, many people refer to wireless when they are really talking about a lavaliere microphone. You can get wired lavalieres that can plug directly into a camera (presuming it has phantom power - I don't know your camera at all). There are many good choices of lavaliere microphones that can be wired in such a way. If you're thinking long term, once if you decide on a wireless kit - you get your lav wired for that kit and get an adapter that enables it to go wired. Generally, here's the thoughts on best lavalieres:
1. Sanken COS-11
2. Countryman B6
3. Countryman EMW (best value)
4. DPA (can never remember the model number)
5. Countryman B3
6. Sennheiser MKE2 (NOT ME2/ME4)
This is very subjective - I'm sure others will prioritize differently. But, many mixers, myself included, have a wide variety of lavalieres in our bag of tricks, as each one has a different list of benefits.

Third, wireless kits are not alike. The general consensus here is that the Sennheiser G2 series is the lowest cost option that captures acceptable (not decent, not good, not great, acceptable) sound. The best is Zaxcom - they will cost you around $4,000 for one Tx/Rx combo (not including lav). The next best is the Lectrosonics 4xx series - pricing varies depending on the models, but you can get an R400a+LM tx for about $1,100. Then, much further down the list, is the G2.

As to whether you need a good wireless kit or not, first, see above. You probably don't need wireless at all. As far as other brands go, I have an AKG kit (as well as a Shure kit) and I would say, don't bother. They are not very good. Do you really need to spend more because your projects will only be shown on the Web, that is entirely up to you. You can still render for very high quality for Web-based projects - and if you're ultimately going to Flash, I would certainly want to have the best and highest quality of audio available as the source for my Flash conversion. But, that's just me, and I have a lot of pride in the work that I do.

Finally, frequency agile wireless systems are an absolute must. There are lots and lots of people using the wireless airwaves and frequencies for different purposes (including those pesky television stations, darn them). If you are using a fixed frequency wireless system, and you encounter someone else on your frequency, you are (pardon the expression) SOL. With frequency agile systems, you can simply retune to another frequency and go on your way, recording to your hearts content. As far as which frequencies work in your area, both Sennheiser and Lectrosonics have great frequency charts on their Web sites where you can look up your specific city and determine what is available and what is not.

Anyway, just because I took the time to write up this long post does not relieve you of the burden of doing a search here and reading in greater detail on this topic.

Phil

 

[ThreeD]

thanks for the great reply to you also, Phil. First I want to say that I couldn't agree more with your signature, that's why I followed the instruction in x002657's signature Just kidding.. hehe

I did actually do a search for "wireless microphones" on this forum before I started this thread, but I couldn't find any similar threads that answered my question so I started my own. Pardon if that wasn't the right thing to do

As you stated, wireless should always be our last option, so we're going to look for other solutions as well and see what we can find. BUT, if we end up with a wireless solution we'll definitely go for a solution where the frequency can be changed.

We will do some more searching to find more information on the various questions we posted up top, but thanks for the summary you've posted Phil. It gives us a good pin pointer as to where we should start our search to find the best solution for our current and future needs.

thanks again to you both, appreciate the time you've taken to answer our questions.

 

[Sirocco]

I've been using the Senn G2 wireless for few months, doing interviews in all kind of situation. So far the system has worked flawlessly. I would recommand it if the $500 price is affordable for you. Have fun with your project.

 

[x002657]

What exactly did you mean with the "May you never loose your focus?" comment? hehe we're always going to use a tripod if you're referring to the camera stability.

I took your post to mean that you purchased your camera just recently. That was really just a "Good luck with your purchase." I don't know the cam, and there are no hidden meanings in my comment. It was just a good-natured "Good luck".

Would we have a problem with interference on wireless mics if we buy a receiver with multiple frequencies? From the reading I have done I understand that changing the frequencies will reduce interference.

Here, I refer you to Phils' first point. Problems due to interference are often unique to the set or location. I have heard at least 1 story in one of the popular forums of people who had fine wireless reception in the middle of a big city, yet would stumble across interference in an open field with no buildings between the trans and receiver. But, if you're determined to go wireless, prevailing wisdom seems to be that you should get the best you/your budget can afford.

To reiterate, interference isn't limited to just a couple of freqs. It can come from a variety of sources, and the sources can change from set to set. I just recently got an A-T 1800 dual-frequency full diversity receiver, with 1 bodypack and 1 plug-on transmitter. (Google A-T 1800 for specs). So far, I haven't had freq trouble, but I've only used them once, and in fact bought them specifically, for a recent job in mid-town Manhatten. They worked fine. But, not to be a wisea$$, if you limit yourself to one frequency, well, I think lots of folks here might think you're limiting yourself pretty much. (Frankly, I don't even know if single-freq receivers are available today).

For our type of filming, interviews and presentations wires only seem like an extra hassle, so wireless is probably a better alternative for us. Again, we're audio newbies so we really have no clue how much interference we're talking about here.

Wires may seem like an extra hassle now, but consider the hassle (not to mention the embarrassment) if you're on a job and either can't get a good wireless signal, or the audio turns out so bad in editing that you must re-shoot (if the interviewee is even available to do that).
Not knowing the specifics of your filming, the best I can offer here is that, with wired even the possibilities of interference are reduced, but still not eliminated. Example: a recent job (a stage performance) required 7 mics. We ran nearly 500' of cable for 5 of the mics, and used only 2 wireless. the producer was adamant about wired sound, but had no choice but to relent on the 2 wireless. That was because the 2 wireless mics were being traded among performers backstage between scenes. (Though wired can still have problems from other sources, e.g. fluorescent ballasts, bad grounds, etc. Despite those possibilities, it's my understanding that they are usually fewer than frequency interference).
But, I'll echo Phil yet again: wireless should be your last choice. When I first started buying equipment, I went for nearly 2 yrs using only wired before I bought a wireless system. They have their place, and many are decent to quite good, but they still can't match the reliability of a direct feed.

Hope this helps.

 

[ThreeD]

Thanks Sirocco, $500 is definitely doable

x002657 - I wasn't sure if you're being a tad sarcastic because I've heard people complain about the stability of the HV20 when shooting in HDV mode Thanks for your good luck wishes though, we will need them hehe.

Also thank you for clearifying things a little for us. Our budget is around $700-$800 for the sound equipment, we don't really know how far that will take us. We've looked around and found a couple of decent (or should I say what looks decent to us) solutions that hopefully will give us decent results.

A local shop here is actually selling single-freq receivers, believe it or not. They go for around $150, but we'd get atleast a 3 freq receiver based on what you've written here.

We won't be doing any shooting in one specific place, more of moving around. We'll be doing a lot of different presentations and close-up interviews. I'm glad you sort of "introduced" us to the pro's and con's of the various systems with great examples, makes it a lot easier to understand for audio "novices" like us

We'll be looking around for a few more solutions before we make a final decision. We're not really in a hurry so I think it's important that we do enough research before we go out and do some $ spending.

Thanks again for your help, appreciate it a lot.

 

[ptalsky]

ThreeD-

Remember that the $500 budget for a G2 system is with the stock mic, which is really unusable/sounds terrible. You will need to add about $200 more for a decent mic (like the Countryman EMW). Also, when buying the mic, make sure it is plugged correctly for the G2.

BTW, definitely look at used equipment. I've gotten some great deals that way.

Phil

 

[Lwormack]

We recently bought the Canon HV20 and we're looking for a wireless microphone system to use along with the camera.

We will be interviewing people, doing some presentations etc and we will at some point use several microphones at the same time. From this point on we're lost. We've looked at some AKG wireless systems, to be more specific the AKG WMS40 Pro Sports and it seems to do what we're looking for.

We've also read a lot of good things about Sennheiser, but if we're publishing on the web, do we really need top notch microphone quality?

These microphone systems can be hooked up to the external audio plug on the HV20 right? We may need a 6.3mm to 3.5 mm jack converter?

Could someone please explain with a few words what the channels and frequencies are all about? Does one channel only allow you to use one microphone?

If anyone has any other suggestions for great wireless microphone systems, please let us know. What about Audio Technica? Sennheiser?

Thanks all

I recently bought a Panasonic P2 camera and I have the same delima. The camera package came with a wireless receiver and transmitter. The P2 camera has 2 XLR inputs for sound (I learned what this was today) and I discovered that the wireless system that I inherited (they gave me "what I needed"..not!!).

I found a company "Studio1 Productions" in Florida which manufactures sound mixing devices for audio applications, vidio cameras specifically. In the job that I have coming up I have a lot of different situations to manage. I have to capture sound from podium presentations, from interviews, and possibly from speakers from a microphone responding to what presenters have said.

A possible solution. The XLR Mix Pro ..thing.. accepts two XLR inputs and 2 1/8 " male inputs from my wireless system. Case solved. I clip this XLR Mix Pro device on my belt and attach the wireless receiver to one of the two 1/8" inputs. The remaining mixer input slots are free for 2 microphone inputs. I can select one or more of these inputs to be mixed as "one feed " into my camera input2. Input 1 on the camera can be reserved for input from a shotgun microphone.

Hope that this helps you resolve a possible way of wireless sound input. There are probably easier ways to solve my problem..perhaps purchasing a wireless system with XLR inout.. Can't cry over spilt milk..I just didn't know. The DVX forum has been very helpful in learning "gently usually" about next steps. Good Luck. Hope This helps.

 

[ThreeD]

thanks Phil, I'll look around and see what I can find.Thanks for the warning about the stock mic, I'll check out some other alternatives.

Lwormack - I'm thinking about buying an XLR - minijack converter in order to get XLR options. The HV20 doesn't have an XLR jack, only the 3.5mm minijack From what I understand the sound will be A LOT better if you have XLR. The question is if I'm going to need a mixer with that? Or can I plug the mics/receivers directly into the converter?